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eskielover · Oct 25, 2009, 06:05 PM

(((((Tomi))))),
I get so frustrated with my computer....had my reply mostly written & somehow, windows sends my cursor off to never never land & then all of a sudden, I hit a back space or something & poof....the whole thing is gone......grrrrrr.....so here we go again....& again....when I tried to post it, it came back that I wasn't logged in GRRRRR!!!! at least I saved what I wrote, but it had all those funny characters in it that I had to delete.....so finally:

I am so glad you decided to write our your thoughts & emotions about this after we chatted Thursday night.....it's important to get them out so that they can be sorted through & realize what is realistic &; what expectations we are placing on others .....a chance to really analize the thoughts.

This has brought out so many thoughts & feelings that need to be looked at logically rather than emotionally (not an easy thing to do after experiencing such a shocking situation) but it's the best way to pull ourselves through situations like this.

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but the tragic way his life ended and the reasons are beyond my comprehension.

It was so obvious what he had done to himself

Regardless of what I thought of the dead man, it's a loss of life! This man touched other people's lives! He was given the resources he needed to handle the problems he was having... and yet, he chose to end his life!!! WHY???? He had those he could have reached out
to, he had ways out of the problems he had!!!

How can anyone feel so hopeless over what seems to the rest of us a completely solvable problems???

The mess he left behind... emotional, mental and physical ... I can't wrap my brain around it!

The other night you suspected that he must have gotten some medical information about his health that drove him to this point....not sure if you have more information about the "Why?" than you did that night, but there had to have been some knowledge that he was given to make him feel so hopeless.....some thoughts....living alone...no family or friends......say a he got information at his age about cancer, or alzheimers, or even dementia. Fear of suffering or having to deal with these things alone could definitely create a fear that could possibly take him to this place in his life (not saying it's right by any means.....but one can only grasp the fear & hopelessness of a condition like that)

You can guarantee that he had to have felt that he wasn't capable of using any of the resources that might have been available for any of the possibilities let alone wanting to live through whatever it might have been even with resources. It is obvious that the perception of others wasn't anything close to what was going on in his own mind. It had to be very strong thoughts in his mind to have taken him to this point...especially being all along with no one to talk it over with.

Remember in his mind, he only left behind the pain & suffering that he didn't want to deal with....any emotional, mental, & physical mess left behind was that of those who had to deal with what happened. Suicide is selfish no matter how it's looked at. The person doesn't have any concern with those who are left or what they have to go through....the only thing on their mind is escaping what they don't want to live through.....that is all they care about or they wouldn't take their own life & leave anything for others to clean up after....that was no concern of his.

Now lets look at the reactions of others to the situation, remembering that this was not a normal death....but a traumatic ending of a life which leaves all feeling very uncomfortable in the first place let alone able to come up with the right words to say or even express all the feelings they are going through.......but we have to also look at the personality of the person who you are having the most trouble with. Put the picture into perspective....look at it logically not emotionally.

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The man and his arch enemy lived next door to each
other. The arch enemy was heard to have said "Well, thank goodness,
that's one less problem for me." OMG!!! How can anyone be so cold!!!

I thoroughly dislike the "arch enemy" and this didn't help matters any with MY problems with him!!

I know that *I* am another one of his "problems." Not that I cause any, but it's that he's constantly causing them for ME!! I know that hate is a strong emotion and for the most part, a waste of time and energy... but for right now, I have determined that I am going to HATE the "arch enemy."

How can someone have such bitter emotions toward another person that never really did anything to HURT him??

Another person was concerned about the dead man's yard and who was going to care for it!! OMG!!! It's a patch of weeds as it is!!!! A man had just taken his own life!! Who gives a damn about a patch of weeds????

I'm looking at the words....."that's one less problem"...."problem" indicates someone who isn't willing to go along with what they say or do or accept their thinking....maybe not willing to plant his yard in anything except weeds?

To me, someone calling someone "a problem" isn't that bitter of an emotion as a "problem" is a nuisance, an annoyance.....but not anything close to hate.....this comment sounds like it's coming from a insensitive jerk who is an arrogant fool.....but not a family feude where everyone is out to kill each other or even have a strong sense of hate coming from it.

Whatever it was, the comment of being "one less problem" doesn't indicate a strong hatred for the man let alone a strong "arch enemy" sort of relation. From what you have described of this neighbor who said this, you already know how cold & arrogant & rude he is....not sure that his comment should have really surprised you as much as it did. Not sure where the strong "hate" relationship actually came from based on what you have said either unless there is more to it than just his walking into your house uninvited on Christmas with your family all there at dinner & asking for your Christmas turkey leg. That to me indicates more of a very arrogant, pompous, rude person but nothing horribly Hurtful or abusive....more very eccentric pain in the @$$, & not someone you would ever want to choose as a friend or good neighbor, but from this, I do not see anything that would cause a strong "arch enemy" or even truly "hate" feelings here. What I see in this man is that he is an insensitive jerk who doesn't think or care what he says.

I think that everyone there was so completely uncomfortable by the suicide death that it was impossible for them to really find the right words to express what they wanted to say...when that happens, some really stupid things come out. It's hard enough to know what to say when someone dies naturally or from a diesase let alone when they have taken their own life. Honestly at times like that, it's best not to hold onto any words that are said.....there are many underlying emotions that cause stupid words to come out & to allow them to offend you isn't good or wise.

I do want to throw out this question just for a point to stop & think about.....with the hate you feel for this neighbor.....if he were the one to have taken his life.....what would you have had to say about his death? Would you have had anything good to say just because he died? From all that you have said about your neighbor that is alive, I tend to ask the same question: "How can someone have such bitter emotions toward another person that never really did anything to HURT him (you)??"
Of course many times when we are in a highly emotional state ourselves, we tend to read more into comments than are actually there. But I am sitting here only hearing the words that I have been given to base my comments on.

Remember that everyone who was there at the time this was discovered or shortly there after had to have been is a sort of shock & disbelief......it is highly doubtful that they were able to find the right words at a time like that to express what they were really feeling.....especially if no one really knew the man very well.

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I can't erase from my mind the smell and what was missing when they carried him out in a body bag!!

finding the 9 mm slug in his arch enemy's carport.

I've had my nose is a jar of essential oil trying to get rid of the
memory of the smell coming out of his house! Why did they open all the doors and windows to let that smell out into the neighborhood?? Weren't they thinking what it would do to the rest of us???

The picture & smell of this will never completely go away.....part of the path you are on through life......something here that God wants you to learn from, to have imprinted into your memory.....it will lessen with time yes, but trauma's never completely leave our memory.....to remember in the future when something similar comes up or someone else needs help to get through a similar situation.

At the point a trauma happens, it is overwhelming & fills our mind with thought......hardly room for other functioning to happen....this does lessen with time & becomes part of the road we have traveled through life.

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The man was neither friend nor foe.

He was a soft spoken, gentle man even if he did have some strange ideas. One neighbor even says that he was FUN!

Looking at the person who died realistically & not putting them on a pedestal just because they died is important.

I have never understood why we have to say good things about a person just because they have died...it's important to be honest about our feelings.....not only good memories follow a person out of their life nor should all the bad. A good friend that I went to college with died of cancer a few months before my Mother's cancer surgery. I had gone through a lot with him & his wife & I knew his personality very well from all the years I knew him (definitely knew I couldn't stand him as a husband as he was a control freak & demanded to control every moment of time).......I could only imagine what she had gone through with him but she wasn't able to say anything until I broke the ice after his death about his controlling personality.....she was finally able to get out what a prisoner he had made her feel.....but many people feel that they can't say anything bad about a person after they have died.....shoot, the truth is the truth & to place expectations on people not to say what they think about a person after they have died, is a huge wrong expectation to place on people.....not always healthy either. I don't think that the comments made about your neighbor were as horrible as they sounded to you at the time.....true, they weren't all gushing about what a wonderful great neighbor he was, but if the man didn't feel that way (he probably shouldn't have said anything at all rather than to have said what he said)....but you already determined long before this happened that he is an insensitive jerk.....so what he said was probably the best he could come up with given his personality.

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I hate it that I'm drawn to my window just to stare at his house and expect to see him going out to his car! He was ALWAYS, several times a day, going somewhere!! Why didn't he consolidate his trips, for pete's sake????

When someone is as close to your life as this man was & was a part of your daily activities & sights, it is normal to feel this way....to expect to see him &; hear him.......have to chuckle about the lack of consolidation of his trips...lol....who knows...maybe he did have dementia & couldn't remember what he had to do until he had to do it or need something from he store......maybe he was just restless & needed to be out & around people, so he needed the excuse to go to the store or wherever......some people just have strange quirks that are a part of their lives & become a part of our observations, thus a part of our lives also through observation.....amazing what we realize is missing when it isn't there anymore. I remember when my cat died when I was young.....He had been a part of my life from the time I was 5 years old until I was 21.....after he died, I remember feeling like I had to quick close the front door behind me just like when he was alive so he wouldn't escape out the front door (as he was a house can that loved his freedom). That action had become such a part of my life that even after he died, it took years to stop feeling the need to do it.....things that become a habit we don't realize until we don't need to do it anymore.

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How do I handle my hate for this idiot

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How do you shut up the cold hearted beast that drops insults about a
dead man at the drop of a hat?? How do you remove him from your
midst??? How do you NOT gloat when you see his lights on all through the night and his front door open??? You know he's freaking and YOU LOVE IT!!!!

Think this is something you need to take to God in prayer....this is where you will get the help for this issue. It seems that it is definitely an overreaction to him & the whole situation & is maybe a huge part of the learning process that is coming from this situation. Learning to control your emotions & having the self-control that is required of us. Remember, anger when there is just cause is acceptable......but what is it that is justifying your cause??? That is something you need to really determine just how justified your emotion actually is.

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What is grief counseling? Do they help virtual strangers get over the shock of someone doing such a horrible thing to themselves?? How do you justify it?? CAN you justify it??

I think this is a wonderful idea.....they know that anyone who has had anything to do with a suicide situation, whether neighbor, friend, relative, is all affected by it......I would definitely look into getting help with this as suicide is definitely something that is a trauma to anyone it touches.....I don't think you even have to justify for if you are seeking help, that in itself justifies your need.

You will get through this & you will grow in wisdom & compassion from this experience with God's help & the support of those around you.

You know that I always play role of the devils advocate (or maybe I should say God's advocate), taking our thoughts out of the box we grew up with them in......not that those boxes are good or bad....but as a challenge to look at things in a different light.

You always have my support.....know how much I love you,

Debbie