I've had bad experiences with orthopedists, too. For example, I've kept telling them that I have problems with my spine in the middle of my back. My upper spine (cervical) and lower spine (lumbar) had MRIs that showed degenerative disease. I was finally told after asking several doctors that that area was hard to get a good picture of. But other patients have said they had no problems. I was in a wreck recently and now that area hurts even worse, but no one is willing to deal with that! Sorry to vent on your thread, Lizardlady, but other orthopedists have done me wrong, too--like I'm convinced I had knee surgery that I really didn't need! Is there something missing in their training? I can understand, then, to some extent what you're dealing with! Or WHO!