OH! Sorry. I guess I just take trust as a given. Maybe I've been married for too long. For me, trust just IS... sort of like breathing. It never even occurs to either one of us that we don't trust one another. It never enters our mind. For me, there can be no romantic Love without mutual trust... which in turn makes true intimacy possible.

As I said at the start of my post. I was defining what intimacy is for ME. I'm not saying anything here because I think it's something other people should do. To each their own. I'm not describing an ideology. I'm only describing what actually works for me and for my wife in our relationship.

No, in my case, I KNOW she made the salad to please me. She often makes a lunch for me, not because she thinks it's something she is supposed to do or has to do, but because she knows it pleases me. She does things for me because it pleases her to please me which on turn pleases me, which pleases her... and so on and so on and so on. We both do things for each other solely because we know our partner will be pleased. That level of wanting to please and being pleased is very intimate. It's making a connection... even though we might be miles apart, a connection is made.

Be very careful when you use the term "normal" in describing something... The specific words you use to convey an thought or idea make a great deal of difference . When you use the word "selfish" it usually conveys a negative meaning. In other words, being selfish is not a good thing. It's usually thought of as the opposite of being generous or selfless. Yes, there are times when I do something that benefits myself first. And sometimes my wife does the same thing. But, that isn't being selfish! I EXPECT my wife to do things just for herself. She expects that I'll do he same. But, acting in a way that is self-satisfying is not selfish. It's only selfish when the reason or motivation for doing so is to be exclusive. That's to say, to intentionally exclude your partner when you know that exclusion will not please them. Is that "normal"? I don't know. In our relationship, it isn't something we would define as "normal".

At any rate, you bet! I agree. I think you have to have mutual trust or the chances of finding intimacy are zilch.

Dan