It's harder doing phone appointments than when I saw her in person. In her office, the evil clock was always there staring at me so I couldn't get away from the time going by. But now on the phone, I am usually sitting in my car talking to her, and don't have a clock so I have to let her watch the time. She'll just say "well, we have to stop now." and then we schedule the next appointment. I guess I sorta can feel when time is about up before she says that, just something subtle that changes in her voice, I guess, I dunno.