Hi tecomsin
The person is a young woman we contacted "as family" to become the nanny of the children. She came to our family when she was 19 years old. But she was no nanny, she did not take money, she lived with us, she cared about the children and housework and in the evening, when the children were asleep, I talked with her. She was a friend from the beginning, just after school, looking for interesting situations and learn from life.
We found that my wife was behaving in a problematic way, were analyzing the situations and looking for ways how she could be helped.

This "pseudo-nanny-friend" found various therapies for my wife and my son, some of them they tried, but nothing really helped. Then my wife made her "our partner" and we started a common sexual relation-ship; just for my wife to have more ways to attack us, trying to make her more narcissist supply.

But, I was not alone anymore in that relation and could speak with the pseudo-nanny-friend about what is going on and start to understand that my wife needs her evil lies to be believed to feel good.
While the pseudo-nanny-friend was caring all day for my children and the household and I was caring for work and money, my wife found herself a new prey, a homeless worker, started a secret relation with him and became extremely hostile - all the time.
Before, there were hours every few days when she was kind, after this secret relation started (that my father detected and I felt but she denied when I asked her), she was either mean or very mean - especially to my children and the pseudo-nanny-friend who at that time should have been seen as "part of the family", but from view of the most people outside the family, she was a nanny. The pseudo.nanny-friend's father lived at the same place and my father as well...

My wife found that I was not believing her brazen lies anymore - so most likely that was the reason why she found herself a new supply, so her plan was easy: kick me and "the nanny" out of "her" home in the way that I will feel guilty forever and pay her a nice life with her new lover.

When she finally managed to kick me out, I thought that "now she will at least be happy again and care for my children" - but she made "shopping trips" with her lover leaving my children alone for hours, letting my oldest daughter do all the work "her nanny" did before - after the school that ended at 16:00.

I started to understand that is was not because I was such a bad man and made her so unhappy that she could not care about the children. She never could care about children and the 1.5 years she had to care about my oldest son, she completely damaged him, who has clear APD and shows "unconscious lying" as well - different to all my other children who were partially raised by someone else (nannies and me).

Anyway, when she kicked me out of my home and chased away from my children and inserted the homeless man to take my position, I took the pseudo-nanny-friend with me and we openly became a couple. To some degree we both survived the narcissistic abuse (she was 3 years with us at that time), while she had a special behavior: in moments of stress, she would simply NOT REACT. She just stood there, like on "stand-by", my wife getting mad, ranting, shouting, and the "pseudo-nanny-friend" resembling a grey rock, completely without reaction or motion. Just waiting until it was over. In the evening she and me talked about the day and analyzed the situations and tried to understand it and find solutions to it. We should have found "pathological lying" faster, we knew she was lying a lot, but I could not believe that ALWAYS.

I think that a pathological liar can only be understood with distance. As long as there is just a tiny bit of sympathy or sentiment for that person, one cannot really believe that.

You write that your ex was a pathological liar as well: the first my wife told me, when I met her, was that she cannot become pregnant, just to become pregnant 2 weeks later. I KNEW she was lying A LOT. When she talked with my friends, afterwards I had to talk with them as well and tell them that everything is different than she told them.

So I KNEW exactly she was lying. BUT admitting to oneself that she was lying about everything, that is as well, love and common plans and simply everything, that it has no limit to "outside people" but that even the most intimate things are nothing but lies, to come to this point I needed 5 months of distance to understand: NOTHING BUT lies and all that only that she receives a SHORT TIME "kick" of being believed. One can find out 5 minutes later it was ******** - she does not care. Only the moment of initial believe from the victim counts for pathological liars.

Without ANY thought about consequences and absolutely NO GUILT, not the slightest bit of self criticism.

But, because I left with my new partner and we had work and plans, we could direct our thoughts to the future and just when we had to deal with the disastrous situation of my children, we had to come back to the toxic thoughts.

I engaged a private detective who documented how my wife neglected my children - still the court did not care about this, but, at least, ordered that our children will be one week with me (and their former "nanny", the children all love and play with the whole day when they are here, everyday with joy and happiness) and one week with their mother and her lover - and that everyone of us has to pay the own expenses by him/herself.

Last February, my older son decided that he does not want to continue to go to school (he is 14 years old), at least not so often, so he decided not to come to me anymore. The court decision he sees as something he and his mother do not need to care about too much.

I tried to make the court aware of it, but after 5 months nothing happened with this so my other children think that court decisions are worth nothing, BUT as the small ones have a lot of fun with us and my big daughter need the week to relax from the family-work, household and child-caring she must do when with her mother, they continue to spend a week here and one there, all three but my oldest son.

So, the "pseudo nanny" has been with my children for more than 4 years now and now we live together with her father and my father in a house, she and my father pay for, as I lost all money I had, due to my mental states a year ago when I would not be able to care about the company and tried to save my children without really understanding the situation. Anyway, money comes and goes, I do not care about that too much.

I'm happy I understood pathological lying, it seems so strange that one does not understand it immediately. But you wrote it as well "once I realized he was a pathological liar": THIS realization is the "enlightenment".

Since that time I think about writing a book or blog or something to help people FIND OUT as long as they are not completely doomed.

It's not really complicated, but admitting this to oneself that the partner is a pathological liar is very complicated, it means admitting to oneself that NOTHING of what s/he said is true - and people WANT TO believe lies!

"Perfect NDP pathological liars", like my wife, excatly tell the lies their audience WANTS to hear and they say it so convincing that if one does not check it against reality, one cannot detect the lie. And my wife always added some kind of "very nasty" stuff each story, so that no one really wants to ask the accused person whether or not he would have said or done such nasty things. One one feel even ashamed of hearing about this... PURE LIES!

She is able to accuse someone looking directly into his/her eyes about the most nasty things, while the "prey" is standing and watching the scene - and believing 100% what my wife says. If the accused one tries to defend himself - it shows he is guilty. If the accused one is NOT defending himself - it shows he is guilty.

I would never believed this if I would not have experienced this, not one time, but thousand times. But making the connection to oneself: "she lies to everyone - that means, she lies to me as well? On no, she loves me, I can feel it, so maybe she doe not always tell me the full truth, but basically she really loves me!" is the problem.

One WANTS to be lied to. And this these narcissists exploit, without any limit.

Best wishes
David