Hi again, whimsicalman! Remember, we are both in the "all respectful religious and spirituality" social group? It would be great if you could start a discussion there about this. I personally don't attend church these days, & I haven't been meditating much the way I used to. But I sort of have my own church within myself, & I use visualization a lot to put myself in a zone, which feels spiritual. It's a private thing, even though I have voices that don't give me much privacy. Are you any of these ways sometimes?