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Originally Posted by Etcetera1
Hmmmm. Wait. You said vulnerability is being myself? Expressing myself? Did I get that right?
I don't ever fake myself or my presentation, but actively expressing my emotions goes beyond not being fake, to me.
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Ah, yeah, I said that, but I did mean being your emotional self, so actively expressing your/my emotions. Just doing whatever to feel vulnerable, which I think for you, as for me, is openly portraying our emotions inspite of as usual keeping them in or using anger as a protective shield to keep them from other people.
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Ah, so it's an actual emotion, as in, it's a reaction to being emotionally open, to be really honest I've not realised that before/wasn't sure before. Thanks. That clarified a lot. I will be thinking about this more.
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Yes, for you, and for me, and probably for all people vulnerability is an emotional reaction to openly communicating emotions. I think the difference is in the degree of being able to share emotions before starting to feel vulnerable. I.e. you and I feel vulnerable much much sooner than your usual John/Jane.
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Btw - My being angry isn't really being emotionally open because: 1) It does not come from a sensitive place 2) I usually control its expression. I mean getting too impulsive with its expression would bother me for various reasons, of course, so I don't usually allow too much impulsivity with it 3) The anger obviously will obscure the expression of any other emotion that I might otherwise be expressing at the same time.
And because of 1), yeah, it's not vulnerable at all either, for sure.
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Agreed. Anger is a defense against emotionality, not a vulnerable emotion in itself. I agree will all 3 of your points. It is the same for me.
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That makes sense. I think yeah, this reaction being individual makes sense. Some emotions I can express almost anywhere, and some I have never been able to express EVER in my life.
I think, I might have felt the actual emotion before, but I would only actually *feel*, *experience* this emotion maybe a couple of times ever in my life. When it was actually my showing emotions, interest, where that would be sensitive (risky) but somehow it was working spontaneously. Trust me this hasn't happened often in my life so far lol. It was always someone else initiating emotional reciprocation for more lasting connection so it wasn't terribly risky, but sure, a bit of a feeling of risk and sometimes thrill with the risk.
I've analysed this more but don't want to bore anyone with it :P so I journalled instead of sharing it here, but your input really helped is what I'm trying to say.
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I have to think about this a bit more, but I think it might be the same for me. I don't usually portray a proper depiction of my emotions and at least some of the time, seem inappropriatly void of them. I.e. someone close to me came close to dying at some point and I felt nothing at all. But then I also think death is kind, so I don't actually mind it. Okay, digressing from your point...
Yes, exactly, and also with T, last session I told him I wanted to continue doing therapy with him, that was a very hard thing for me to admit. Admitting that I wanted something of him. Admitting that I have wants and needs is a very difficult thing, because it opens a door for him (or people in general) to hurt me.
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Well it's like I got a lot of pressure from therapy and similar settings to act based on certain expectations I picked up from these places. It's not good, I know.
Anyway I kind of answered this question since then, it's like, some people will just deliver another personal attack in response, stir up drama, whatnot, influence the emotions of the situation and the relationship that way, have control over the emotional side of the situation and the relationship and so on. It's certainly less of a big risk to be open and vulnerable if one does feel in control of the emotional landscape. It may become a tolerable risk then. And that then may enable one to initiate the emotional reciprocity about risky moves in establishing or deepening connection. That's my current view, anyhow. (Yes if you see irony and cynicism here, you've read me right :P)
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I don't find it ironic at all. I mean, it's impossible to achieve full control of the emotional landscape of course, but anger is the essance of trying simply by pushing all other emotions out. Seeking power is a reaction to feeling powerless. No irony in that other than it is not in fact possible to establish full power over another person (while keeping the realtionship alive).
The point is letting go of the will to control it all. For me, at any rate.
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I'm not really afraid, I just know that if there is a large chance that it will result in strong pain there's no point in doing this. A little pain, a little distress, a little discomfort, okay. Strong pain, that takes an extreme lot out of my life, no....It's happened before and I don't need that to be repeated. Ever again. It was way too high, the cost I paid. All because I was not afraid or sense the emotional risks or just ignored the risks lol. I just was too impulsive and didn't think at all. (Didn't feel the emotion of vulnerability either lol)
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I understand where are coming from. This is exactly why I think the therapeutic relaitonship might work for me, because it's not about T, it's about me. So I can say
stop and demand he stop and I can say
go and assume he knows where to go. Because it's not about what he needs (other than safety), I can set boundaries with him. Of course, I couldn't with xT, but I guess on top of a basic willingness to walk this path and let someone help me shape it, it also takes a compatible T to do that. I think I might've found mine
And yeah, it didn't use to be about fear for me either and these days it is but sporadically something I am actively afraid of. It's more a choice led by concious thought than by feelings. But the emotions are coming from time to time, now, and of course they are predominantly negative emotions, sadness, fear, that sort. So I need to work throught them, it's what it is
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Okay I'll let you know lol!
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Thanks!
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