</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
kim_johnson said:
I think there might be something to the notion that not being able to see his reactions or lack thereof... I am really very aware of those in person and they affect the direction of my conversation. There was some of that on the phone too.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
I am so attuned to my T's nonverbals and he is the same with me-- even something as small as an eyebrow raise gets me all riled up and I have to know exactly what that meant for him. I tend to "go off" in session a lot with difficult material so the phone doesn't let me explore such material as much-- because there is way less opportunity for him to ground me if we are not face to face.

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
I have this saying 'if you want to be treated as a person then you need to act like a person'. That is my take on the whole 'feminine' thing. I see people trying to do some combination of sexy and competent and they do seem to battle with guys not really treating them as competent / seeing them as a sexual object. My motto is: 'if you want to be treated as a person then you need to act like a person'. And that is my justification for dressing conservatively... Not dowdy exactly... Just not in a way that draws attention to my legs or my butt or my breasts...

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
I think it is possible to balance both. Of course it depends what the intention is. I like to mix sexy with competent. I do not dress in a conservative manner, and I wouldn't feel comfortable doing so. However, I don't battle with how men see me because I'm married and I could care less about the thoughts and judgements of people who don't know me. Do you feel that you need a justification for dressing conservatively? Has anyone ever commented on that or tried to tell you to do otherwise? I think it is just important that you feel comfortable with how you are.

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
And I can tell he doesn't exactly agree... I wonder what his wife is like lol. I can tell he doesn't exactly agree. Even on the phone. He was like 'yeah, you've said that before' in a slightly dubious tone.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
Ugh, I never want to imagine what my T's wife is like, lol. When I do imagine her, she is a 3 ft. ogre with a wart on her nose.

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
We chatted a bit about whether some women act all feminine and posture themselves with their butt and boobs thrust out because they are making a conscious effort or whether it is just natural to them. We concluded we didn't really know...

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
This is interesting. Again, I think it depends on the woman and her intention. There are so many definitions for "acting feminine" and it differs for each woman. For example, I am sure that you and I have distinctly different opinions on what would be personally feminine for us. I don't think that shoving one's boobs in someone's face or sticking out one's butt is particularly feminine or classy, lol.

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
Then I thought... There is a fair amount of masculine posturing (swaggering etc) in some circles, too. I guess you do what was reinforced by your parents / peer group and after a while it becomes natural to you. Funny how the guys in my circles don't really feel the need to swagger or engage in he-man ******** and yet the females (sometimes) feel the need to dress in a matter I consider provocative... Weird indeed...

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
You are definitely right about the men! The male friends that I surround myself tend to have more feminine qualities than the majority of males. I thought it was interesting that you used the word "need" when talking about females dressing in a way you would consider provocatively. Again, everyone's opinion differs on what is provocative based on what you are used to or how you dress-- I never felt the "need" to dress the way I do (no, I don't dress like a prostitute, lol... but you would never catch me in a loose fitting t-shirt, baggy clothes, or sneakers)-- I just always felt comfortable and natural in the way that I dress. I tend to also enjoy dressing on the more creative/flashy side-- funky accesories, a pair of metallic gold shoes, etc.-- so I wonder how that factors into the equation. I know that I have never been comfortable blending in. If I went out in a t-shirt and jeans I would feel so, so weird. And if you went out in gold wedges and a skirt, you would probably feel so, so weird. It is interesting what comes natural to us and where that came from. I don't see it as a need, for me personally. Or perhaps it could be a need to stand out a bit, but it is more about a level of comfort and naturalness. I think for some people it can be a need for much more sexual reasons.

Sorry if I didn't respond much to the "T" portion of this thread, but I just thought that the concepts raised were really interesting and didn't want to ignore that.