[mad_dragon2789]

My doc won't give me meds for my ADHD because of my drug abuse. isn't this wrong, if i really need the meds?

[Simcha]

Originally Posted by mad_dragon2789

My doc won't give me meds for my ADHD because of my drug abuse. isn't this wrong, if i really need the meds?

((((((mad_dragon)))))))
My little sister went through a similar scenario, and I can understand how it could be very annoying. It feels like another barrier, like a wall that they've put up. Many people with ADHD are/were addicted to drugs and/or alcohol, so don't feel as if your the only one to face this problem. In fact, the reason you are/were addicted to drugs might in fact be in large part BECAUSE of the ADHD going untreated.

If you don't mind sharing (but don't feel pressured to), might I ask if you are CURRENTLY abusing drugs, or if it was in your past? That would be a determining factor to consider, as stimulants can be abused and create/add to an addiction. If it was in your past, how long ago, and which drugs did you abuse? Often doctors don't prescribe anything that can potentially be abused to those still vulnerable or still using, even though we have long acting forms of the stimulants now which are really difficult to abuse. Some doctors will prescribe them anyway, but they will often watch you like a hawk and give you a very small amount (5 days or so). Both methods depend on the circumstances of the patient, and there are always alternatives.

There is a non-stimulant drug (stimulant-like) called Strattera that is solely for ADHD treatment that is worth trying out, which is what I would ask your doctor about before wasting energy on a battle with him, especially if he is going to be useless to you. Did you see a psychiatrist or a general practitioner? Some doctors seem to think that prescribing stimulants to anybody is opening the door for them to be abused. The fact is that people with a diagnosis of ADHD are far LESS LIKELY to become drug/alchohol addicted if they ARE TREATED than those that are not treated. This fact has been cited by multiple longitudinal studies on the issue.

I'm actually surprised your doctor didn't offer alternatives to the traditional stimulants, as most doctors wouldn't just send you on your way (I would think). Withholding treatment is just as damaging as withholding treatment in cases of Major Depressive Disorder or Panic Disorder or anything else, and the results can be devastating. I'd call and make another appointment ASAP. Take a trusted friend/family with you to your next appointment, and ask him for alternatives to the stimulants. You might also want to consider making an appointment with a psychologist for therapy, especially if you are dealing with multiple issues like drug addiction and untreated ADHD. You can always message me here if you want some ideas or have questions--I don't want to be any longer here than I have already.

[Ginger21]

Originally Posted by mad_dragon2789

My doc won't give me meds for my ADHD because of my drug abuse. isn't this wrong, if i really need the meds?

One thing you might try- I pick up my meds every day. This gives me little opportunity to overdo things...It makes my doctor more comfortable, and helps me control how I take my meds. The pharmacy has been really great, because it is extra work for them, and it has been a great solution.

[SaintMelangell]

Originally Posted by Simcha

I'm actually surprised your doctor didn't offer alternatives to the traditional stimulants, as most doctors wouldn't just send you on your way (I would think). Withholding treatment is just as damaging as withholding treatment in cases of Major Depressive Disorder or Panic Disorder or anything else, and the results can be devastating. I'd call and make another appointment ASAP.

Sad to say, this hasn't been my experience. The first few psychiatrists I went to -- due to a severe bout of anxiety/depression I'd been going through (I hadn't eaten in a week, or slept in days -- not unusual, but I'd hit my breaking point) -- kept brushing me off entirely.

Growing up, if I made the mistake of failing to hide whatever difficult life circumstance I was going through, I'd be singled out like prey (the older I get, the more mystified I am by the adults -- the teachers, especially -- and the sadistic pleasure they seemed to take in yelling at me for being 'lazy' and 'worthless' and whatever else made me an abomination. Strange -- as an adult, I don't look at little kids and think "jeez, you know what would be awesome? Treating a 7 year old worse than a prisoner at Abu Grhaib!").. So, to survive the psychological warfare, I had to feign normalcy/mediocrity with vigilance, *especially* during hard times. Because of this, to this day, the worse I feel, the more pleasant and personable I am to strangers - it's automatic; like a switch that goes on and off. Or on and fades..

So, I guess it comes down to this with the psychiatrists: I was too 'personable' to have any problems; I had to be the 'standard of health,' regardless of everything I described that went against that. And though I have become quite good at laying out the facts, my delivery wasn't adequately fitting their stereotyped image; 'TV Movie of the Week" cliche, to be accepted.. as if this is a carbon copy/cookie cutter world...... Ironic, as this has to make them easy prey for any manipulative sociopath walking through their door (who plans to, and succeeds in walking out with a diagnosis of anything but sociopathy).

Fortunately, I finally found a psychiatrist capable of thinking outside the confines of a teeny tiny, itsy bitsy little box.. but it took a lot of wasted dr visits to get there. So yeah, I advise going Doctor hunting til you find someone who actually cares about their patients, and about practicing medicine--well!

[Simcha]

Originally Posted by SaintMelangell

Sad to say, this hasn't been my experience. The first few psychiatrists I went to -- due to a severe bout of anxiety/depression I'd been going through (I hadn't eaten in a week, or slept in days -- not unusual, but I'd hit my breaking point) -- kept brushing me off entirely.

Growing up, if I made the mistake of failing to hide whatever difficult life circumstance I was going through, I'd be singled out like prey (the older I get, the more mystified I am by the adults -- the teachers, especially -- and the sadistic pleasure they seemed to take in yelling at me for being 'lazy' and 'worthless' and whatever else made me an abomination. Strange -- as an adult, I don't look at little kids and think "jeez, you know what would be awesome? Treating a 7 year old worse than a prisoner at Abu Grhaib!").. So, to survive the psychological warfare, I had to feign normalcy/mediocrity with vigilance, *especially* during hard times. Because of this, to this day, the worse I feel, the more pleasant and personable I am to strangers - it's automatic; like a switch that goes on and off. Or on and fades..

So, I guess it comes down to this with the psychiatrists: I was too 'personable' to have any problems; I had to be the 'standard of health,' regardless of everything I described that went against that. And though I have become quite good at laying out the facts, my delivery wasn't adequately fitting their stereotyped image; 'TV Movie of the Week" cliche, to be accepted.. as if this is a carbon copy/cookie cutter world...... Ironic, as this has to make them easy prey for any manipulative sociopath walking through their door (who plans to, and succeeds in walking out with a diagnosis of anything but sociopathy).

Fortunately, I finally found a psychiatrist capable of thinking outside the confines of a teeny tiny, itsy bitsy little box.. but it took a lot of wasted dr visits to get there. So yeah, I advise going Doctor hunting til you find someone who actually cares about their patients, and about practicing medicine--well!

There are always general practitioners to consider as well.
Of course, seeing a psychologist and having them send a report to the general practitioner might work better than seeing a psychiatrist alone.

[kim_johnson]

It isn't wrong if the interaction could kill you.
What you abusing?
It could be that your abusing is causing your ADHD symptoms and that they would eventually remit if you stopped abusing.

I had kind of a similar thing. I am on a lot of meds for bp 1 & anxiety (klonopin) but have never had my dosage increased in 17 yrs. I only take it at night to help me sleep except in severe panic attacks. So I see a psych nurse practitioner for that.

I also take Concerta for ADHD & have been on the same dosage for 10 yrs. since I was diagnosed.

So I am not a "drug seeking" person. I've been a patient of this internal medicine doc for 17 yrs. & have never asked for a pain killer! But I did have severe back pain due to an issue confirmed by an MRI & my IM doc prescribed a painkiller (vicodin) & I called & asked if I could have a prescription refill as I was going on vacatiion & hoping to participate with my family in some activities & basically walking, standing, lying down--big time sleep deprivation, bendng over--anything other than SITTING was causing pain despite the medication so I was asking the voicemail nurse about dosage--if I could take 1 1/2 pills instead of just 1 & the nurse somehow communicated to the doc that I wanted a STRONGER painkiller (like I don't know what--morpheine??) & so I got a really gruff message that no, the doc was NOT GOING TO GIVE ME A STRONGER PAIN KILLER & IF BENDING OVER CAUSED PAIN THE DOC RECOMMEDED NOT BENDING OVER!!

So I figured if you go to medical school to give that type of advice forget it. I'm getting a new doc. Plus for her to treat me so gruffly after supposedly knowing me for so long...

I just felt hurt I guess.--Suzy

[SaintMelangell]

Originally Posted by Simcha

There are always general practitioners to consider as well.
Of course, seeing a psychologist and having them send a report to the general practitioner might work better than seeing a psychiatrist alone.

I've had to endure the same ineptitude with general practitioners, as well -- Suzy's account is pretty standard, in my experience. Finding a good GP is just as difficult as finding a good, caring, ethical psychiatrist.

It's like finding a good man... a lot of rotten ones out there, not enough good ones. But when (and if) you find one.. hold onto that gem!

[kim_johnson]

yeah, i understand feeling hurt :-(

i do think that they need to be careful with mixing stimulants (ADHD meds) with depressants (pain meds) though... but i do understand your feeling hurt about that and they could have explained if that was the concern.

[PsyChris]

The dispensing of schedule III and above drugs is getting harder and harder for doctors. The DEA is starting to treat doctors like drug dealers. Unfortunately some physicians do prescribe a lot of Schedule III and IV because they do not know what else to do.

Your doctor won't prescribe you and addictive substance when you have a history of addiction. However, he should not just "street" you. There are plenty of other therapeutic options for ADHD. I take non-prescription Suntheanine daily and as time goes on, I have noticed a pretty decent benefit. It wasn't the quick fix amphetamines would give.. but I like not having side effects or taking a medication with addictive potential.

[sunrise]

Originally Posted by PsyChris

I take non-prescription Suntheanine daily and as time goes on, I have noticed a pretty decent benefit. It wasn't the quick fix amphetamines would give.. but I like not having side effects or taking a medication with addictive potential.

PsyChris, what side effects for ampethatmines have you experienced (or heard of)? I started on my first stimulant a few months ago--Vyvanse--but haven't had any side effects. I can't even remember if my PNP cautioned me about any possible side effects. It seems really benign to me.

[kim_johnson]

> what side effects for ampethatmines have you experienced (or heard of)?

where to start...

(but then check out the list of side effects for asprin)

if you don't think you have experienced any then it is probably better to stick to that. sometimes if you worry about side effects... you come to experience them...

[Simcha]

Originally Posted by SaintMelangell

I've had to endure the same ineptitude with general practitioners, as well -- Suzy's account is pretty standard, in my experience. Finding a good GP is just as difficult as finding a good, caring, ethical psychiatrist.

It's like finding a good man... a lot of rotten ones out there, not enough good ones. But when (and if) you find one.. hold onto that gem!

LOL Saint

Well, I'm not really looking for any MEN at the moment... but if I lose interest in heterosexuality I'll make sure I'll let you know...

I'd like to think there are plenty of "good men" out there for you Saint Melangell (easier than finding a good, ethical, professional psychiatrist); you just need to adjust your internal radar and you will find them when you are ready!


sam

[Simcha]

Originally Posted by PsyChris

The dispensing of schedule III and above drugs is getting harder and harder for doctors. The DEA is starting to treat doctors like drug dealers. Unfortunately some physicians do prescribe a lot of Schedule III and IV because they do not know what else to do.

Your doctor won't prescribe you and addictive substance when you have a history of addiction. However, he should not just "street" you. There are plenty of other therapeutic options for ADHD. I take non-prescription Suntheanine daily and as time goes on, I have noticed a pretty decent benefit. It wasn't the quick fix amphetamines would give.. but I like not having side effects or taking a medication with addictive potential.

I think I need to see some double-blind studies conducted on this Suntheanine--that's a new "alternative" treatment for ADHD that I haven't heard of yet.

My question for you to consider is this:
What is so "unfortunate" about prescribing the gold standard of treatment for ADHD medication (stimulants)? There isn't anything wrong with stimulants for the majority of people. Quick fix... hmm, do you think we are all drug addicts who get some sort of "fix" (meaning HIGH) out of medication? Lets just say that someone takes a stimulant and gets a "quick" therapeutic (not "high") response... is there anything with having a drug work quickly? In my case, the long acting stimulant I take (Dexedrine XR) takes about 45 minutes to kick in. I get absolutely no pleasurable "high" off it. When I tried the immediate release version, it mostly made me sick to my stomach and really agitated, so I no longer take that one.

I think it is the way that you view prescription stimulants that is the problem here Chris. It fits right in there with the other biased stereotypes of ADHD. No offense meant here Chris, but you are inaccurate when you refer to stimulants as an "addictive substance". This simply isn't the case... there is a huge difference between a substance that causes addiction and between a substance that has the potential to become an addictive substance if abused.

This widely held false belief that you shared with us here might seem like semantics Chris, but it is this very inaccuracy that provides the fuel to the fire in the general (uneducated) public and the FDA (DEA is law enforcement for illegal drug activity that reaches the scale of federal drug crimes; FDA is regulation of medications including scheduled ones), who then think that stimulants (or any scheduled medication) is BAD.

I'm all for anything that works safely. If what you take/do shows efficacy with minimum to no side effects, than more power to you bro. Myself personally... I have found good benefits from Dexedrine XR with little to no side effects only some of the time. I have found I have had problems when the drug wears off about half the days I take it, with some side effects; I would also like it to be smoother and last longer so I am thinking of refilling another drug with my doctor instead (maybe Adderall XR or Vyvanse if not too expensive). I ALSO get better with weekly psychotherapy and education about ADHD in all of it's wonderful technicolor forms (it aint all bad to think differently).

Peace on Earth; Goodwill toward men (and the ladies of course!)
And Goodwill toward Chris too

Yes, I have to agree. I have been taking Concerta 72 mg for over 10 yrs. & have never had to increase the dosage or had any kind of "speeded up" feeling, but I definitely feel the benefits as far as focus & concentration.

I also take Provigil (same dosage for 10 yrs. also) due to side effects of bipolar meds of excessive daytime sleepiness to the point of falling asleep while driving. Again, I've not had to increase the dosage or felt any "speediness" feeling since being on it for 10 yrs.

I was on Xananx (1 mg) at night for anxiety to help me sleep for 17 yrs., but was changed to Klonopin recently. Again, I don't want to take more than prescribed as all they do is make me tired. I am "allowed" to take Klonopin during the day if needed for anxiety, but I don't want to be tired during the day so I practice techniques I'm learning in my DBT class..--Suzy P.S. However, I do have a friend who is going through terrible withdrawals trying to get off Xanax that is the controlled release where there is some in your system all the time. I don't take that kind. He is going through hell even though he is tapering it with a doc's help.