[Neptune83]

Hi,
As the title..
Just wondered, as I was diagnosed with Bipolar two and a half years ago, but I've always been extremely obsessive compulsive.
Saw a doctor yesterday who said once I've had my little girl I can start CBT if I want to.
Are they always two completely different disorders or can they both be part of each other?

[Darth Bane]

when we are depressed we keep on thinking the same negative thoughts again and agian... thats OCD i think.... if you are thinking "i wanna kill myself" everyday for like a year.... but these all negative thoughts go away when you are manic so....

[Secretum]

I think that it is pretty common for OCD symptoms to be comorbid with bipolar. When I was a lot younger (like 11-12), I had some pretty serious OCD symptoms; washed my hands until they bled, couldn't stop worrying about starting an epidemic, thought that I was going to accidentally kill this kid in my class who had a peanut allergy by eating a butterfinger, etc. When my mood disorder began at age 12, it interacted with the OCD stuff; while depressed, I had obsessional thoughts on something terrible that I thought I had done, for example.

I don't believe that I have OCD because most of these symptoms have gone away. My brother, however, has OCD, so I know that I am genetically vulnerable for it.

If you think that you may have OCD, treatment is definitely a good thing. CBT is very effective. Unfortunately, you probably won't be able to take meds for it, because the treatment for OCD is high dose SSRIs...yeah, not a good idea for someone with bipolar!

Good luck getting this aspect of your illness under control.

Originally Posted by Neptune83

...Are they always two completely different disorders or can they both be part of each other?

Like many other mental disorders, there can be cross-over symptoms (which is why it can sometimes be hard to sort out what is going on), but they are, in fact, separate disorders. That said, I have both. (And ADD. Go me! )

You'd want to speak with a professional about your specific issues, as, of course, we can't diagnose. Like with so many disorders, there are popular misconceptions that lead people towards self-diagnosis, and diagnoses from friends, which should be avoided. For instance, people think that if they think about stuff "obsessively" or are exceptionally tidy, that's "OCD". It is not. Same with BP. ALL people have ups and downs. Doesn't mean they have BP. ALL people forget stuff or have trouble focusing sometimes. Doesn't mean they've got ADD. It comes down to how pervasive something is in negatively impacting ones' life... How far off the bell curve of "normal" human experience symptoms are.
Before I veer off into a rant ....

Long/short, by all means, talk with your professional about what's going on. CBT can be helpful with all sorts of things. It's basically about examining thought patterns, and that can be useful regardless of a specific dx (or even w/o one). One other thought. Since I can't tell what kind of doctor you are referring to... GPs ("regular" doctors) are not a good resource when dealing with mental health issues. As well-intentioned as they may be, they simply don't have the level of speciality needed for such a complex subject. So be sure to seek out a mental health professional. Good luck!

[hamster-bamster]

I am unsure now whether I have bp, but I might. What I am definitely not is a clean freak OCD!

[Resident Bipolar]

It's hard to define "hand in hand" when it comes to discussing the comorbidity of Bipolar Disorder and other conditions. I want to just say "YES!" but it's not so simply and for some reason I like to leave a long response to a thread instead of a short one.

However, to say it shortly "possibly". Much with like many subjects in psychiatry, there is no definite answer. A large number of people diagnosed with bipolar disorder have also been diagnosed with OCD - a strong link has been established between the two and it's been estimated between 10% and 35% of people with bipolar disorder also have a diagnoses of OCD.

10% to 35% may not seem like much, but considering that in the US alone around 5.7 million people are diagnosed with Bipolar, it means that between 570,000 and almost 2 million people in the US with Bipolar also have a diagnoses of OCD.

So yes there is a link between the two and cases of comorbidity are actually pretty high, and it's thought that OCD could be more comorbid with Bipolar than Major Depressive Disorder (I, myself, am comorbid Bipolar Disorder and Major Depressive Disorder).

Also quite interestingly there is evidence that, when comorbid with bipolar disorder, the OCD seems to be more centered around obsessiveness with activities such as religion and sexual activities than it is around "checking compulsions". However there is still much to learn for clinical experts and psychiatrists.

Further Reading

RB ♥

[Neptune83]

Thank you all for your replies
I saw a psychiatric doctor and a mental health nurse.
Used to be on antidepressants for years, and with mood swings those were the worst years so far. Now I'm not on anything, I've found anxiety to be the biggest problem. I've always been, since I was a kid, very obsessive compulsive. Definitely to the point it interferes with daily life, it's mostly about germs, illness, dying. Some crazy crazy thoughts.
However, the mood disorder part is still an issue, but I think if I could get the other stuff under control, it would make a huge difference. Initially didn't want to take anything, of course now I ask to do so, I don't have that option being almost 34 weeks pregnant. So been told to wait it out, use Diazepam for panic, till LO is born then I have many more options.
I don't think I've ever been officially diagnosed with OCD, although I recall my GP mentioning it some years ago. The guy I saw the other day said he could see from my notes that I have a long history of OCD, which I found surprising because no one has ever really discussed it with me. But then, no one has really discussed Bipolar either since they said this is what the problem is. Everyone seems to tiptoe around it all, it leads you to wonder if they are right, if they have doubts etc..
They also diagnosed BPD, which they put on my notes but didn't discuss with me at all, didn't even mention it!
It's hard to know which is more the problem, which should be focused on more or should they both be. This all confuddles my poor brain too much!
But thank you for your replies, they're very helpful

i've always wondered this, but i'm not sure..

does seem logical when you think about it

[Secretum]

How can you have comorbid bipolar and major depressive disorders? Doesn't a diagnosis of bipolar I or II disorder assume the presence of major depressive episodes?

[Resident Bipolar]

Originally Posted by Secretum

How can you have comorbid bipolar and major depressive disorders? Doesn't a diagnosis of bipolar I or II disorder assume the presence of major depressive episodes?

Believe it or not, even though Bipolar disorder consists of depressive and manic episodes, it is a completely separate disorder to Major Depressive Disorder and thus both can be diagnosed as separate diagnoses and not all those with Bipolar Disorder will have Major Depressive Disorder.

RB ♥

[hamster-bamster]

OP, you will need to nurse LO so no, you won't immediately have many more options upon childbirth. But there is always therapy!

And since I started limiting hand washing to the bare minimum, I do not get sick with colds because my immunity is stronger. Much recommended. And do not let anybody wash LO upon birth, as. Infants need the film on their skin.

[Secretum]

Believe it or not, even though Bipolar disorder consists of depressive and manic episodes, it is a completely separate disorder to Major Depressive Disorder and thus both can be diagnosed as separate diagnoses and not all those with Bipolar Disorder will have Major Depressive Disorder.

Can you explain more? How does a bipolar person with MDD look different from a bipolar person without MDD?

MDD is diagnosed when a patient has a major depressive episode. All people with bipolar I or II have major depressive episodes, so, if these diagnoses could be simultaneously given, all bipolar patients would also have MDD.

I'm 90% certain that you can't have both...

Did you get your dx of MDD before your dx of bipolar? If so, your diagnosis was probably changed when your doctor got to know you better.