[Icare dixit]

Do you ever think that Western society is (mostly) to blame for our problems. That in a different society, such as in much of Asia, Southern Europe and Latin America we would be accepted for who we are? That our (pre-)manic behaviour is only exaggerated after we are seen as crazy actually us "crazy", manic, it causing enormous stress and anxiety (which might remind us of childhood trauma, maybe a BP parent and guilt) which excesserbated due to unfair/self-served opposition?

That we are just victims of (our) society?

That we would be above averagely adapted to a better, more understanding and caring society, by virtue of our coping skills: to cope with this hopeless society, not ourselves.

Incidence figures worldwide seem (mostly) to on our side of the argument.

[cashart10]

I don't. I had no child hood trauma and no loss of close loved (besides grandparents) one. I was stable for years and then BAM! I slowly began to lose my mind (for the second time ). Since at the time I wasn't seeking help and didn't realize I even needed help, I became very unwell. Once I realized I need help it took a while before I went back to a pdoc because I believed if I did , I would lose my salvation and go to hell. Also, in most cultures and countries bipolar is recognized. I wonder if fewer people in other societys don't seek help because of the huge stigma surrounding it.

I have heard of cultures that regard people with bipolar highly and not mentally ill but I hate that for those individuals because I would imagine the suicidal incidents are even greater while not treated. Those are just some thoughts I have one the matter.

[violetgreen]

I'm happy I live here in the US. When I got P.R. Of China's visas in the past, there is language about mental illness, like it's a big threat. They don't have disability pride (yet), for instance.

[Ocean Swimmer]

It's no great shakes in Central America to have any Mental Problems. Families keep it secret. Not real good care. 2nd class citizen.

[venusss]

I think society is partly at fault. I work in education and I worry about the future generation with the way they are brought up...

Our society has many many many problems. And some of them are WHY am I unhappy at spells.

[Icare dixit]

To be fair, I also agree stigma is probably the biggest problem which keeps incidence figures low because people are ashamed to seek help.

That said, I am not so sure about all cultures being equal, in that respect.
The smaller the number of people getting help, the bigger the stigma. Look for example at unipolar depression.

Much, but certainly not all, of the relative acceptance of episodic unipolar depression is because there are more people afflicted, compared to us (according to some figures maybe as much as 10 to 1 or more).
There are people who want BP-III for that very reason (which, personally, I think is clinically useless).

Childhood trauma doesn't have to be PTSD-like severe. It can be very mild but still make a big impression on a young mind. Of course, there is no reason to think it has to be there. Psychoanalysis luckily doesn't take centre stage anymore when it comes to psychotic disorders (or anything really). To me it seems if there were to be one person who was chronically delusional, it would likely have been Freud.

[venusss]

I was not talking about stigma though. More about the shallowness and lack of values that make me feel so hopeless and make life feel worthless.

I am talking about society that is highly competitive, profit oriented, full of fake people, who don't care for others.

[Roaming_bird]

I desperately wanted to be unipolar, to "just" be depressed. It was hard for me to come to terms with the fact that my times of mania were a problem and abnormal. I've also found that people understand depression much more than they do mania. My dh certainly doesn't see it as a problem when I do all the housecleaning, bake like a fool, and get up early to help him with morning chores (or just do them). He's not embarrassed by my behaviors or obsessions.

So when I complain about feeling manic or having too much energy, he doesn't say much. Now when I'm depressed... he gets that and does everything he can to help.

Oh, and I'm sure he loves all the sex he's getting.

As far as society, I've read stories about societies that basically chain those who have mental illness to their house because there is nothing else they can do to keep their family member safe.

People equate mania as a great thing -- hell, I think it's a great thing in the beginning. But you never hear of anyone wanting to be depressed.

[superfly47]

Most people have been down and sad so they do understand the feeling. They might not understand why people don't get better quickly, but they can sympathize. People have no idea what it is like to be manic.

Back in the 1600s in Europe the mentally were chained in dungeons with criminals. Things have steadily improved, they might have a long ways to go for acceptance but they're getting better.

[Keegan2015]

Here in the USA we have it much better off than people living in Asia or South America. even though living with mental Illness isn't exactly a walk in the park, we have better access to healthcare and more legal protection than many others do.

[Icare dixit]

Originally Posted by venusss

I think society is partly at fault. I work in education and I worry about the future generation with the way they are brought up...

Our society has many many many problems. And some of them are WHY am I unhappy at spells.

Since we we're sharing music in another thread, and I just thought of the relevance to what you wrote, one of my favourites: "Another Brick In The Wall" by Pink Floyd.

I played this one (Part 2) over and over, very loudly, at the ceremony upon receiving my secondary school diploma.

[venusss]

Originally Posted by Keegan2015

Here in the USA we have it much better off than people living in Asia or South America. even though living with mental Illness isn't exactly a walk in the park, we have better access to healthcare and more legal protection than many others do.

It depends on point of view, I think and what does the individual seek, imho.

[Ocean Swimmer]

That's true Keegan. I've seen photos of people chained to a chair with slave like leg irons. There is no help from society in these countries.

The families can't pay for damage their mi relatives may cause. So they put them in irons. Super sad.

I have a picture of a person in a mental institute in Alabama in a a at Geographic magazine. They had a chair. A single bed. And a wire mesh window.
Then there was a photo of a man in jail. He had a fan. An electric hot pot for tea and coffee. Shelf of books. Posters. And a pastor was visiting him to teach him meditation.

I told my husband. I'd rather be a criminal than bipolar. ( oh the photo of the mi person. They hadn't committed a crime.

[Icare dixit]

Originally Posted by Ocean Swimmer

That's true Keegan. I've seen photos of people chained to a chair with slave like leg irons. There is no help from society in these countries.

The families can't pay for damage their mi relatives may cause. So they put them in irons. Super sad.

I have a picture of a person in a mental institute in Alabama in a a at Geographic magazine. They had a chair. A single bed. And a wire mesh window.
Then there was a photo of a man in jail. He had a fan. An electric hot pot for tea and coffee. Shelf of books. Posters. And a pastor was visiting him to teach him meditation.

I told my husband. I'd rather be a criminal than bipolar. ( oh the photo of the mi person. They hadn't committed a crime.

Ok, we get political and may I say maybe a bit nationalistic or culturally chauvinistic here. Just taking a particular picture as reference can be very deceptive.

I have seen pictures of people being tortured in Guantánamo Bay. Have also seen homes for the elderly where people were constantly heavily sedated.

You can take numerous pictures of people in straightjackets, some up against the wall.

Pictures can easily tell lies. I am sure there must be families in the USA that for lack of a straightjacket have restrained people in less accepted but maybe preferable ways, even such as using leg irons or chains (haven't seen the picture but I can image how such a thing may be more civil).

Edit:
Maybe borrow some British self-referential cynicism, or something similar from most Old Countries or some other more established nations, to put things in more balanced perspective. Mental illness being seen as more normal, being more accepted, certainly has advantages, but also major drawbacks: people don't think they need to care because the state or some other institution will provide. Same with the elderly. Enough of them on antipsychotics to handle them or living in filth in their homes. Same effect individualism has on many with psychiatric disorders, stuck at home or in the streets and people looking the other way.

[venusss]

Originally Posted by Icare dixit

Ok, we get political and may I say maybe a bit nationalistic or culturally chauvinistic here. Just taking a particular picture as reference can be very deceptive.

I have seen pictures of people being tortured in Guantánamo Bay. Have also seen homes for the elderly where people were constantly heavily sedated.

You can take numerous pictures of people in straightjackets, some up against the wall.

Pictures can easily tell lies. I am sure there must be families in the USA that for lack of a straightjacket have restrained people in less accepted but maybe preferable ways, even such as using leg irons or chains (haven't seen the picture but I can image how such a thing may be more civil).

And you could argue that the way APs are thrown around, even at childrne in the USA... it doesn't sound as something desirable.

I have seen few documents on drugging kids... in the USA. Judging me these lil Johny can end up on multiple meds for not liking math.