[Icare dixit]

Fewer with SZ (attempt to) commit suicide than those with BP.

Are those with SZ doing something right and those with BP something wrong?

I believe it's the former (not necessarily very deliberately) but not necessarily the latter (so logically the answer would then be "no", but that's not very helpful).

What, if anything, could it be?

I won't try to answer my own question just yet. I'm especially interested what those of you with "just" BP think (I have a schizoaffective disorder, BP type).

[Ocean Swimmer]

I don't think that science knows what causes people to want to kill others or themselves.

[Icare dixit]

Science knows nothing, but science is about theorising. If no one were to have researched this (which is of course not true), any theory would do. Let's assume nothing other than what you know.

[Coconutzo]

I think it's a bit of mind vs mood. Schizophrenia is a disorder of thoughts and bipolar a disorder of emotions. While my understanding of schizophrenia is limited I think thats accurate. I can make sense of more suicides on the bipolar spectrum if that is the case. I know there is overlap on both sides but I think our intense emotional response is to blame .Our emotions lead us to self destructive extremes because our problems seem woven into the fabric of who we are.
It could also be that schizophrenia creates more confusion and distance from the "self" keeping the sufferer safer.

[Moogieotter]

Interesting topic. Bipolar Depression can be very very bad with lots of suicidal ideation.

During my last "full blown manic" episode in 2012, I was def having delusions telling me to slam my car on the freeway or some other suicidal act to "get into heaven sooner" - I just got very very lucky.

Not sure what SZ is like though. Some others have good points. There's some thought that suicide during Bipolar Mixed States is common with the ideation combined with the energy/means to act on them.

From my perspective, SZ might be able to get SSDI/SSI and Medicare covered treatment easier than Bipolar? With the cognitive decline and such of SZ, it has this perception that it is more severe or more debilitating than Bipolar. I could be way off, but that's how I see it.

Nice topic.

moogs

[Icare dixit]

Essentially, I think it's about it being chronic, not (as) episodic: there's no normal to go "back" to. It's liberating once you've accepted that and it's easier to accept it because it's always there. You learn to adapt to a reality that changes. You learn to let go. You learn you can't be like most and you should not want to be. You should be grateful for who you are, not ungrateful for not being what you are not.

[still_crazy]

I've been labeled with schizophrenia by some, bipolar by the current treatment people. I don't know how I'm supposed to "accept" any diagnosis, but that's a different thread.

I think Schizophrenia involves more introversion, more loss of lucidity and less contact with what most people accept as reality. As best I can tell, people who are labeled with Schizophrenia often lose who they are in the psychotic process, so there's an element of disintegration of Self in psychosis, or at least there was/is for me, anyway. Maybe loss of Self=less need to destroy Self?

I dunno. Traditionally, Bipolar I people are higher functioning, less psychosis. They also tend to have more resources at their disposal. Maybe the tension between madness, on the one hand, and also remaining more or less in the mainstream gets to be too much?

Do you know the rates of drug abuse? That might be a big part of it. Divorce rates, too. And social class, education level, gender, age. Suicide rates are affected by a number of variables.

[Icare dixit]

I'm not talking about accepting a diagnosis, but accepting who you are.

And now I understand (better) why you (in particular) started that "what's really going on" thread. Kindred spirits.

I wholeheartedly agree. Same story, different words, if you allow me.

The socio-economic status of those with SZ is lower. I agree that helps a great deal (if that's what you meant). Low status means less conformance (in spirit/thought). Crazier, basically, however mildly it's likely to be (in general).

I don't believe many of those other things matter.

I do not believe one illness has an advantage over the other. It's more about how the illness effects the person. Some people with SZ hear voices constantly but they are kind voices who say nice things and give them compliments. If you medicate the person, the voices who are their friends are taken away and the person can fall into a huge depression. On the flip side, some with SZ are being constantly attacked and tormented and medication doesn't help. They want to kill themselves to put a stop to the non stop terror.

Some with BP have very mild cases and others are completely debilitated.

According to my therapist 2 days ago, my PDOC has diagnosed me wth schizoeffective and my therapist has diagnosed me with BP1 with psychotic features and PTSD. In case my diagnosis is somehow revelvant to my answer for you.

My depressions are torture....mixed states terrifying.....but psychosis is something different entirely. Delusional states and knowing the odd things my mind can do is hard to accept. I do not allow myself to believe it will ever happen again but that is what I always think.

I accept who I am right now just fine. But my mood can play a big part in that. It's impossible to accept myself when depressed....I feel too unacceptable.