[Tucson]

I have often wondered about this. I remember my pdoc taking me to a class of law students. They were able to question me about my M.I and the effects it has on me during my life. One question was to my doctor. One individual asked him if people with BP tend to have above average intelligence. After some “hemming and hawing”, he admitted this is a possibility. I then receive everyone’s applause there. My pdoc said this was the most successful discussion with these legal students that he has witnessed. Now THAT was an experience that I never have had.

I do believe that those with BP are more creative, particularity with how they are able to formulate discussions here. I have found some eloquent posters here who has shown a good command of and creativity with the English language. I have found this to be true on a more regular basis here compared with discussions I have witnessed on other websites.

What do you guys think?

[Jester's Rags]

Well, I'm smarter than the average bear;

I do think there is a correlation, but it's just based on my experience with others I know who have Bipolar Disorder.

The creativity bit also seems to go along with it. You can't do extraordinary things with an 'ordinary' brain and thought process. The mind is a strange thing...it goes beyond the brain in my opinion. The unfortunate part is that in addition to the good, we have to deal with the side effects of having a non-standard brain.

[5150DirtDiva]

I am, but does it really matter? I am just really aware that I can't keep it together and work with people very well. Yay.

My mom had me tested. Unlike Sheldon on Big Bang Theory, it wasn’t a mental health exam. I scored ‘gifted’ on the IQ test, whatever that means. I was disadvantaged on vocabulary section since I was raised by a single mom, foreign.

GPA in college: 3.86 on 4.0 scale

<shrugs>

[Unrigged64072835]

I tested above average on an IQ test, but I probably wouldn't do so well now.

I regard myself as being intelligent and have been called intelligent. Well, I did pretty well in school and in my past jobs, too. I think I am an idea person, and can think outside the box. I will admit that some talents I used to have are not as strong as they were, because of lack of practice/couched periods. Others have strengthened, despite.

I think that people who've spent a good amount of their lives with a hyperthymic temperment can absorb, process, analyze and creatively manipulate more than the average person without. I am also a believer that anyone whose dealt with challenges like we have learns special lessons that less challenged folks don't.

But what if I was born again, same me, but without the bipolar disorder? Would I seem as intelligent as I do? Not sure.

[~Christina]

I think I use to be “ smarter “ book wise, above average but not tons better.

Common sense ? I excel at common sense, I think it’s because I use my 5 senses on a higher level so for me I’m smarter at that then what war started when and who died in 1913....etc.

[still_crazy]

hi. I did read a small study from another country that found a higher rate of what they termed 'pure bipolar I' in highly intelligent men. i guess 'pure bipolar i' means no ocd, anxiety, personality disorder? it was interesting...it was from a country with nationalized health services, so all the data was readily available.

[Miss Laura]

I feel since becoming ill 9 years ago I'm dumb down now. I feel I'm really stupid and I struggle with basic things. I have lost faith in my own ability to do things and I worry others see me as stupid too

[leomama]

Originally Posted by Tucson

I have often wondered about this. I remember my pdoc taking me to a class of law students. They were able to question me about my M.I and the effects it has on me during my life. One question was to my doctor. One individual asked him if people with BP tend to have above average intelligence. After some “hemming and hawing”, he admitted this is a possibility. I then receive everyone’s applause there. My pdoc said this was the most successful discussion with these legal students that he has witnessed. Now THAT was an experience that I never have had.


I do believe that those with BP are more creative, particularity with how they are able to formulate discussions here. I have found some eloquent posters here who has shown a good command of and creativity with the English language. I have found this to be true on a more regular basis here compared with discussions I have witnessed on other websites.


What do you guys think?

Touched by fire the artistic temperament and manic depressive illness. Absolutely. My IQ is very superior, I was a mentally gifted minor, skipped a grade in elementary and have always been at the head of the class when I apply myself.

[Nola0250]

Yes, based on me and others I have known with BP, most definitely.

[Moreta]

I used to be smart, but what does it matter if I can't use it now? Everything is locked away in my brain and I can't access it. I get glimpses of how I used to be, usually when I take a lot of stimulants, but I don't have access to them all the time since I'm not prescribed them.

[wiretwister]

the last psychologist I saw .. said I was the "smartest" person he had ever met ... But he also said he could not keep up with my thought processes ... I know I have forgotten more than I remember ... I would like to think it is just getting old ... guess it really does not matter ...

[Tucson]

Originally Posted by Miss Laura

I feel since becoming ill 9 years ago I'm dumb down now. I feel I'm really stupid and I struggle with basic things. I have lost faith in my own ability to do things and I worry others see me as stupid too

Originally Posted by Moreta

I used to be smart, but what does it matter if I can't use it now? Everything is locked away in my brain and I can't access it. I get glimpses of how I used to be, usually when I take a lot of stimulants, but I don't have access to them all the time since I'm not prescribed them.

I have this same problem. I even have trouble coming up with even five letter words in order to communicate with another person. I also am having right now a problem of dropping my thought process where, for instance, not remembering the reason that I walked to the kitchen. This also happens in discussions. It takes me a couple minutes to recover. For most of my life, I did not remember very significant parts of my life. I am only now beginning to recover from this particular frustration, this being at least thirty years later.

[~Christina]

Originally Posted by still_crazy

hi. I did read a small study from another country that found a higher rate of what they termed 'pure bipolar I' in highly intelligent men. i guess 'pure bipolar i' means no ocd, anxiety, personality disorder? it was interesting...it was from a country with nationalized health services, so all the data was readily available.

Pure Bipolar ??

I have yet to met someone that has bipolar not have anxiety at least, insomnia etc. LOL

Whoever did that study musta been a special kinda dumb.

Sorry still lol’ing. Not at you just a study like that.

[HALLIEBETH87]

I don't know about me. I feel like I used to be smart. I graduated high school
With high academic honors. I was offered good scholarships and an invite to be in honors college. About that time is when my illness really started acting up. I never finished college.

[still_crazy]

i think maybe its part of the diagnosis, or it used to be. even w/o an iq test. mental health ppl can guess-timate your IQ. I sometimes think my social skills and IQ estimate are part of the reason I'm placed in Bipolar-land, vs Schizophrenia.

[Nammu]

I had a Mensa score IQ but I doubt it's still true, that was 40 years ago and I've forgotten everything I ever learned in school.....life lessons tho......do they have a test for those?

[Pookyl]

I know waaay too many stupid people to believe that bipolar = super intelligence

[Guiness187055]

I was gifted in school but I think as I have gotten older I have gotten dumber. Maybe it's just the meds.

[FallDuskTrain]

I have no idea about the answer to your question.
This post seems interesting to me because I perceive being smart as a gift (similar to having a beautiful physical appearance, or being talented as an athlete or a musician) and it is nothing to be proud of or to brag about because the smart person did absolutely nothing to achieve the gift of being smart.
Being smarter than others can be beneficial, given that you are intelligent enough to use your smarts.
And since being smart is not in one's control, mentioning it to others might be perceived as inconsiderate because those who lack this gift will naturally feel inadequate.

[Tucson]

Originally Posted by FallDuskTrain

I have no idea about the answer to your question.
This posts seems interesting to me because I perceive being smart as a gift (similar to having a beautiful physical appearance, or being talented as an athlete, or a musician) and it is nothing to be proud of or to brag about because it is a gift, meaning the smart person did absolutely nothing to achieve the gift of being smart.
Being smarter than others can be beneficial, given that you are intelligent enough to use your smarts.
And since being smart is not in one's control, she/he should not mention it to others because those who lack this gift will naturally feel inadequate.

How true!

It is a gift not to be normally mentioned. I am just curious what other people’s experience here concerning intelligence and BP. I do not see myself as a better person even as it relates to IQ.. There are probably allot better persons then myself. Seriously. Still, this has turned out an interesting discussion. Personally, I think there is a relationship between the two, albeit a rather tenuous connection at best.

[FallDuskTrain]

Originally Posted by Tucson

How true!

It is a gift not to be normally mentioned. I am just curious what other people’s experience here concerning intelligence and BP. I do not see myself as a better person even as it relates to IQ.. There are probably allot better persons then myself. Seriously. Still, this has turned out an interesting discussion. Personally, I think there is a relationship between the two, albeit a rather tenuous connection at best.

I think it is possible that at the time of mania, when a BP person is at her/his highest, she/he can function at her/his best thus being smarter than those with average smartness; and may produce amazing work, be it a poem, or the second chapter of The Idiot, or composing the 9th symphony... This is merely my opinion. I have no research to back it up. Unfortunately, the state of mana is temporary hence the high functioning brain.

[Tucson]

Originally Posted by FallDuskTrain

I think it is possible that at the time of mania, when a BP person is at her/his highest, she/he can function at her/his best thus being smarter than those with average smartness; and may produce amazing work, be it a poem, or the second chapter of The Idiot, or composing the 9th symphony... This is merely my opinion. I have no research to back it up. Unfortunately, the state of mana is temporary hence the high functioning brain.

I think the experience mania provides us is partly subjective. Who they think they are being may be for in part only perceptual instead of real. Remember, they are experiencing reality through the lens mania provides, which can to a certain extent distort reality. Then there is the negative aspects of mania to consider, which can entail impulsive and wreckless behavior. For instance, gleefully darting in and out of traffic. In many cases, mania is not what others make it out to be. Still, like a drug, it makes many feel really good. For better or worse, I would rather experience and deal with actual reality with no need to be manic. I think I am actually more productive in this way, particularity in solving my own personal problems. For example, I do not think introspection is a feature of mania. But this is just my opinion. Many who want to be manic are not solving their own problems, for like some drugs, they are wanting to escape from their life situation. Enough said.

[seesaw]

I've been following this thread because it's an interesting question. I wish some doctor would do an actual empirical study of this. It's hard to know anything based on such a small sampling of anecdotes. I agree with FallDuskTrain that mania probably produces a high-functioning brain. Not BP, but have had psychosis, and I created my very BEST artwork in that state. Amazing stuff that to this day, I cannot recreate at that level of inspiration. It's not the technique I can't recreate, but the passion and inspiration.

I also think even with an empirical study, it would only really tell you the results based on IQ. Because it's a quantifiable, statistical measurement. And yet we know there are multiple kinds of intelligence.

It also would be difficult because you'd have to look at a variety of levels of functioning within the BP diagnosis.

I think if it gives you some comfort to think that your Dx gives you some talents you otherwise wouldn't have, then by all means, see the upside. I often say that having PTSD has given me tools in dealing with conflict and stress that "normies" don't have.

I digress, but I would be interested to see an empirical study on this matter. If it has positive results, it could very well help to decrease stigma about BP.

Seesaw