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Default May 05, 2021 at 06:38 PM
  #21
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Originally Posted by AutumnW0lf View Post
I'm new here and this is only my 2nd post, but thought I'd share what depression is like for me.

I have bipolar 1 and I'm slowly coming out of a bad depressive episode. I slept 12-13 hours a day, then I stayed in bed most of the day. I felt like I couldn't do anything. Couldn't clean or shower, could barely brush my teeth and hair. I couldn't drive or watch TV because I couldn't concentrate on anything. I felt suicidal and had to go into inpatient treatment. It's been a nightmare, I've never been this depressed before

Welcome to the forum, AutumnW0lf. I'm so glad you're starting to come out of what sounds like a hellish depression. How long was the episode?

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Default May 05, 2021 at 07:35 PM
  #22
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Originally Posted by BethRags View Post


Welcome to the forum, AutumnW0lf. I'm so glad you're starting to come out of what sounds like a hellish depression. How long was the episode?
It started at the beginning of February after a bad manic episode and is still going on, but I'm better now. I was prescribed Wellbutrin, so hopefully the depression will be gone soon
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Default May 05, 2021 at 10:04 PM
  #23
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Someone here once described mixed states as "scrubbing the floor with a toothbrush while being unable to stop crying."
I respectfully disagree. Mixed states are way worse. More like trying to paddle an ocean liner with a broken toothpick...while you can't stop crying. 😁

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Default May 06, 2021 at 01:35 AM
  #24
@AutumnW0lf:

Welcome to the forum!

Ta!

Jane.

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Default May 27, 2021 at 12:10 AM
  #25
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Originally Posted by Bugtussel View Post
My depression has aspects of insomnia. I will spontaneously awake between 3 and 4 am. I then become sleepy at all times of the day, but unable to nap. The worst part of my depression is linked to extreme anxiety. I become unable to talk or ask for help. I am trapped with ruminating thoughts inside my head.

Being unable to talk when depressed is one of my biggest issues. It's really tough and I don't know what to do about it.
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Default May 27, 2021 at 05:30 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by BethRags View Post
Many decades ago I experienced very much the same. I was told I had "agitated depression" or "atypical depression", which was treated with antidepressants. Of course, that caused terrible anxiety and irritability/anger (and ecstatic states, but they fluctuated along with the extreme anger). So then they gave me benzos along with the AD. Were mood stabilizers even a thing? Oh, yes...I remember being on lithium for some time, then Depakote. I guess it's just Lamictal that's a more recent medication.
I've had atypical dysthymia for almost 20 years now as my "low baseline". The symptoms truly fit me so well even though I never scored high enough when psychologists gave me the Beck Depression Inventory because my symptoms are just not typical. The "male" depression inventory that I found once online did have me score high tho. For the record, I'm female but atypical depression is kind of the "male" version of depression.

Then about 10 years into the nearly 20 years, I got the first manic + mixed episodes.... I've read in a very good article about how atypical depression differs from "typical" depression (apart from being the "male" version of depression), and how it does often end up in bipolar, I can find it if you or anyone else wants me to.

It also said that typical depression responds well to serotonin based meds while atypical depression responds to dopamine based meds. That fits my experience too.

Btw, your mixed episodes, sounds a lot like what I had for years, ecstatic states plus the extreme anxiety (the latter being "unfelt" and unrecognised in my case). I just didn't really have the anger much with it.

If someone has the "bipolar genes", then yeah, giving ADs can make their bipolar come out sooner in life. Untreated unipolar depression can turn out into bipolar too like it did in my case of atypical dysthymia (I'm not sure how the "typical" depression fares there, other than what that article said).


Did the benzos do anything for you?
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Default May 27, 2021 at 05:35 PM
  #27
The benzo (Klonopin) was helpful for about 2 years. Unfortunately, the helpfulness wore off after that and I ended up stuck with a physical addiction to the stuff. I'm currently doing a very, very slow reduction of Klonopin - after having been on it for 20 years.

I would very much like to read the article, if it's not too much trouble to find it. Thanks!

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Default May 27, 2021 at 05:43 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Soupe du jour View Post
I can differentiate between what were what I call my past "pure depressions" and mixed states. I had many fewer "pure" ones, while my mixed states seem countless.

I have read of differences between unipolar and bipolar depressions, but certainly they can be the same. A couple differences cited include a slightly higher tendency towards insomnia (unipolar) vs. hypersomnia (bipolar depression) and extreme hopelessness/sadness with possible agitation (unipolar) vs. paralyzed depression (bipolar depression).

I guess the above still brings questions about mixed states, but the extent of the agitation, and related additional symptoms, could help differentiate between bipolar vs. not. Also reactions to antidepressants and cycling tendencies.

My few pure depressions have included more hypersomnia and paralysis. My risk for suicide has seemed much lower during pure vs. mixed depression/mania. My thinking and motivation are almost nill during pure depressions. Like a figurative death, of sorts. My self care suffers greatly. I stop caring. Period!

A good journal article on this topic is at (PDF) Clinical differences between bipolar and unipolar depression The study mentioned in this article was rather large.

I'll read that article, thank you for the link. For now I'd just say, I don't link hypersomnia or paralysis to bipolar, and never heard of this being specific to bipolar mood problems, other than the association between atypical depression developing into bipolar depression later.

I think what you call pure depression is what I've seen called typical depression, yeah. I very rarely have that myself, too. I shut down emotionally instead and stuff, I used to have full-on paralysis-like states (thank god that ended), but will react well to positive events from the outside. That's unlike typical/pure depression for sure. If I lose the ability to react to positive stuff like that, then I know I'm deep and I'll get out of there immediately. I don't feel typical/pure depression is me at all. Atypical depression or dysthymia, yeah, I don't want it either but that's just how depression manifests for me. I tolerate it better because it fits my brain better, I figure.

And the bipolar episodes of course, I don't see it as too strongly related. I dunno.

What I do personally link with bipolar though is acute depressions, because they feel like I still have an unstable mood with them, even if not manic or mixed. It just feels like, I don't even know. It's acutely negative and if it goes on and gets deep enough then it can become a crisis. I link it with unstable mood for that reason, maybe, because it's not simply being sad or low, but can go from high to an acute low like this later. The thinking is acutely negative too though not manic or positive at all for sure. Manic only in the sense that it's intense, lol.



It's hard to explain though. I'm not sure if it's just agitation either because I never showed agitation, it would all be inside my head. Just so acute and unstable. I don't know if anyone on here relates, I talked to someone with bipolar once who had it and I loaned the term from them "acute depression" because I recognised myself in it.


Mixed episodes are again a different animal. That has more rapid thinking, some of it postive, ecstatic etc,.... and a lot of crazy anxiety states/thoughts in my case (without me even recognising them as anxiety). Not simply being acutely low and negative, but specifically anxiety, as in, scary ideas/thoughts racing around in your head etc.
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Default May 27, 2021 at 05:53 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by BethRags View Post
The benzo (Klonopin) was helpful for about 2 years. Unfortunately, the helpfulness wore off after that and I ended up stuck with a physical addiction to the stuff. I'm currently doing a very, very slow reduction of Klonopin - after having been on it for 20 years.

I would very much like to read the article, if it's not too much trouble to find it. Thanks!
Ah, yeah with Xanax too I have to be strict with taking it "as needed" because I saw how addictive it started being.

There are anti-anxiety medications that have nothing to do with benzos, though, hope you'll find one that works for you.


I found the article, it was a long time ago that I read it but I remembered it because it made so much sense for me lol. I see now that it links both depressions to bipolar, except it's bipolar I vs II. That part is probably theorising. Also, it calls atypical "anergic", and typical "anxious" here.

It's here: Proposed endophenotypes of dysthymia: evolutionary, clinical and pharmacogenomic considerations | Molecular Psychiatry
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Default May 27, 2021 at 06:53 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Alive99 View Post
Ah, yeah with Xanax too I have to be strict with taking it "as needed" because I saw how addictive it started being.

There are anti-anxiety medications that have nothing to do with benzos, though, hope you'll find one that works for you.

I found the article, it was a long time ago that I read it but I remembered it because it made so much sense for me lol. I see now that it links both depressions to bipolar, except it's bipolar I vs II. That part is probably theorising. Also, it calls atypical "anergic", and typical "anxious" here.

It's here: Proposed endophenotypes of dysthymia: evolutionary, clinical and pharmacogenomic considerations | Molecular Psychiatry

Thank you - the article is educational, for sure. I definitely belong in the "anxious dysthymic" category. *sigh*

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Default May 27, 2021 at 07:54 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by mssweatypalms View Post
Being unable to talk when depressed is one of my biggest issues. It's really tough and I don't know what to do about it.

I wanted to respond to this too. Yeah I've had the feeling. I used to not think I needed help or talk or whatever,.... Now that I'm more out of the episodes (that I had for nearly a decade.....), I'm more focused on just depressive symptoms themselves, and this has been an issue lately for me actually because I want to fight them and that was when I realised I should be talking to people to get help/input from them so I feel a bit better and do things more and just felt like I couldn't.

The one workaround I found for that for now is, because by the evening/at night it all slowly gets better, I wait until then to be able to think about it and figure out what I'll say and do, when I'm to talk to others to get help. And then I write it down on a paper or I try to talk to someone right away (if it's not crazy late yet). And then I can ask them to talk to me next day when I'm too low to try and do it on my own.

That's worked sometimes so far I don't know if you have any better hours during the day like that but if you do, it's worth a try using it for your strategy to deal/cope with it all.
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