[Trace14]

This was posted in the PTSD forum but I meant to post it here, so it's posted twice.

My T has asked me this, and honestly it's a little hard for me to answer.
1. Not sure what the possibilities are for therapy.
2. Would my goal be realistic, or am I setting myself up for disappointment
3. Would I be expecting something to happen too soon
4. Am I over thinking this?

How do you answer this? Do you feel your goals may change as therapy progresses?

[xenos]

1-I think its stupid to ask a patient about the possibilities for therapy!! this doesn't make any sense to me. An experienced therapist knows very well that people seek therapy because they are hurt inside and damaged. They feel defective and they suffer from vicious inner/outer critics attacks. Most of us are guided by therapists to dis-identify from Toxic shame, internalized parents, managing emotional flashbacks. and most of these goals can't be realized before psycho-educating the patient by the therapist.

2- Again without psycho education, most of us can't set realistic goals. Some goals a fight of a life-time. and the healing progression is a two-step forward one-step backward process. Disappointments are part of the process.

3- No.

4- I didn't understand the question.

[Trace14]

Originally Posted by xenos

1-I think its stupid to ask a patient about the possibilities for therapy!! this doesn't make any sense to me. An experienced therapist knows very well that people seek therapy because they are hurt inside and damaged. They feel defective and they suffer from vicious inner/outer critics attacks. Most of us are guided by therapists to dis-identify from Toxic shame, internalized parents, managing emotional flashbacks. and most of these goals can't be realized before psycho-educating the patient by the therapist.

2- Again without psycho education, most of us can't set realistic goals. Some goals a fight of a life-time. and the healing progression is a two-step forward one-step backward process. Disappointments are part of the process.

3- No.

4- I didn't understand the question.

4- Am I making this harder than it has to, or should, be?

[reb569]

I honestly think that when therapists ask that question, they aren't necessarily looking for a well-thought out response. I think the question first, makes you think about it, and 2. Helps them determine where you are at by your response. I think any good therapist, when asking that question, if they receive a response of, "I don't know", would be fine with that answer. I've heard that question from not only my therapist, but my daughter's pdoc and therapists have asked me the same thing as it relates to my daughter. I think it helps them "set the bar", determine where you are at, and helps them gauge your progress.

I would expect that, yes, over time, goals of therapy would change.

[Trace14]

Originally Posted by reb569

I honestly think that when therapists ask that question, they aren't necessarily looking for a well-thought out response. I think the question first, makes you think about it, and 2. Helps them determine where you are at by your response. I think any good therapist, when asking that question, if they receive a response of, "I don't know", would be fine with that answer. I've heard that question from not only my therapist, but my daughter's pdoc and therapists have asked me the same thing as it relates to my daughter. I think it helps them "set the bar", determine where you are at, and helps them gauge your progress.

I would expect that, yes, over time, goals of therapy would change.

You may be right that any answer would be acceptable. It would be more my issue about wanting to provide a good, thought out goal

[reb569]

Right now I'm not sure what my goals are for therapy once I start going back (if I actually do). I continue to try to convince myself that I really don't need it, that I'm ok, that despite experiencing and witnessing horrific abuse starting from my first memories at around 4 years old through the day I headed off to basic training, I survived it and I'm ok. I know I'm trying to minimize what I went through, I know I dissociate, sometimes daily, I know that I tend to socially isolate myself, I know I don't trust easy, I know that I have to know where all the exits are when I enter a room (don't like people walking up behind me, strict 3 foot rule, don't like crowds, have to have my back to a wall, have to have an escape plan). It goes on and on, but yup, I've got myself convinced that "I'm OK". I can see my answer to this question now, "To confirm I don't need therapy", even though I obviously do. CPTSD is grand isn't it?

[Fuzzybear]

Originally Posted by xenos

1-I think its stupid to ask a patient about the possibilities for therapy!! this doesn't make any sense to me. An experienced therapist knows very well that people seek therapy because they are hurt inside and damaged. They feel defective and they suffer from vicious inner/outer critics attacks. Most of us are guided by therapists to dis-identify from Toxic shame, internalized parents, managing emotional flashbacks. and most of these goals can't be realized before psycho-educating the patient by the therapist.

2- Again without psycho education, most of us can't set realistic goals. Some goals a fight of a life-time. and the healing progression is a two-step forward one-step backward process. Disappointments are part of the process.

3- No.

4- I didn't understand the question.

I have no idea

[Open Eyes]

Originally Posted by Trace14

This was posted in the PTSD forum but I meant to post it here, so it's posted twice.

My T has asked me this, and honestly it's a little hard for me to answer.
1. Not sure what the possibilities are for therapy.
2. Would my goal be realistic, or am I setting myself up for disappointment
3. Would I be expecting something to happen too soon
4. Am I over thinking this?

How do you answer this? Do you feel your goals may change as therapy progresses?

Given what I know about PTSD from my own experience, I don't think I would ask those questions if I was a therapist. People who struggle with PTSD are not sure what therapy will help them, they are often confused and depending on where they are in the challenge some patients are desperate.

When it comes to trauma, and childhood trauma a patient needs to be able to have a therapist sit and "listen" as they tell their story because the one thing MOST trauma patients suffer is how they were alone when a lot of things happened to them. What a therapist is there to help with is BE A WITNESS.

One of the reasons for withdrawl and having a desire to retreat and be alone is how that is what a child does to gain some sense of safety. There are things we all learn in our childhood that we are simply not aware of. We most definitely become VERY aware though when something traumatic enough happens and we develop the crippling symptoms of PTSD to where it's so intrusive it presents us with sensitivities we don't understand. Every single person I have come across says the same thing, "I want to "just" like I used to and I don't understand why I can't like I used to and I don't know how to explain how bad it is so others understand it.

There is a saying, "We may not remember exactly what someone says, but we never forget how it makes us feel". That is one of the best explanations of how we all develop as human beings.

My daughter dated a guy that I thought was a really nice guy and I also thought he was good looking and the best in that area of all the ones she had dated. She told me one time that he was often distracted by his looks and was especially self critical about his stomach being fat even though it was not really fat. She said to me he seemed a bit feminine and she was not sure about him. Then she found out that when he was growing up he was chubby and the other children used to make fun of him and that "hurt" him and made him self conscious. My therapist told me that his problem is that even though he is thinner and good looking, he still "feels" insecure about himself as he did when he was young. Again, proof of what I said about "We may not remember exactly what someone says, but we never forget how it makes us feel".

The thing about human beings is that we are designed to adapt to whatever environment we are raised in. We have learned that this begins even before we are born. A fetus begins learning about the world it is about to be born in from the mother's diet. What sustains it in utero sustains it after it is born as well. We are still learning a lot about what happens when it comes to how a human being develops and what happens genetically to the mother and father that contributes to the genetics of their offspring.

When you sit across from a therapist, you need HELP and one of the things people need help with is in finding their OWN inner peace. You wrote a letter remember? That letter is reflecting some deep desires you have in "you" that are important to "you".

One day I had a woman come out to my farm and all I knew about her is that she was a doctor of some kind. She brought out her three year old grand daughter. As soon as she drove up and got out of her car I got an impression of her and I knew that she was the type of individual that was "self" important. That told me how to best make her feel at ease and that meant give "her" the control as best I could.

So, I did that and began to see how she was with her grand child. What she did with that child is constantly order her to sit up. And that is the main thing this woman wanted this little child to keep doing, however, I knew from working with countless children around that age is that they most definitely get distracted and notoriously fail to maintain "doing" what they are ordered to do.

After this woman got to a point of frustration as this child kept failing to maintain what this woman wanted of her, she finally gave me permission to take over. I stopped the pony and talked to the child and "engaged" the child. I asked the child some questions and discovered this child loved the idea of being a princess. So, continuing to engage the child, I talked to her about what a princess does that makes her a princess, a pretty princess. Part of that was how a "real" princess sits. I showed her the difference between a slouch in myself, and then how I would change my body to looking better and proud just like EVERY princess does. Then we walked around and instead of barking orders at her to sit up like her grandmother did, I simply asked from time to time, "how is the princess, are you sitting like a princess?" and she quickly responded.

This woman upon observing me acted like what I did was a revelation, amazing, profound. That is when I learned what kind of doctor this woman was. This woman was a doctor of child psychology and not only did she specialize in working with children as a psychologist, but she also was a college professor. She told me I was very gifted and should make it a point to be a child psychologist. That is not the first time I was told to pursue that field by a psychologist but also a psychiatrist. I do appreciate the compliment, but IMHO, what I did is "basic". Yet, what I had already been doing was working with children, and I specialized in working with young children. I had already spent years teaching children, but doing so in a way that focused on teaching them "self esteem" and to learn how they can learn even when they might be "afraid" and yes, get distracted. But, it was not about "me" and barking orders at any of them, instead the focus was on "them" and what THEY wanted and how each child learned "best", and they were all different.

When you reach out to a therapist, the important thing in that therapist is how their education and letters doesn't end up being all about THEM. The same is true for a teacher as well as a lot of professionals and even parents.

What I have noticed about you Trace, is how you respond well to the material you read that YOU can relate to that reaches YOU, ALL ABOUT YOU. I looked at those questions and I could not help to think how those are the questions a therapist would ask themselves about the patient by "listening" to the patient.

Your question, "How do you answer this?". You don't know and that is what your therapist is supposed to help you with. Ofcourse a patient that is struggling with PTSD/complex PTSD is overthinking. That is one of the symptoms.

[Trace14]

Originally Posted by reb569

Right now I'm not sure what my goals are for therapy once I start going back (if I actually do). I continue to try to convince myself that I really don't need it, that I'm ok, that despite experiencing and witnessing horrific abuse starting from my first memories at around 4 years old through the day I headed off to basic training, I survived it and I'm ok. I know I'm trying to minimize what I went through, I know I dissociate, sometimes daily, I know that I tend to socially isolate myself, I know I don't trust easy, I know that I have to know where all the exits are when I enter a room (don't like people walking up behind me, strict 3 foot rule, don't like crowds, have to have my back to a wall, have to have an escape plan). It goes on and on, but yup, I've got myself convinced that "I'm OK". I can see my answer to this question now, "To confirm I don't need therapy", even though I obviously do. CPTSD is grand isn't it?

Oh yes, the more I know the more confusing it gets.

[Trace14]

Originally Posted by Fuzzybear

I have no idea

Fuzzy Bear you have made a lot of positive contributions to my posts as well as others. Maybe you just need a break, then come back when you are ready to post.

[Trace14]

Originally Posted by Open Eyes

Given what I know about PTSD from my own experience, I don't think I would ask those questions if I was a therapist. People who struggle with PTSD are not sure what therapy will help them, they are often confused and depending on where they are in the challenge some patients are desperate.

When it comes to trauma, and childhood trauma a patient needs to be able to have a therapist sit and "listen" as they tell their story because the one thing MOST trauma patients suffer is how they were alone when a lot of things happened to them. What a therapist is there to help with is BE A WITNESS.

One of the reasons for withdrawl and having a desire to retreat and be alone is how that is what a child does to gain some sense of safety. There are things we all learn in our childhood that we are simply not aware of. We most definitely become VERY aware though when something traumatic enough happens and we develop the crippling symptoms of PTSD to where it's so intrusive it presents us with sensitivities we don't understand. Every single person I have come across says the same thing, "I want to "just" like I used to and I don't understand why I can't like I used to and I don't know how to explain how bad it is so others understand it.

There is a saying, "We may not remember exactly what someone says, but we never forget how it makes us feel". That is one of the best explanations of how we all develop as human beings.

My daughter dated a guy that I thought was a really nice guy and I also thought he was good looking and the best in that area of all the ones she had dated. She told me one time that he was often distracted by his looks and was especially self critical about his stomach being fat even though it was not really fat. She said to me he seemed a bit feminine and she was not sure about him. Then she found out that when he was growing up he was chubby and the other children used to make fun of him and that "hurt" him and made him self conscious. My therapist told me that his problem is that even though he is thinner and good looking, he still "feels" insecure about himself as he did when he was young. Again, proof of what I said about "We may not remember exactly what someone says, but we never forget how it makes us feel".

The thing about human beings is that we are designed to adapt to whatever environment we are raised in. We have learned that this begins even before we are born. A fetus begins learning about the world it is about to be born in from the mother's diet. What sustains it in utero sustains it after it is born as well. We are still learning a lot about what happens when it comes to how a human being develops and what happens genetically to the mother and father that contributes to the genetics of their offspring.

When you sit across from a therapist, you need HELP and one of the things people need help with is in finding their OWN inner peace. You wrote a letter remember? That letter is reflecting some deep desires you have in "you" that are important to "you".

One day I had a woman come out to my farm and all I knew about her is that she was a doctor of some kind. She brought out her three year old grand daughter. As soon as she drove up and got out of her car I got an impression of her and I knew that she was the type of individual that was "self" important. That told me how to best make her feel at ease and that meant give "her" the control as best I could.

So, I did that and began to see how she was with her grand child. What she did with that child is constantly order her to sit up. And that is the main thing this woman wanted this little child to keep doing, however, I knew from working with countless children around that age is that they most definitely get distracted and notoriously fail to maintain "doing" what they are ordered to do.

After this woman got to a point of frustration as this child kept failing to maintain what this woman wanted of her, she finally gave me permission to take over. I stopped the pony and talked to the child and "engaged" the child. I asked the child some questions and discovered this child loved the idea of being a princess. So, continuing to engage the child, I talked to her about what a princess does that makes her a princess, a pretty princess. Part of that was how a "real" princess sits. I showed her the difference between a slouch in myself, and then how I would change my body to looking better and proud just like EVERY princess does. Then we walked around and instead of barking orders at her to sit up like her grandmother did, I simply asked from time to time, "how is the princess, are you sitting like a princess?" and she quickly responded.

This woman upon observing me acted like what I did was a revelation, amazing, profound. That is when I learned what kind of doctor this woman was. This woman was a doctor of child psychology and not only did she specialize in working with children as a psychologist, but she also was a college professor. She told me I was very gifted and should make it a point to be a child psychologist. That is not the first time I was told to pursue that field by a psychologist but also a psychiatrist. I do appreciate the compliment, but IMHO, what I did is "basic". Yet, what I had already been doing was working with children, and I specialized in working with young children. I had already spent years teaching children, but doing so in a way that focused on teaching them "self esteem" and to learn how they can learn even when they might be "afraid" and yes, get distracted. But, it was not about "me" and barking orders at any of them, instead the focus was on "them" and what THEY wanted and how each child learned "best", and they were all different.

When you reach out to a therapist, the important thing in that therapist is how their education and letters doesn't end up being all about THEM. The same is true for a teacher as well as a lot of professionals and even parents.

What I have noticed about you Trace, is how you respond well to the material you read that YOU can relate to that reaches YOU, ALL ABOUT YOU. I looked at those questions and I could not help to think how those are the questions a therapist would ask themselves about the patient by "listening" to the patient.

Your question, "How do you answer this?". You don't know and that is what your therapist is supposed to help you with. Ofcourse a patient that is struggling with PTSD/complex PTSD is overthinking. That is one of the symptoms.

I guess what was most surprising is that once you tell them what your goal is they never ask if it is the same goal during the therapy. So the client and the T may be on different tracks about the goals for the client. Or does the goal even matter? Will a T naturally do what they do no matter what the goal is???