I have no words

AAAAA · Nov 30, 2010 at 07:01 PM

Too late to add a trigger Icon----------------------------------------

Yesterday a boy took 23 students and a teacher hostage in a neighboring school for roughly 6 hours. It ended with the boy taking his own life.

I am at a loss. My youngest son goes to that school several times a week for extra-cirricular activities (which are all put on hold of course). Both boys are friends with several kids there. There is a lot of speculation at this point. His parents are not forthcoming with information which I can understand.

Today another neighboring school was evacuated because someone called in a threat (most likely a prank).

None of this makes any sense. I'm not sure how to discuss this with my kids in a positive way. Is there a postive way to discuss this? Someone failed this boy somewhere. There is a great deal of speculation that this was related to bullying. He was a good student, well mannered, good grades, by all accounts a nice boy. There but by the Grace of God...

It really scares me. I didn't have the TV on, so I had no idea that anything was going on until my daughter called. Right before my phone rang I was having a conversation with my youngest son. He had a bad day and I was asking him to talk about it. He had made the comment "you wouldn't understand mom, its a teen thing" (only partically tongue in cheek). As the phone rang I was saying "I wasn't born a middle aged woman, the fashions change but the problems are the same."

The problems are different! I never had to worry about a schoolmate bringing two handguns to school and threatening to kill people. I just don't know how to deal with this situation.

pachyderm · Dec 01, 2010 at 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAAAA

The problems are different! I never had to worry about a schoolmate bringing two handguns to school and threatening to kill people.

The problems are the same, or very similar. It's just that they are more extreme now. I think it is the "degree" that has changed, not the "kinds" of problems.

I heard on the radio this morning that the boy's parents said they did not know what had caused him to do what he did.

serafim_etal · Dec 01, 2010 at 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pachyderm

The problems are the same, or very similar. It's just that they are more extreme now. I think it is the "degree" that has changed, not the "kinds" of problems.

I'm doing my senior thesis on a topic related to children and crime. I am finding that it may not even be the "degree" or how extreme the actions are that is the problem. It is the media that makes it seem this way. It's not that horrible things are happening more, or that they are more extreme, its that we all hear about them more rapidly and more frequently. The reporting is far more widespread and graphic. When I was a kid, a snatched child (for example) was local news (maybe) and sometimes appeared on milk cartons. Now it is national or even worldwide news...for weeks and even months.

In fact, this thread is a perfect example! How many people read this thread? Where in the world are they? Would that have been possible 20 years ago? I'm NOT saying this thread is bad...just that it is an example of how quickly, and how widespread information can be passed on to others now.

pachyderm · Dec 01, 2010 at 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by serafim_etal

it may not even be the "degree" or how extreme the actions are that is the problem. It is the media that makes it seem this way.

Yeah, that could well be. Hype sells? Sometimes I think that many of the people we may look to (TV or movie producers, fashion designers, etc.) are not the healthiest, emotionally speaking...

AAAAA · Dec 01, 2010 at 01:40 PM

I understand what you're saying about the amount of information available now, but when I was growing up if these types of crimes existed, they happened somewhere else. It didn't happen here.

My husband and I made a conscious decision to move back "home" because we wanted a safe, secure place to raise our children. We knew that it limited his income prospects, but it was a price we were willing to pay.

We can still leave our keys in our car and leave our houses unlocked. Fed ex can leave a package on our front steps and it will be there when we get home. It's a good place to live and raise a family.

I did not know this boy or his family. I'm rather antisocial. Friends of my children did know him and by all accounts he was a good kid. We never really know what happens in the minds of other people, or what is going on in their home. That has not changed.

I think that perhaps the schools in this area have felt a little too secure themselves. Bullying is viewed as "boys will be boys".

I was stunned at a conversation with one of my twin's friends. He said (about the boy's death) that "it was unavoidable. What else is going to happen when you walk into a school with loaded guns? You have two choices, shoot yourself or have the police shoot you." WHAT? How about option 3, put the guns down and everyone leaves alive? The boy I was talking to did not actually concider that as an option!

Hype does sell. Who would watch the news if they came on and said "nothing horrible happened today. The sun was shinning and everyone put sun screen on before they went outside."

I am rambling I know, I'm trying very hard to process something that has no explaination.

At the news conference announcing that poor boy's death one spokesperson said "the one person that could tell us why this happened is dead, we may never get any answers." I find this unacceptable! I know logically it is accurate, but I want answers! I want to know what would make a seemingly normal boy go so far over the edge that he felt this was his best plan of action.

There is a reason adults make decisions for teenagers. They think they know a lot more than they do. They don't realize that things change. Did the adults in this boy's life fail him or was he an expert at hiding things? Was this his first cry for help?

I do respect the family's right to privacy. Their whole world just crashed! I could not recover from the loss of my child. A loss in this manner would bring such huge guilt issues with it. Hindsight is 20/20.

I guess what scares the hell out of me is that there are no answers. There is no way to solve this problem.

pachyderm · Dec 01, 2010 at 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAAAA

There is no way to solve this problem.

Listen to your children?

AAAAA · Dec 01, 2010 at 07:45 PM

Can it be that simple? Based upon my own teenage years and thoughts I have emphasized to my own children that nothing is forever. That no matter what they are going through I will love them unconditionally and support them. As I sit here I can say without a doubt in my mind that there is no way this is something my own children could do... but didn't this boy's parents think the same thing?

pachyderm · Dec 02, 2010 at 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAAAA

Can it be that simple? Based upon my own teenage years and thoughts I have emphasized to my own children that nothing is forever. That no matter what they are going through I will love them unconditionally and support them.

Is that talking to them, and not listening to see what comes from them?

AAAAA · Dec 02, 2010 at 01:03 PM

I definately talk to them. Some things I think are just too important to wait for them to bring up. But I also listen to them. I am pretty fortunate that my kids faces are pretty expressive. They let on a lot without really knowing.

They seem to be handling this situation better than I. They are willing to accept that this is just the way things are sometimes and do not need to put it in a box. Perhaps it is because they feel so immortal at this age. Maybe it is because this doesn't seem as rare to them as it does to me. Maybe they're just smarter than I.

lynn P. · Dec 02, 2010 at 01:15 PM

((((AAAAA)))) - this is a very sad event and the kids and teacher in that room are going to need counselling. This could have been even more tragic if it wasn't for the calm teacher and kids. He may have intended to do worse but changed his mind.

Did the police try to reassure him, this could end safely?? Have you heard anything about the boy's past? I think kids need to know they have someone to vent about their frustrations. I also think it's important to talk about suicide because when kids are teenagers, everything is so dramatic and the end of the world sometimes. They need the ability to look beyond the moment. How are your kids handling this right now?

AAAAA · Dec 02, 2010 at 01:42 PM

From all accounts (news and people that I know that knew this boy) he was a good kid. Decent student (grades and behavior), generally a nice boy.

My two theories were either there was a girl involved or there was bullying involved. Bullying seems to be the front runner although the school wouldn't release that information and the parents are not talking as far as I know. Three differnet boys that are in my home several times a week and several boys that my youngest son does his Marine functions with that attend that school say that particular school is a haven for that bullying behavior. I do not think Marinette is unique in that area.

As relatively crime free as this area is, there is a lot of bullying that goes on. My older twin attends a virtual school because he has been bullied since Jr. High because he is gay. The Principal actually said that there was nothing he could do because at that point is "was only verbal." I took it as far as the school board but my husband, son and I decided that the path of least resistance was best. It was getting to the point that my younger twin was getting in physical fights defending his brother which made him the bad guy. The only reason the younger one wasn't suspended was because the boy he got into a fight with actually used language (swearing) that was against the school policy. It wasn't because he called my son a fag, it was because he called him an f---ing fag. Not because he said my son should be shot, but because he said he should be f---ing shot.

There have been times when I have had to drag these people into the 20th century. In HS a student pinched my daughter's boob in front of teacher and it was greeted as "boys will be boys". He exposed himself to ME and six teenaged girls. I had to remind them (and the boy's parents) that the STATE has a zero sexual abuse policy and I notified my daughter and all of her friends that since the school will not deal with it directly to call the police.

There was an incident in our school last year with a student that brought a gun and knives to school. He left them in his car and never actually brought them into the school.

Is it wrong that I hope that this isn't the case, that I hope that he was just disturbed? Don't get me wrong I truly feel for him and his whole family, but the reason that boy was in that room matters to me. I don't want to establish blame, I just want to know how he fell through the cracks.

lynn P. · 03:06 PM

I'm sorry your family members have been hurt from bullying.

I agree...bullying is a huge problem. I think it's important to understand what caused this boy to act out in such a violent manner. Most cases of young people using guns in this type of situation are past victims of bullying. I know it's frustrating having kids this age. I hope the area where you live will this in the same direction as you and try to understand what went wrong.

AAAAA · Dec 02, 2010 at 08:12 PM

Well it turns out that both my theories may have been correct. It turns out that this boy's girlfriend publically dumped him then set about rubbing it in his face. It is really sad situation.

lynn P. · Dec 02, 2010 at 08:16 PM

That's very sad AAAAA. I really think and I've thought this for a while - that schools should teach relationship etiquette and how to handle relationships....discuss red flags in relationships like abuse. They should know not to humiliate or behave in vindictive ways.

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AAAAA Elder Member Since Oct 2007 Location: Midwest Posts: 5,042 16 1 hugs given	Dec 02, 2010 at 08:12 PM #13 Well it turns out that both my theories may have been correct. It turns out that this boy's girlfriend publically dumped him then set about rubbing it in his face. It is really sad situation. __________________ I've been married for 24 years and have four wonderful children.
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