[very_confused]

Hello,

I am new here. I think I have a problem. I'm very disturbed by society, by people, by everything around me. I don't mean for this to be a diatribe; I only want to explain my dismay. I feel very out of place, like I shouldn't be here. I often wish that there were a place to be brainwashed, or that we were all brainwashed institutionally so we could all agree. I think people find me very intimidating, as I don't smile a whole lot. I do not remember a lot of my childhood. My current life is a bit hectic.

I have very little faith in therapy for myself, because I know that there is such a volume of history behind me, and in every person, that we have all experienced, and I could show or reveal one part while concealing the rest to make the diagnosis go as I want... The questions asked of me are not subtle enough that I don't see through them, and it is no longer accurate.

Somehow, I am compelled that finding a significant other would satisfy me, as they would be a person I could open up with (I know this expectation is a bit unrealistic, but it is desirable nonetheless). Ironically, I am very anxious about talking with women. Most of my friends do not bring girls or their girlfriends around, and I am very apprehensive about approaching women I do not know, as I feel they assume the worst (I know I would if I were accosted or interrupted).

There are too many particular facets of society that I find confusing or otherwise nonsensical to list economically, though it has been described by a friend that it does not seem like I want to be human, but a machine. I agree that being a machine would significantly facilitate life (if not in fact negate it and its hardships!), but I fear too much discipline. I don't know.

What do I do? What can I do?

Sincerely,
Me

[Slothrop]

Feeling that society is all messed up just shows that you are thinking rationally...

But yes, I do think that being unable to adapt and attain some degree of societal comfort is pretty typical of mental issues...depression, etc.

The hopelessness, the thinking in absolutes (it will never work for me, etc.) are typical of depression.

Your friend's comment that you seem like you want to be a machine--perhaps your emotions are causing you a lot of distress, and it'd be easier to switch them off and just get things done? I certainly feel that way at times, but less so since finding effective treatment for my bipolar II.

You might be surprised at how effective psychiatric treatment can be, how much it can help you regain control (rather than taking it away from you). It certainly surprised me. It doesn't work for everyone equally, but it is worth a try.

[ziggy1]

Let me ask you this....Do you think you feel out of place today because
of what happened in your childhood???

You did mention you don't remember a whole lot of your childhood. I have
had issues of feeling out of place because of my childhood and it took
me a long time to feel better as an adult due to my childhood.

Do you think this could be related???

Welcome to Psych Central by the way...you've found
a great site.......Good luck.....

[Lenny]

Originally Posted by very_confused

I have very little faith in therapy for myself, because I know that there is such a volume of history behind me, and in every person, that we have all experienced, and I could show or reveal one part while concealing the rest to make the diagnosis go as I want... The questions asked of me are not subtle enough that I don't see through them, and it is no longer accurate.

Hi confused and welcome to PC...

A very intersting first post. You included alot.

The above quote is curious.

Your faith is diminished because you can control the outcome?

First,,I think that might be a bit presumptuous,,,some pros are real good at what they do and understand this aspect of therapy quite well.

Secondly,,say you go to a mechanic and ask them to fix your car. You know the brakes are bad,,but you tell them to fix your battery. He checks your battery and tells you it is not failing. You tell him to fix it anyway. He does. He charges you,,you pay.

You leave with bad brakes.

What's wrong with this story?

With care,

Lenny

[digdug]

Hi vc, and welcome.

It's funny that you think of yourself as being a "machine" (or at least you put so much stock in your friend describing you as such), when it seems as if what you want the most is a friend and/or companion to confide in. That's the most human thing in the world to want.

I don't know where I'd be right now if it weren't for my wife. I don't make friends easy, and have changed so much over the years that the friends I do have, I typically lose (people usually don't change with you). I am lucky that my wife and I met and "hit it off" quite quickly, though we were good friends for a while before we took things up a notch.

Apprehension about talking to women is also one of the most normal things a guy can feel. It's tough...sometimes very tough...to meet someone and strike up a conversation and make a new friend or girlfriend. Heck, there's a reason why marriages were arranged in most societies for so long (well, there are a lot of reasons, but I think that that's one of them).

Oh, and yes, we do live in disturbing times, so noticing that is not strange at all. Beleive me, you're as human as can be.

If you want tips on how to meet and make friends, there are plenty of people here that can help you. One thing I might advise to post in one of the more popular forums, such as the relationships one...that will also give you the advantage of getting advice from the ladies of this forum, which can be invaluable for this sort of thing.

[Simcha]

Originally Posted by Lenny

Hi confused and welcome to PC...

A very intersting first post. You included alot.

The above quote is curious.

Your faith is diminished because you can control the outcome?

First,,I think that might be a bit presumptuous,,,some pros are real good at what they do and understand this aspect of therapy quite well.

Secondly,,say you go to a mechanic and ask them to fix your car. You know the brakes are bad,,but you tell them to fix your battery. He checks your battery and tells you it is not failing. You tell him to fix it anyway. He does. He charges you,,you pay.

You leave with bad brakes.

What's wrong with this story?

With care,

Lenny

Good points Lenny!

[Simcha]

Originally Posted by very_confused

Hello,

I am new here. I think I have a problem. I'm very disturbed by society, by people, by everything around me. I don't mean for this to be a diatribe; I only want to explain my dismay. I feel very out of place, like I shouldn't be here. I often wish that there were a place to be brainwashed, or that we were all brainwashed institutionally so we could all agree. I think people find me very intimidating, as I don't smile a whole lot. I do not remember a lot of my childhood. My current life is a bit hectic.

I have very little faith in therapy for myself, because I know that there is such a volume of history behind me, and in every person, that we have all experienced, and I could show or reveal one part while concealing the rest to make the diagnosis go as I want... The questions asked of me are not subtle enough that I don't see through them, and it is no longer accurate.

Somehow, I am compelled that finding a significant other would satisfy me, as they would be a person I could open up with (I know this expectation is a bit unrealistic, but it is desirable nonetheless). Ironically, I am very anxious about talking with women. Most of my friends do not bring girls or their girlfriends around, and I am very apprehensive about approaching women I do not know, as I feel they assume the worst (I know I would if I were accosted or interrupted).

There are too many particular facets of society that I find confusing or otherwise nonsensical to list economically, though it has been described by a friend that it does not seem like I want to be human, but a machine. I agree that being a machine would significantly facilitate life (if not in fact negate it and its hardships!), but I fear too much discipline. I don't know.

What do I do? What can I do?

Sincerely,
Me

Hi, and welcome. I'm sorry that your struggling with so much and having no one to understand you in "real life". I can certainly comprehend a lot of what your saying though. I've been confused with society for most of my youth--until I stopped caring about trying to understand society and started trying to understand myself.

I see no benefit to being a machine. To be a machine implies that you would have to be created by man---I don't think machines have discipline, or feelings, or anything--they don't exist as anything other than hardware controlled, created by, and used exclusively by humans for our benefit. That said, I'm sure you'd agree that there is no advantage to being a machine.

Okay, with therapy--- it's a step process. Therapists who reach to deep, too far, too fast, without showing their trustworthiness are pretty useless. If you've not found one that you feel like you could share with in the past, it's likely because you didn't stay with them long enough and/or only told them what you wanted them to believe. As you know, it's not helpful to you to see therapists if your not willing to work with them about your real problems. However, it's perfectly understandable if you were forced into therapy, and/or didn't like your therapist.

Consider starting fresh. Your past doesn't have to dictate your future.
Don't give up.

[nowheretorun]

Hi very confused

i felt a lot like you at one point in time and it lasted awhile and grew and grew until it had been nearly thirty years until i figured a few things out to make it easier for myself, i hope this can help you too..

first, never try to allow others to provide you with what you believe is missing within yourself... it is not fair to you or them and we cannot always rely on others to be present in our moment of need.. as best we are able, life is about learning to build an inner and independent strength as our most reliable ally...

second, allow yourself to feel as you feel... there is nothing wrong that cant be remedied somehow..

you have a great amount of value as an individual and as a mate... know the difference between leaning and propping... let ladies go first always... even if they are the type to take advantage of generosity, generosity is a good trait to have whenever you deal with anyone of either gender... never allow yourself to be taken for granted... you matter because of all the good you can do for others and because you are part of a large circle of caring people who also care about you...

we each bring a part to life and this world and you are in a place to make a difference in your own life as well as any others who happen to be nearby... if it is kindness and connection you seek, be kind and connective to others, as well as to yourself...

you dont seem to far away from understanding yourself and your world in a healthy way, just dont give up..

wishing you the best always...

[very_confused]

I can only reply to a few!

Originally Posted by Lenny

Hi confused and welcome to PC...

A very intersting first post. You included alot.

The above quote is curious.

Your faith is diminished because you can control the outcome?

First,,I think that might be a bit presumptuous,,,some pros are real good at what they do and understand this aspect of therapy quite well.

Secondly,,say you go to a mechanic and ask them to fix your car. You know the brakes are bad,,but you tell them to fix your battery. He checks your battery and tells you it is not failing. You tell him to fix it anyway. He does. He charges you,,you pay.

You leave with bad brakes.

What's wrong with this story?

With care,

Lenny

Your metaphor is inadequate here. Rather, a more enlightening scenario is to have never even looked under the hood of a car in your life, but all of a sudden, there is a noise. You have no idea how to fix this noise, but every day, it grows louder, in your commute, when you're with your friends, in your sleep, when you watch television, in your music, and when you're trying to think. There are constant reminders everywhere of how awful this noise in and how frequent it is in your vehicle. Finally, you get fed up and take it to the mechanic; you exclaim that something must be done, that the issue is not with you but it is the car that errs, that tortures you for no other reason than your use of it. You would rather abandon it, drop it off in a lake or in a compactor... Though, that seems a bit extreme, doesn't it? The mechanic looks at you blankly, asks you what kind of noise, tells you to describe the noise, where the noise comes from, what have you, but this only further agitates you. Instead, you decide to walk, but you can't walk everywhere in today's world. You develop blisters and callouses on your feet. You're too worn before work, and finally you're unfit for even your profession. Eventually you'll forget even how to drive before you consider going back to that wretched, over-complicated, wasteful, and absurd deathtrap. Then what? I don't know. Yea, they can be fun, they can be useful, they can bring in money, they can waste your money, they can solve your problems, and they can wreck your life.

To simplify, the car is emotions...

Originally Posted by Simcha

I see no benefit to being a machine. To be a machine implies that you would have to be created by man---I don't think machines have discipline, or feelings, or anything--they don't exist as anything other than hardware controlled, created by, and used exclusively by humans for our benefit. That said, I'm sure you'd agree that there is no advantage to being a machine.

No benefit? How do you mean? Does your computer worry about you when you're gone? Does it panic about your records if the house is on fire? Does it care? I think not. You confuse me in this instance.

Originally Posted by nowheretorun

first, never try to allow others to provide you with what you believe is missing within yourself... it is not fair to you or them and we cannot always rely on others to be present in our moment of need.. as best we are able, life is about learning to build an inner and independent strength as our most reliable ally...

second, allow yourself to feel as you feel... there is nothing wrong that cant be remedied somehow..

you have a great amount of value as an individual and as a mate... know the difference between leaning and propping... let ladies go first always... even if they are the type to take advantage of generosity, generosity is a good trait to have whenever you deal with anyone of either gender... never allow yourself to be taken for granted... you matter because of all the good you can do for others and because you are part of a large circle of caring people who also care about you...

we each bring a part to life and this world and you are in a place to make a difference in your own life as well as any others who happen to be nearby... if it is kindness and connection you seek, be kind and connective to others, as well as to yourself...

1. How can I truly know myself? It is even more difficult to understand myself than to understand others. On a societal level, I would think that the way people perceive me would, in a sense, be the most accurate representation of me. I was told by my therapist that it is literally impossible to survive without other people (I dissented, but I don't believe my opinion swayed him one way or another). Though I try to avoid specious logic as such, I would like to point out that it is "hard to see the forest when you're a tree."

2. How can I allow myself to feel as I feel? Considering my emotions are in constant flux, that would mean at times, I would be enticed to act on my feelings in ways that are not cleaving to the moral or legal boundaries of my clique and country. That is simply unacceptable. Sometimes, I find my anger aggrandized to the point that I want to destroy anything in my path. The only solace is that I recall that time will pass and my anger will subside, which would make any destruction, action or objection seem ridiculous in hindsight. Especially, I should not be generous! What fool gives away any resource without requite? Be it money, love, kindness, what have you... Be serious now. Then, I also refuse to allow myself to fall victim to the standards that force us to toe the line, so to speak..

I take your final statement as meaning that to receive we must reciprocate by giving... I agree! That is a major principle as to how I operate: to change the world, you must start with yourself. In other words, live your own creed.

ziggy1, I would agree with you that my past probably has something to do with my current state... Unfortunately, I would also say that I haven't even gotten out of my childhood yet! I am currently only the age of 17. To start a brief history... My father left before I was born. My mother was studying to be a nurse in my earliest years. My grandmother took care of me. From time to time, my mother would move out, only to fail financially and return home. During these stints, she would typically be dating someone; now, she admits that these men were mistakes. Finally, we returned home one last time. She began to go blind, and she now has an incredible history of various ailments that have only recently begun to afflict her. My grandmother died prior to this. It was crushing (esp. as I considered my grandmother more of my mother than my actual mother! My mother was and is a very mean woman who is manic depressive. Yes, angry and awkward. Demanding and illogical. oh well.), but I was beginning high school. Things always seem to happen like that.

Naturally, there are a million or so pages I could write about each individual event to describe my feelings, my epistemology, and its impact so far, but whatever.

Here I am now. Trying to go to college, is all.

[nowheretorun]

hi confused, i am opposed to leaving anyone in a confused state ...i will try to simplify my meanings for you ..

1. How can I truly know myself? It is even more difficult to understand myself than to understand others.

in time you will gain insight into the knd of individual you are.. at this point you are young and inexperienced... you will know yourself as you experience your world...

On a societal level, I would think that the way people perceive me would, in a sense, be the most accurate representation of me.

on a societal level the way most people perceive you is only how you are percieved by others... you may define yourself as you experience the world through your actions and statements involving others...



I was told by my therapist that it is literally impossible to survive without other people (I dissented, but I don't believe my opinion swayed him one way or another). Though I try to avoid specious logic as such, I would like to point out that it is "hard to see the forest when you're a tree."

you are a tree?


2. How can I allow myself to feel as I feel? Considering my emotions are in constant flux, that would mean at times, I would be enticed to act on my feelings in ways that are not cleaving to the moral or legal boundaries of my clique and country. That is simply unacceptable.

i agree you will need to define boundaries for yourself before you can apply them to your relationships


Sometimes, I find my anger aggrandized to the point that I want to destroy anything in my path. The only solace is that I recall that time will pass and my anger will subside, which would make any destruction, action or objection seem ridiculous in hindsight. Especially, I should not be generous! What fool gives away any resource without requite? Be it money, love, kindness, what have you... Be serious now. Then, I also refuse to allow myself to fall victim to the standards that force us to toe the line, so to speak..

if we choose those thoughts or actions which block our own progress we should not be surprised to find our path blocked... fools point fingers at fools... to love without requite is the very meaning of love... to give of self and have no need of payment is the thing that love promises... it is delivered without rationality or logic...

I take your final statement as meaning that to receive we must reciprocate by giving... I agree! That is a major principle as to how I operate: to change the world, you must start with yourself. In other words, live your own creed.

this is true for all...

[very_confused]

Originally Posted by nowheretorun

hi confused, i am opposed to leaving anyone in a confused state ...i will try to simplify my meanings for you ..

1. How can I truly know myself? It is even more difficult to understand myself than to understand others.

in time you will gain insight into the knd of individual you are.. at this point you are young and inexperienced... you will know yourself as you experience your world...

On a societal level, I would think that the way people perceive me would, in a sense, be the most accurate representation of me.

on a societal level the way most people perceive you is only how you are percieved by others... you may define yourself as you experience the world through your actions and statements involving others...



I was told by my therapist that it is literally impossible to survive without other people (I dissented, but I don't believe my opinion swayed him one way or another). Though I try to avoid specious logic as such, I would like to point out that it is "hard to see the forest when you're a tree."

you are a tree?


2. How can I allow myself to feel as I feel? Considering my emotions are in constant flux, that would mean at times, I would be enticed to act on my feelings in ways that are not cleaving to the moral or legal boundaries of my clique and country. That is simply unacceptable.

i agree you will need to define boundaries for yourself before you can apply them to your relationships


Sometimes, I find my anger aggrandized to the point that I want to destroy anything in my path. The only solace is that I recall that time will pass and my anger will subside, which would make any destruction, action or objection seem ridiculous in hindsight. Especially, I should not be generous! What fool gives away any resource without requite? Be it money, love, kindness, what have you... Be serious now. Then, I also refuse to allow myself to fall victim to the standards that force us to toe the line, so to speak..

if we choose those thoughts or actions which block our own progress we should not be surprised to find our path blocked... fools point fingers at fools... to love without requite is the very meaning of love... to give of self and have no need of payment is the thing that love promises... it is delivered without rationality or logic...

I take your final statement as meaning that to receive we must reciprocate by giving... I agree! That is a major principle as to how I operate: to change the world, you must start with yourself. In other words, live your own creed.

this is true for all...

Your responses are mostly cryptic, though I am sure that you are intending to frustrate me?

To explicate my idiom, I mean to say that when you are a member of a system it proves difficult to understand that very system's mechanisms and workings.

Also, to love without requite is the very meaning of love? I disagree here. In fact, the reciprocation of seeking out love would be to be loved in return and therefore complete the transaction resulting in a state of (somewhat) tranquility and security.

[nowheretorun]

please pardon my feeble attempts to enlighten you further...

love is its own seed friend... take care always