[Phreak]

My psychiatrist once asked me if I'd seen anything that didn't exist. My immediate question in response is how would I know. She retorted that patients typically for example asked if the monkey in the corner was real.

I see everyday things all of the time, and unless it was something clearly absurd I wouldn't ask somebody if they could also see it, surely, one just assumes that ehat they can see is real and normal.

It also brings the question if you're so "out of it" that you hallucinate would you even realise it.

Sorry if this is a ramble, hopefully somebody will make sense of it

Phreak

[Perna]

I guess there is context too; if there was a monkey in the corner I'd check that I was really seeing it, though I don't doubt my sanity or think I hallucinate ever. Presumably, if someone then told me the monkey did not exist, that would be part of my repertoire and I could answer your psychiatrist, "Well, I saw this monkey in the corner of a room once that no one else seemed to. . ." Anything I saw that I had not seen before (I'm not in the habit of seeing monkeys in the corner of rooms) would get me to note it and ask, "Hey, what's that monkey doing in the corner of the room?" If the monkey belonged there, Ross from "Friends" would say, "Oh, that's Marcel, my capucin monkey friend!"

I think people know when they hallucinate, after they finish with that particular hallucination? It wouldn't be normal for the little man you see from the corner of your eye to follow you around inside your house as well as outside? You or someone else would have to let him in the house/see him enter. I'd be suspect of anything I never quite see clearly but that occupies my thinking; you see something out of the corner of your eye, look to see what it is and if it is not really there, it shouldn't show up again and, if you can't get a clear look at it you may not be sure you saw it but you won't take it further than that, imagining it is you that has the problem (it's there and out to get you even though you can't see it)? If I were to take it further, attribute something to something I could not see clearly, I'd be able to say, "well, there's a little man I can't quite get close enough to question and he keeps showing up inside my house. . ." It would not matter that I believed/knew the little man was there, other people would have told me he isn't/they don't see him.

[Phreak]

I guess never knowingly having hallucinated I find it difficult to be able to differentiate. I never ask somebody if a traffic light exists it could be real I could be imagining it.

How did you know about the little man in my house? He sleeps in my bottom drawer.

Phreak

[Perna]

Hallucination is actually only a problem/of interest if you are around other people because it's about what you see/experience like/unlike the others around. If you hallucinate a red light and stop and foul up traffic, people will be honking at you, swearing at you, running into your car and/or causing car accidents, etc.

Your little man's ex-wife lives with me and told me about him.

I think of the classic bugs-on-skin hallucination that can be caused by some physical illnesses and other things besides "pure" psychiatric ones. It's not something you want and/or it bugs (sorry for the pun) the people around you, causes them a problem.

[Phreak]

I thought the bugs were because people were spying on me. You mean the invasion of ants isn't real?

Sorry I struggle to stay serious for too long.

Your posts have been really useful though

Thanks

Phreak

[H3rmit]

> My psychiatrist once asked me if I'd seen anything that didn't exist. My immediate question in response is how would I know.

I can't believe you have never experienced thinking you saw something, then looking back and realizing you couldn't have. EG in my case, my cat who has been dead for over 5 years, and the other one of a different colour who has been dead longer than that. By definition a hallucination is something you know isn't real. If you don't know it, you are psychotic/dissociating. So, if you did hallucinate, that's a good thing. EG if the walls are waving and worms are coming out of them, as happens to someone I know, ideally, yes, you know it can't be true and your mind overcomes your strong perceptions. Hardly a laughing matter in that case, but it can sound funny to those of us who haven't experienced it.

Oh, here's another one - hearing voices calling your name because you took codeine for pain. I've had that. I did not know what was going on. Scary, but once you know to predict it, you can know it is not real.

[Phreak]

Just to clarify and make clear I wasn't trying to trivialise something which can be a very real and serious issue for those affected.

[Sometimes psychotic]

Sometimes you can tell sometimes you can't. I've had the yellow lines in the middle of the street goto a complete zigzag pattern----that seemed real to me I thought that I had entered a parallel spirit world(the delusions make the hallucinations more real). I had three girls walking around in metallic kimonos switch to jeans and T-shirts after I glanced away(again blamed this on a transition to the spirit world). Those happened while I was really sick and not on meds yet.

On the meds I can tell----the meds seem to stop the delusions pretty well even if they dont get 100% of the hallucinations. So an example of one I could tell was a piece of computer circuit board designed into a pendant necklace. The necklace was floating in front of my face in perfect focus and in the light even though it was night and therefore dark and I had my glasses off so I should not have been able to see it clearly.

So basically if you're sick enough you can't tell because logic doesn't work, but if you don't have the delusions you should probably be able to tell because things are off somehow.

[H3rmit]

Originally Posted by Phreak

Just to clarify and make clear I wasn't trying to trivialise something which can be a very real and serious issue for those affected.

I know you weren't.
The poster above your most recent post explains well that the distinction can become unclear and so why a pdoc/T would ask this question.

[venusss]

I was once sleep deprivated and seen black dog. Told my friends about this halucination... they asked if I read Harry Potter. I said yes. And laughed.

I see **** at times... and I do joke about it still. Sometimes I think I must be making it up and it's real (in one camping place I seen frogs crawling on walls and mirrors. Sure they were real, unless the whole bus of our tour hallucinated).

Hard to tell. Also... I sometimes wonder if hallucinations aren't glimpses of something that exists, but most people filter out.

[Rose76]

I've been asked that question by shrinks and I've always thought that it was a dumb question.

When I've been around a person who was truly hallucinating, the person had no idea that what they "perceived" was not there. Usually, the patient tries to get other people to admit that they see it too. I've only seen this in hospitalized patients who were extremely ill. When they recovered, they usually had no memory of the hallucination. A few times, the patient would remember the odd experience. The patient would say, "It doesn't make sense, but I still remember it like it really happened."

I guess the real question is whether some psychiatric patients can have visual hallucinations and, somehow, realize that they are having hallucinations. Can they realize it during the hallucination . . . or after the event? I've never seen firm evidence of that being true. Maybe the pdocs have, but I'ld like to know where.

[The_little_didgee]

Insight is definitely common.

As a person develops psychosis, insight becomes impaired and is eventually lost. Eventually, confusion sets in, but once full psychotic insight is reached the hallucinations and delusions make perfect sense.

When, I was ill, my hallucinations were of real objects, I was actually seeing. They were visual distortions, that followed the theme of my delusions. None were images created by my mind, such as bugs crawling on the wall or objects seen in the corner of my eye.

Hallucinations are quite common, even in people who are not mentally ill.

If you can tell the difference and rarely experience them, there is no need to diagnose a psychotic disorder and take anti-psychotic medication.

Although, I have recovered from the psychosis, I still get "perceptual slippages". I can tell they are hallucinations because they are so bizarre and illogical.