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| View Poll Results: Is Psychiatry a science? | ||||||
| No, it's a pseudoscience only. |
   
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9 | 26.47% | |||
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| Yes of course it is. |
  
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8 | 23.53% | |||
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| Not yet but getting closer to a science. |
  
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15 | 44.12% | |||
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| I'm not sure or don't know. |
  
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2 | 5.88% | |||
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| Voters: 34. You may not vote on this poll | ||||||
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#1
Dec 12, 2014, 12:55 AM
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I was stunned when my pdoc told me psychiatry is not a science! The context of this discussion was me questioning my diagnosis. He said the diagnosis is not important and psychiatry is not a science. Symptoms over lap, there are no real boundires, every thing is subjective to opinions. We should focus on the symptoms and treat the symptoms and not worry about the diagnosis classes as they often change anyway and entirely subjective. Blew me away! I never expected a psychiatrist to say this. But makes sense. So I did some googling on the topic and found this is a highly debated area, meaning it is subjective. I think at best psychiatry tries to mimic science but it is not really a true science at all. There is no way to test, or validate or verify any diagnosis as there is in true science. We only have opinions. So I thought it might be interesting to see where this topic goes here and create a poll. So many of us, me included, get stuck on the diagnosis we over look the bigger picture which still remains fuzzy. So what do you think and why?
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 Takeshi, tealBumblebee
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#2
Dec 12, 2014, 02:11 AM
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There are lots of uncontrollable variables to behavioral studies. Yes, it's more scientific than a lot of groups, but to say that psychology is 100% a science ~ undeniably accurate studies to base work upon ~ and it just isn't that black & white. Sorry
 
__________________
"Only in the darkness can you see the stars." - Martin Luther King Jr. "Forgive others not because they deserve forgiveness but because you deserve peace." - Author Unkown |
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#3
Dec 12, 2014, 10:02 AM
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It is a soft science, so it's mostly theories, mays and maybes and probables.
Problem is when some act like it is hard science set in stone.
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Glory to heroes!
HATEFREE CULTURE |
| H3rmit, tealBumblebee
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#4
Dec 12, 2014, 10:24 AM
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Its in development. Since there's no one size fits all treatment, psychiatry has to go on intuition a lot.
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#5
Dec 12, 2014, 11:30 AM
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It's an empirically-based medical practice. There is a difference between psychology (studies human behavior to predict and learn how to control) and psychiatry-treatment of mental disorders. Psychiatrists usually rely on thier patient's reports of symptoms and their own clinical judgement, based on experience to recommend and prescribe potentially helpful medications, or that's the way it's supposed to work.....
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| lizardlady
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#6
Dec 12, 2014, 12:59 PM
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Well, any branch of medicine is part science and part art, so to speak. The science is in the research, the technology, the medications, etc., but it takes the art of a skilled practicioner to get a good outcome. Alas, too many psychiastrists, I have been told, are the "losers" of their medical school class - a specialty of last resort for those who can't hack it in fields like neurology, oncology, cardiology. Don't know if that is true, but my current T, who has a PhD and to me seems a really excellent T as well as a nice guy, told me that, and I do believe it, as it's consistent with my experiences, albeit rather limited to a few.
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| lizardlady
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#7
Dec 12, 2014, 02:17 PM
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Well, they are on the low end of the income scale related to the other specialties. OTOH, I have met and worked with some pretty sharp and gifted ones.
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#8
Dec 12, 2014, 07:40 PM
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I really don't think it is very scientific, going by my own experience and all the people I have met, with their ever-changing diagnoses. Maybe 10% science, 30% intuition, 30% guesswork, 30% fantasy. (I did start out with a lot of respect for psychiatry. Disillusioned.)
What gets me is that when it is so unscientific they are prepared to impose all kinds of decisions on people without worrying about the consequences. They are so sure they are right.
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#9
Dec 13, 2014, 07:24 AM
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All of medicine has been the medical "arts" for along time. In recent decades with huge advances in understanding of the human body most of it can be called science now. Psychiatry lags way behind because the brain and mind are just really hard to study and predict. It is making big advances and I suspect it will make huge advances in the next couple of decades.
I agree with your pdoc that labels overlap and what is important are your problems, how they affect your life, and what to do about it. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
The "paradox" is only a conflict between reality and your feeling of what reality "ought to be." -- Richard Feynman Major Depressive Disorder Anxiety Disorder with some paranoid delusions thrown in for fun. Recovering Alcoholic and Addict Possibly on low end of bi polar spectrum...trying to decide. Male, 50 Fetzima 80mg Lamictal 100mg Remeron 30mg for sleep Klonopin .5mg twice a day, cutting this back |
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#10
Dec 13, 2014, 07:40 AM
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I am reading a book by Steven Pinker, psychologist at Harvard, called "How the Mind Works." From what I have read so far he thinks psychology should be approached as a science. Evolutionary psychology. With huge advances in understanding how the brain works and in the "cognitive sciences" he doesn't agree with the Standard Social Science Model of psychology. He says the mind is a product of the brain and in turn the mind acts on the brain. Culture and society are for sure a big part of it but so are evolution and the brain. The brain is a massively complex information processing unit. I totally agree with his approach but I know there are going to be things I don't agree with. Especially when it comes to the spiritual aspect of things. I am not that far into the book. But I have watched his lectures.
The guy is brilliant. Department of Psychology How the Mind Works | Department of Psychology Standard social science model - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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The "paradox" is only a conflict between reality and your feeling of what reality "ought to be." -- Richard Feynman Major Depressive Disorder Anxiety Disorder with some paranoid delusions thrown in for fun. Recovering Alcoholic and Addict Possibly on low end of bi polar spectrum...trying to decide. Male, 50 Fetzima 80mg Lamictal 100mg Remeron 30mg for sleep Klonopin .5mg twice a day, cutting this back |
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#11
Dec 13, 2014, 11:23 AM
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Both psychiatry and psychology are accepted sciences by most. There are literally tens of thousands of researchers working on better understanding human behavior and the brain around the world. It would be an odd thing to consider these researchers aren't doing scientific research -- and the hundreds of scientific journals in psychology and psychiatry aren't publishing science?
Every psychiatric medication approved for use goes through a rigorous set of scientific studies. Starting with the DSM-III in the 1980s, the diagnostic system for mental disorders is scientifically-based. Each time they do a revision, hundreds of researchers and clinicians review thousands of scientific studies to help inform new or changed diagnostic criteria. Having said that, ALL diagnosis -- in medicine and mental health -- is part science, part art. ALL doctors, regardless of their specialty, don't just apply one set of criteria to reach a diagnosis. It is a mashup of lots of different things. I think someone who suggests these fields aren't "real" sciences simply hasn't spent much time reading the research. If it's not science, I'm not sure what is. DocJohn
__________________
Don't throw away your shot. |
| IowaFarmGal, lizardlady, pegasus, Sinking Feeling
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#12
Dec 13, 2014, 11:49 AM
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I believe it is as much of a science as medicine. What would make psychology any different?
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#13
Dec 13, 2014, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Problem two it seems to me is that psychiatrists don't seem to have a lot of tools in the mishmash of a tool box. The DSM and a handful of meds. I have been tested for thyroid each time I did an intake over the years but that is it. I have never been tested for vitamin D deficiency. I have never been tested for a L Methylfolate genetic polymorphism. I have never had the antidepressant metabolism genetic test done. Not really anything medical other than med management. I have been happy with overall service because it included therapists, nurses, medical doctor, and a psychiatrist. I have done lots of therapy and groups and so on, so I see the psychiatrist as one part of the treatment. I try to read as much of the current research as I can and it is very promising. I just think currently psychiatrist have a very limited amount of tools. I hope this changes soon but costs will always be a factor. I guess my point is that for the average patient who doesn't read research and who may not be super active in their own treatment may not see much science behind it. Although I certainly do.
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The "paradox" is only a conflict between reality and your feeling of what reality "ought to be." -- Richard Feynman Major Depressive Disorder Anxiety Disorder with some paranoid delusions thrown in for fun. Recovering Alcoholic and Addict Possibly on low end of bi polar spectrum...trying to decide. Male, 50 Fetzima 80mg Lamictal 100mg Remeron 30mg for sleep Klonopin .5mg twice a day, cutting this back Last edited by Altered Moment; Dec 13, 2014 at 01:14 PM. |
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#14
Dec 13, 2014, 01:24 PM
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#15
Dec 13, 2014, 02:40 PM
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Psychiatry is not a science. Psychiatrists cannot define "mental illness." There are no equations in psychiatry. Unlike mathematics, where 2+2=4, or physics, where E=mc2 (energy is equal to mass multiplied by the speed of light squared), psychiatry (and psychology) have no equations. Psychiatrists claim that they conclude a diagnosis based on the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM). What is the the DSM based on? I submit that the DSM can only predict correlations, patterns, etc.
I conclude that psychiatry is not a science. |
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#16
Dec 13, 2014, 02:59 PM
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P.S.
If psychiatry is a science, then a statistician is a scientist. If that's the case, I see no difference between an odds maker in Vegas and a psychiatrist. Both are using statistics to determine the probability of an event. |
| venusss
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#17
Dec 13, 2014, 03:18 PM
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kindness, I refer you to the definition of "science" (which is different than the definition of mathematics):
Quote:
DocJohn
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Don't throw away your shot. |
| lizardlady
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| lizardlady
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#19
Dec 13, 2014, 03:47 PM
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I had to say yes it is a science because it is more of a science than say a blind meandering about into the minds of individual's where diagnosis is based largely on theory and superstition and the particular religious beliefs of each patient...such as psychiatry was in its infancy. Thank God we are out of that brutal stage of non scientific approach to the human psyche. Heck we have come a long way since Freud even! However, we still have much to learn about the human mind and what is actual psychosis and what might be something that is actually spiritual in nature...we may never reach the point of it being an exact science but when you think about it NO science is truly exact when humans are involved
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CaptainChaos 
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#20
Dec 13, 2014, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
__________________
The "paradox" is only a conflict between reality and your feeling of what reality "ought to be." -- Richard Feynman Major Depressive Disorder Anxiety Disorder with some paranoid delusions thrown in for fun. Recovering Alcoholic and Addict Possibly on low end of bi polar spectrum...trying to decide. Male, 50 Fetzima 80mg Lamictal 100mg Remeron 30mg for sleep Klonopin .5mg twice a day, cutting this back |
| lizardlady
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#21
Dec 13, 2014, 04:20 PM
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When I was in grad school the profs referred to Physics as "hard" science, the life sciences as "soft" science and psychology/psychiatry as "impossible" science.
As other have pointed out psychology/psychiatry is in its infancy compared to the other sciences. The "hard" sciences are still evolving. It seems logical to me that psychology/psychiatry are still evolving too. |
| Sinking Feeling
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#22
Dec 13, 2014, 05:29 PM
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All they do is prescribe medication in an attempt to balance your biochemistry. It certainly is a science. And they don't engage in psychotherapy like most of their business cards state. They validate all psychotropic meds using empirical data (controlled studies) - it's kind of like backwards engineering or wagging the dog's tail. Maybe someday they will start at the first step and not at the back end to treat mental disorders.
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Forget the night...come live with us in forests of azure - Jim Morrison |
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#23
Dec 13, 2014, 05:29 PM
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#24
Dec 13, 2014, 07:08 PM
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Is psychiatry a real science. Wow! I am someone that has always viewed it as such. A psychiatrist first trains as a doctor and then goes on to specialize in psychiatry. The same for psychologists, they are doctors, with degrees. Aren't social sciences real science? It is true that we do not know as much about the brain as we do about other body parts, and so the science is not as mature as other sciences. But yes I view psychiatry and psychology as a science with humanity thrown in...
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 Pegasus Got a quick question related to mental health or a treatment? Ask it here General Q&A Forum “Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by it's ability to climb a tree, it will live it's whole life believing that it is stupid.” - Albert Einstein |
| lizardlady
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#25
Dec 13, 2014, 11:13 PM
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| Reply |
This is an old thread. You probably should not post your reply to it, as the original poster is unlikely to see it.|
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