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  #26  
Old Jan 16, 2012, 11:50 PM
Fabrice POULEQUIN Fabrice POULEQUIN is offline
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[QUOTE=Shadowghost;1411294]ECHOES, apparently you didn't read my last post. At any rate, we'll just have to agree to disagree. Nothing you or anyone else say will convince me that my views need to change. As I told Perna, don't tell me my views are wrong. They work for me!!![/QUOTE

Nice answer, but be calm! With any problem, wrong or not is ours look and thinking

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  #27  
Old Feb 09, 2012, 04:47 PM
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Velvet Cactus Velvet Cactus is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dandelionfalls View Post
Thanks for posting this. While reading it I was trying to pin point a distorted way of thinking that I get caught up in at times. It's like a "hang up" and is related to traumatic events that happened to me. So the issue is gender, like when women are objectified, I get very anxious. So I have this whole ideology built around defending the anxiety I feel about it. I think it may be related to my trauma, it's like that's how I defend myself against it.
I shared that so ask this:
What might be a distorted way of thinking be that is an ideological construct that works as a defense mechanism? (this is distressing for me because I don't want to think so rigidly and don't think rigidly in other areas or about other issues)
Since Burns there have been a few more added:

Reward Fallacy -You expect all your sacrifices and self-denial to be rewarded. You feel bitter if good deeds are not reciprocated. You may always be doing the right thing but your heart`s not in it. God/ the universe is not keeping score! And you are physically and emotionally draining yourself.

Being Right- . You feel the need to prove that your opinions /actions are correct. You can`t stand being wrong and you will go to any lengths to prove your `rightness`. This can make you hard of hearing as you are not interested in the possible truth of a different opinion. Your need to be right trumps your having an honest and caring relationship.

Global Labeling - You generalize one or two qualities in yourself and others into a sweeping negative global judgement despite evidence to the contrary. This makes for a one-dimensional world view.
Labeling yourself can injure your self esteem and stereo-typing others leads to snap-judgements, prejudice and relationship issues.

Fallacy of Change- You feel people will change to suit you, if you pressure or cajole them enough. Your need to change people is anchored in the mistaken belief that your happiness depends solely on them. The reality is that the only hope you have of changing anyone is you! Your happiness, you believe depends on the actions of others when in fact, it depends on the zillions of choices you make daily.

Fallacy of Fairness - According to our rules we have the expectation the world will play fair. And then disappointment sets in or deep resentment when others fail to live up to our expectations. While morality is based on ethical principles, for some people, it is situational.( ie Thou shalt not kill but it`s perfectly reasonable on a battle field...)
If you cannot let go of unfair situations, you may wind up consumed with resentment, leaving you very bitter. You may even believe that other people`s ignoring of `your rules`of fairness, is a personal affront to you. This stance will only leave you spinning your wheels for a long time.

I think many of us wrestle with that last one-I know I do!
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  #28  
Old Feb 20, 2012, 07:51 AM
juan03 juan03 is offline
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Thanks so much for this,
  #29  
Old Apr 27, 2012, 06:44 PM
kolobprincess kolobprincess is offline
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Thank you for sharing these misconceptions and truths. They are very helpful. Now, hopefully I can start to incorporate these into my life.
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  #30  
Old May 23, 2012, 05:49 PM
worldart16 worldart16 is offline
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thank you for posting this! As soon as I looked in at the list I zoomed in onto number 2. I thought that I was always just over sensitive because everything upsets me even though I'm very good at hiding it.
  #31  
Old Nov 06, 2012, 10:08 PM
carlibailey carlibailey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by (JD) View Post
Here are the basic distortions. They aren't a "therapy" to use and then forget... but habits of thinking that we need to "check' ourselves on for "life." Following this is a list of how to "untwist" such thinking. Good wishes!

1) ALL OR NOTHING THINKING

2) OVER-GENERALIZATION

3) MENTAL FILTER

4) DISQUALIFYING THE POSITIVE

5) JUMPING TO CONCLUSIONS:

6) MAGNIFICATION (CASTASTROPHIZING) OR MINIMIZATION

7) EMOTIONAL REASONING

8) SHOULD STATEMENTS

9) LABELING AND MISLABELING

10) PERSONALIZATION

Explanations:
1) You see things in black or white categories. If your effort or performance falls short of "perfect" you see yourself as a total failure. This "either-or" thinking habit may result in self-recrimination or anxiety.

2) You view a single negative event as a never-ending pattern of defeat. For example, you think that a friends' inconsiderate response means that there is no caring for you, even when there have been other examples of consideration.

3) You pick out single negative detail and dwell on it exclusively so that your perception becomes distorted. For example, a person focuses on one negative comment and ignores any of more neutral or positive feedback.

4) You reject positive experiences by insisting they "don't count" for some reason or another. In this way, you maintain a negative belief that is contradicted by your everyday experiences. For instance, you don't believe a compliment because you think it is said just to be nice.

5) You make a negative interpretation even though there are no definite facts to support your conclusion.
a.) MIND READING You arbitrarily conclude that someone is reacting negatively to you, and don't bother to check it out. "I just know he/she thought I was an idiot." even though he/she acted nicely.

b) THE FORTUNE TELLER ERROR: You anticipate that things will turn out badly, and you feel that, "I just know I am not going to get the job I want."

6) You exaggerate the importance of things (such as your goof-up or someone else's achievement) or you inappropriately shrink things until they appear tiny (your own desireable qualities or the other person's imperfections.)

7) You assume that your negative emotions necessarily reflect the way things really are: "I feel it, therefore it must be true."

8) You try to motivate yourself with "should" and "shouldn't" , as if you have to be whippped and punished before you could be expected to do anything. "Musts" and "oughts" are also issues. The emotional result is feeling guilty.

9) This is an extreme example of over-generalization. Instead of describing your error, you attach a negative label to yourself: "I'm a loser."

10.) You see yourself as the cause of some negative external event for which in fact you were not primarily responsible.

*adapted from Burns

HOW TO UNTWIST YOUR THINKING:

This comes from Dr David Burns and is in his book "The Feeling Good Handbook, revised edition."

1 IDENTIFY THE DISTORTION Write down your negative thoughts so you can see in which of the 10 cognitive distortions you're involved. This will make it easier to think about the problem in a more positive and realistic way.

2 EXAMINE THE EVIDENCE Instead of assuming that your negative thought is true, examine the actual evidence for it. For example, if you feel that you never do anything right, you could list several things you have done successfully.

3 THE DOUBLE-STANDARD METHOD Instead of putting yourself down in a harsh, condemning way, talk to yourself in the same
compassionate way you would talk to a friend with a similar problem.

4 THE EXPERIMENTAL TECHNIQUE Do an experiment to test the validity of your negative thought. For example, if, during an episode of panic, you become terrified that you're about to die of a heart attack, you could jog or run up and down several flights of stairs. This will prove that your heart is healthy and strong.

5 THINKING IN SHADES OF GRAY Although this method might sound drab, the effects can be illuminating. Instead of thinking about your problems in all-or-nothing extremes, reevaluate things on a range from 0 to 100. When things don't work out as well as you hoped, think about the experience as a partial success rather than a complete falure. See what you can learn from the situation.

6. THE SURVEY METHOD Ask people questions to find out if your thoughts and attitudes are realistic. For example, if you believe that public speaking anxiety is abnormal and shameful, ask several friends if they ever felt nervous before they gave a talk.

7. DEFINE TERMS When you label yourself "inferior" or "a fool" or "a loser," ask, "What is the definition of 'a fool'?" You will feel better when you see that there is no such thing as "a fool" or "a loser."

8. THE SEMANTIC METHOD Simply substitute language that is less colorful and emotionally loaded. This method is helpful for "should statements." Instead of telling yourself "I shouldn't have made that mistake," you can say, "It would be better if I hadn't made that mistake."

9. RE-ATTRIBUTION Instead of automatically assuming that you are "bad" and blaming yourself entirely for a problem, think about the many factors that may have contributed to it. Focus on solving the problem instead of using up all your energy blaming yourself and feeling guilty.

10. COST-BENEFIT ANALYSIS List the advantages and disadvantages of a feeling (like becoming angry when your plane is late,) a negative thought (like "No matter how hard I try, I always mess up, ") or a behavior pattern (like overeating and lying around in bed when you're depressed.) You can also use the Cost-Benefit Analysis to modify a self-defeating belief such as, "I must always try to be perfect."

As I've stated before, these methods are not something to be tried once or twice and dispensed, but are good skills to be ongoing in your life with day to day checking and adjusting. Good wishes! drjean
Intellectually I know all of these things, I'm 58 and diagnosed @20 yrs old. I'm wasting away on my sofa, surrounded by things I love and things to do but still can't get up the sofa. Honestly, I don't feel there is any hope, felt that a long time.
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  #32  
Old Dec 14, 2012, 05:29 AM
jcsaves jcsaves is offline
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simple and clear
i like how you numbered then and then referenced below. not overwhelming. thanks
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  #33  
Old Mar 15, 2013, 09:14 PM
SmileBit199 SmileBit199 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ECHOES View Post
People who make poor choices are just people who make poor choices. All choice have consequences, and some of those consequences are unintended and unexpected.
Placing judgements like loser isn't helpful, and creates shame. Shame can be motivating, but it isn't necessary to create shame to be motivated. One can be motivated by wanting new and different experiences in life.
I agree 100%. I suppose it's all about how these terms motivate/cripple you though, so to each his own.

I'm starting to look at life like we're all just animals. As lazy, evil, heroic as rats, if you will. We just need to figure out how we can alter our environment to see results. I'm not sure looking at decisions in a moral sense is productive. At least for me.
Thanks for this!
ECHOES, pachyderm
  #34  
Old Sep 19, 2013, 06:37 PM
lucylin lucylin is offline
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confusion is setting in...
right now i'm in a state of confusion mostly, but i know my decisions have consequences. i wish i didn't. also i think in some way, wether intentional or not all decions are moral. it may not seem to be at the time, but...,
  #35  
Old Sep 26, 2013, 01:49 PM
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(JD) (JD) is offline
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How would a decision, say, of what color shoes to wear be a moral choice? Not.

We do have choices to work on how we think, what we say, the way we behave, or not. Consequences, while sounding negative can also be positive...and some things are just inconsequential.

We can alter our environment, our behavior, our thinking with our attitude and will. We do it all the time, but we tend to believe the negative rather than anything positive; it works for either.

The more we counter the negative thinking, the more positive we become (okay, don't go well duh!)

Be well
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Thanks for this!
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  #36  
Old Jan 08, 2014, 08:51 AM
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Tydi469 Tydi469 is offline
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Well said!
  #37  
Old Jan 09, 2014, 09:01 AM
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tranquility84 tranquility84 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ECHOES View Post
People who make poor choices are just people who make poor choices. All choice have consequences, and some of those consequences are unintended and unexpected.
Placing judgements like loser isn't helpful, and creates shame. Shame can be motivating, but it isn't necessary to create shame to be motivated. One can be motivated by wanting new and different experiences in life.
What you''ve said really helped me. Just want to say thanks

Sent from my GT-P3100 using Tapatalk
  #38  
Old Jan 17, 2014, 01:58 AM
imnotperfect imnotperfect is offline
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I have learned that no one is always right. No one knows it all. Systems keep changing, we keep changing. Keeping an open mind, looking at others points of view is a good thing. It doesnt mean one person is right and the other wrong.
Loosing, or being a loser. Everyone has experience it at some time. When I use to play sports you have a winner and a looser. I had no problem loosing, being a looser if I did my best and we lost. It was a good competition and someone else won, I could feel good about being a looser. Or now I play a game with someone and you have a winner or a looser. If you do something and enjoy it, have fun doing it, you can be a looser and its not a bad thing.
Thanks for this!
tranquility84
  #39  
Old Jan 19, 2014, 02:18 PM
youwillrise youwillrise is offline
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wow...

i do pretty much all of the things on that list...ALL of them!

i'll read the rest and see what it has to say.
  #40  
Old Mar 22, 2014, 08:55 AM
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maglee186 maglee186 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by (JD) View Post
Here are the basic distortions. They aren't a "therapy" to use and then forget... but habits of thinking that we need to "check' ourselves on for "life." Following this is a list of how to "untwist" such thinking. Good wishes!

1) ALL OR NOTHING THINKING

2) OVER-GENERALIZATION

3) MENTAL FILTER

4) DISQUALIFYING THE POSITIVE

5) JUMPING TO CONCLUSIONS:

6) MAGNIFICATION (CASTASTROPHIZING) OR MINIMIZATION

7) EMOTIONAL REASONING

8) SHOULD STATEMENTS

9) LABELING AND MISLABELING

10) PERSONALIZATION


Explanations:
1) You see things in black or white categories. If your effort or performance falls short of "perfect" you see yourself as a total failure. This "either-or" thinking habit may result in self-recrimination or anxiety.

2) You view a single negative event as a never-ending pattern of defeat. For example, you think that a friends' inconsiderate response means that there is no caring for you, even when there have been other examples of consideration.

3) You pick out single negative detail and dwell on it exclusively so that your perception becomes distorted. For example, a person focuses on one negative comment and ignores any of more neutral or positive feedback.

4) You reject positive experiences by insisting they "don't count" for some reason or another. In this way, you maintain a negative belief that is contradicted by your everyday experiences. For instance, you don't believe a compliment because you think it is said just to be nice.

5) You make a negative interpretation even though there are no definite facts to support your conclusion.
a.) MIND READING You arbitrarily conclude that someone is reacting negatively to you, and don't bother to check it out. "I just know he/she thought I was an idiot." even though he/she acted nicely.

b) THE FORTUNE TELLER ERROR: You anticipate that things will turn out badly, and you feel that, "I just know I am not going to get the job I want."

6) You exaggerate the importance of things (such as your goof-up or someone else's achievement) or you inappropriately shrink things until they appear tiny (your own desireable qualities or the other person's imperfections.)

7) You assume that your negative emotions necessarily reflect the way things really are: "I feel it, therefore it must be true."

8) You try to motivate yourself with "should" and "shouldn't" , as if you have to be whippped and punished before you could be expected to do anything. "Musts" and "oughts" are also issues. The emotional result is feeling guilty.

9) This is an extreme example of over-generalization. Instead of describing your error, you attach a negative label to yourself: "I'm a loser."

10.) You see yourself as the cause of some negative external event for which in fact you were not primarily responsible.

*adapted from Burns


HOW TO UNTWIST YOUR THINKING:

This comes from Dr David Burns and is in his book "The Feeling Good Handbook, revised edition."

1
IDENTIFY THE DISTORTION
Write down your negative thoughts so you can see in which of the 10 cognitive distortions you're involved. This will make it easier to think about the problem in a more positive and realistic way.

2 EXAMINE THE EVIDENCE Instead of assuming that your negative thought is true, examine the actual evidence for it. For example, if you feel that you never do anything right, you could list several things you have done successfully.

3 THE DOUBLE-STANDARD METHOD Instead of putting yourself down in a harsh, condemning way, talk to yourself in the same
compassionate way you would talk to a friend with a similar problem.

4 THE EXPERIMENTAL TECHNIQUE Do an experiment to test the validity of your negative thought. For example, if, during an episode of panic, you become terrified that you're about to die of a heart attack, you could jog or run up and down several flights of stairs. This will prove that your heart is healthy and strong.

5 THINKING IN SHADES OF GRAY Although this method might sound drab, the effects can be illuminating. Instead of thinking about your problems in all-or-nothing extremes, reevaluate things on a range from 0 to 100. When things don't work out as well as you hoped, think about the experience as a partial success rather than a complete falure. See what you can learn from the situation.

6. THE SURVEY METHOD
Ask people questions to find out if your thoughts and attitudes are realistic. For example, if you believe that public speaking anxiety is abnormal and shameful, ask several friends if they ever felt nervous before they gave a talk.

7. DEFINE TERMS When you label yourself "inferior" or "a fool" or "a loser," ask, "What is the definition of 'a fool'?" You will feel better when you see that there is no such thing as "a fool" or "a loser."

8. THE SEMANTIC METHOD Simply substitute language that is less colorful and emotionally loaded. This method is helpful for "should statements." Instead of telling yourself "I shouldn't have made that mistake," you can say, "It would be better if I hadn't made that mistake."

9. RE-ATTRIBUTION Instead of automatically assuming that you are "bad" and blaming yourself entirely for a problem, think about the many factors that may have contributed to it. Focus on solving the problem instead of using up all your energy blaming yourself and feeling guilty.

10. COST-BENEFIT ANALYSIS List the advantages and disadvantages of a feeling (like becoming angry when your plane is late,) a negative thought (like "No matter how hard I try, I always mess up, ") or a behavior pattern (like overeating and lying around in bed when you're depressed.) You can also use the Cost-Benefit Analysis to modify a self-defeating belief such as, "I must always try to be perfect."

As I've stated before, these methods are not something to be tried once or twice and dispensed, but are good skills to be ongoing in your life with day to day checking and adjusting. Good wishes! drjean
Thanks, for posting this to reflect and act
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Thanks for this!
(JD), Takeshi
  #41  
Old Aug 27, 2014, 08:09 AM
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dwfieldjr dwfieldjr is offline
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Are there work sheets so we can practice memorizing that.
Thanks for this!
nushi
  #42  
Old Aug 27, 2014, 08:34 PM
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Hellion Hellion is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowghost View Post
Perna, we'll have to agree to disagree! I know for a fact that I've been a fool and a loser in the past. This is a harsh judgement to make, but it's very, very true. And what you said about it not helping me? Wrong! It has helped me tremendously!! It motivated me to change when nothing else could. Life isn't all sunshine and rainbows. It's hard, it's ugly. Nothing will ever change that. And yes, some people are fools and losers. The person who keeps committing a mistake despite knowing that it'll adversely affect them in the future? That person is a fool. Despite how anyone may try to disguise this fact behind fancy terminology, a fool is a fool. A particular action does not a fool make? Does not the act of murder make that person a murderer? I rest my case. Enjoy my mistakes? So I should enjoy the mistake I made that cost my youngest brother his life? And don't tell me I wasn't to blame for my brother's death, you don't know anything about it. Many others, although well-meaning, have tried to convince me I wasn't to blame, but the plain fact is that I am!! This is a brutal truth to face, but it is a truth nonetheless, a cold, hard fact, as incontrovertible as the fact that rocks are hard, that the sky is blue. I don't run from harsh realities, I face them. It makes it easier for me to see what needs to be changed in my life. Not that making those changes is easy, but at least I know in no uncertain terms what I need to deal with. Perna, you have a certain way of viewing things. I don't tell you that you're wrong. Don't tell me I'm wrong!!!
Maybe for you, you really have done things that screwed things up....or have knowingly repeated mistakes and all that. However for a lot of people their problems don't really come down to mistakes they've made or not trying to fix things or whatever. Also there are mental conditions that can interfere with ones ability to cope with some harsh realities...Just the way it is, but not everyones experience is the same what is true for you may not be true for everyone else.
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  #43  
Old Aug 27, 2014, 08:40 PM
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Hellion Hellion is offline
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Some of that stuff makes sense to me, but then there is a lot that just doesn't really describe my issues. Like I don't really think in black and white, shades of grey are my style...I do try to see the bright side of things(much of the time without success). I realize I have not failed at every single thing and obviously do some things right since some people care and will spend time with me but I still feel like crap about myself. I guess for me the depression is more of a feeling than a flawed thought process...I mean don't get me wrong sometimes my thinking does resemble some of what was described, though its not always a distortion...without any distortions my life isn't to great and doesn't seem likely to improve I don't think that is me being negative I think its realistic. But it feels like no matter how much I might try to view a situation differently, look at the brightside and all that stuff the painful depressed feeling is still there. Sort of difficult to explain.
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  #44  
Old Oct 28, 2014, 01:54 PM
Synses Synses is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwfieldjr View Post
Are there work sheets so we can practice memorizing that.
Good idea. Those are overwhelming in volume and complexity to me and I think to people like me who need time and practice activities to understand them and work with them effectively. Worksheets, games, quizzes, etc., based on the concepts and details would be so valuably helpful!!!
Synthia
  #45  
Old Nov 01, 2014, 05:57 PM
SnakeCharmer SnakeCharmer is offline
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Any of these books by Dr. David Burns, M.D., can be helpful and they're full of work sheets, quizzes and exercises.

Books | Feeling Good

I've personally used Feeling Good and Intimate Connections and highly recommend them. Feeling Good is especially helpful for depression and anxiety and Intimate Connection is great for shyness, meeting people, making friends and dating.

The information is laid out in a way that assists progress. I copied some of the worksheets and used them on a regular basis and somesychtimes I wrote directly in the book in pencil. If I begin to feel low or shy again, I pick up these books and starting reading and doing the worksheets. It really helps.
  #46  
Old Nov 04, 2014, 03:23 PM
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dwfieldjr dwfieldjr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeCharmer View Post
Any of these books by Dr. David Burns, M.D., can be helpful and they're full of work sheets, quizzes and exercises.

Books | Feeling Good

I've personally used Feeling Good and Intimate Connections and highly recommend them. Feeling Good is especially helpful for depression and anxiety and Intimate Connection is great for shyness, meeting people, making friends and dating.

The information is laid out in a way that assists progress. I copied some of the worksheets and used them on a regular basis and somesychtimes I wrote directly in the book in pencil. If I begin to feel low or shy again, I pick up these books and starting reading and doing the worksheets. It really helps.
Did u get the ebooks or the paperbacks
  #47  
Old Nov 05, 2014, 12:53 AM
SnakeCharmer SnakeCharmer is offline
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I have a hardback copy of Feeling Good and paperback copy of Intimate Connections. Whatever book type you enjoy most would work.
  #48  
Old Nov 05, 2014, 12:57 AM
Utterly Utterly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeCharmer View Post
I have a hardback copy of Feeling Good and paperback copy of Intimate Connections. Whatever book type you enjoy most would work.
I got the ebook version. Problem was when I used a Sharpie to fill in the worksheets...
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  #49  
Old Feb 26, 2015, 08:58 PM
Hoonoo Hoonoo is offline
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I have to mention that I've sort of always known of such "distortion" types and when I met with Burns' book I hem-hawed it.


That was until I was able to separate myself from these distortions. My issue was that I was so consumed with one or more of these 10 at any given time that I couldn't "back up" and see it. I separated myself using meds...I had never used meds before and considered them as crutches for the "weak". Well, meds in my case simply help my brain take a pause. Before I react to things now I take a pause think about it and then decide what to do. Now, this distortions list is near me always and as I prepare to act or react to things I skim the list and look for pitfalls.


One more trick, as if you asked me: I've been journaling for three years now and I use that many times to write into my journal my immediate reactions or thoughts to something and then its "out of me". After that I seem to decide a little better.


I would suggest that this list stays in your purse, planner, wallet, whatever. and before or as these feelings come, grab that list. At least you'll pause to read it.
Thanks for this!
nushi
  #50  
Old Jun 28, 2015, 08:58 PM
ankshuz ankshuz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by (JD) View Post
Here are the basic distortions. They aren't a "therapy" to use and then forget... but habits of thinking that we need to "check' ourselves on for "life." Following this is a list of how to "untwist" such thinking. Good wishes!

1) ALL OR NOTHING THINKING

2) OVER-GENERALIZATION

3) MENTAL FILTER

4) DISQUALIFYING THE POSITIVE

5) JUMPING TO CONCLUSIONS:

6) MAGNIFICATION (CASTASTROPHIZING) OR MINIMIZATION

7) EMOTIONAL REASONING

8) SHOULD STATEMENTS

9) LABELING AND MISLABELING

10) PERSONALIZATION
I suffer from every single one of these twisted patterns of thinking. Every single one.

GAD/OCD/SAD sufferer my whole life. This must go hand in hand with these disorders - Which I believe all stem from a low self esteem.

I've been tortured by this brain of mine for 30 something years now and am out of ideas of what to do.
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My Support Forums is the online community that was originally begun as the Psych Central Forums in 2001. It now runs as an independent self-help support group community for mental health, personality, and psychological issues and is overseen by a group of dedicated, caring volunteers from around the world.

 

Helplines and Lifelines

The material on this site is for informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis or treatment provided by a qualified health care provider.

Always consult your doctor or mental health professional before trying anything you read here.