[deliquesce]

i think this is something i want to talk about with austin-t eventually, but PC is a little bit safer and i want to try it out here first.

i'm never very certain about when i should/should not disclose to my friends about my depression/weirder symptoms/less than ideal family/past assaults. i've previously tried really hard to keep the depression quiet, but this year it came out almost immediately with my new cohort, mainly because i was on a medication with dietary restrictions that everyone knew about & it was easier to have it open rather than people knowing but pretending not to know. it's meant i get to veto places we eat because i wouldn't be able to eat there, and it's also been super nice to find that i have friends who still like me despite my serious messed up head stuff.

recently some of the csa stuff has been messing up my friendship with this one guy - i'm taking risks with him because i feel safe, but also i'm super cautious and pull back very quickly, which i think is confusing (and upsetting) to him. he knows about the depression, but im wondering if i should tell him about the other past yuck stuff because then he would know my reactions arent about him. at the same time, i worry that we're "just friends" (and not even super close friends, at that) and that this would be overdisclosure. i'm sure he'd be all nice about it (i hope? ) but i also worry he'd be a little bit "woah, too much information" and be confused about why i'm telling him because he doesn't really care. gah. i think the friendship is more important to me because it's a safe place where i'm taking risks - but to him it's probably a run-of-the-mill friendship that doesn't mean too much either way. (eta: whenever i've freaked out he's become a bit standoffish also, whereas if he asked what's wrong then i'd know he'd care???)

i was just wondering if anyone knew. how to decide. i know one rule of thumb is to only disclose as much as the other person discloses but that would make things difficult for me because my issues are so much a part of my everyday life that it's actually easier to just acknowledge them so everyone can move on.

any advice/personal experiences/guidelines?

[darkrunner]

Deli,
That's a really good question. My initial reaction was to say no, don't tell. It sounds like the relationship is just beginning and if don't know the person very well is might be too risky.

But then I thought, you don't have anything to be ashamed of or embarassed about. You were hurt by others and that is affecting the way you are today. That is normal.

It might be helpful to think through how he may react and how that would affect you. But on the other hand, it's probaby not a good idea to over think it either.

This probably isn't very helpful at all.
I'll be interested to hear what other feedback you get.

[WePow]

Deli, can you do the old trick of making it about a different person - for example say "I had a friend who once had this happen to her...." and just watch to see the response? That is what I have done my whole life. It may not be ideal, but it has allowed me to see what people are like before I let them in on MY world. Keeps me safe. And sometimes I have found the rare person who will respond with the way I need them to respond - and then I have found a friend and can open up further.

[WikidPissah]

Not sure if this is going to make sense. Disclosure not only effects us, it effects the person we tell. The average person isn't trained in how to react, they struggle with it. They don't know what to say, or how to respond...it's a huge responsibility. And there we are, looking for the right response, ready to end the relationship if it isn't the right response. See where I'm going...

Of course I am not saying you should never disclose, but when you do...have compassion on the other person, remember they aren't T's, and their response will probably be sub par.

[Fartraveler]

Or, maybe you could limit the details that you disclose? Just tell him something like: there's some stuff going on that makes some stuff kind of uncomfortable for you, and it's just something you're working on, and you just wanted him to know because you thought it might be affecting your interactions. (Or whatever.)

Yes, no need to go TMI, but I've found that for me it's possible to give a little bit of info, and that's often enough.

-Far

Originally Posted by Fartraveler

Or, maybe you could limit the details that you disclose? Just tell him something like: there's some stuff going on that makes some stuff kind of uncomfortable for you, and it's just something you're working on, and you just wanted him to know because you thought it might be affecting your interactions. (Or whatever.)

This is as much as I've told my H, who I've been married to for 17 years. I'm not sure why exactly, but this is as much as i want to share, and it's been enough information to explain my behavior, so I'm okay with that for now.

I'm glad you have a new friend deli

[deliquesce]

thanks for all of your replies, lovelies .

i guess there are 2 parts to my thread: how to figure out disclosure in general, and then disclosure with this particular guy. so far it looks like in general i should consider:
1. how well/long ive known the person - i.e., no disclosure to a complete stranger or the barrista i buy my coffee from every morning.
2. think about their possible reaction, and be prepared to cope with it even if it is less than ideal.
3. that i'm affecting the other person and putting a huge responsibility on them also, so i might be hurting the other person by my disclosure(?).

with respect to this particular guy, i'll reply individually because it's helping me to get at specifics and think this through:

Originally Posted by darkrunner

Deli,
That's a really good question. My initial reaction was to say no, don't tell. It sounds like the relationship is just beginning and if don't know the person very well is might be too risky.

this is the guy i was doing a bit of an on/off thing with near the beginning of the year. i didnt tell him anything then because i certainly didnt know him well (although he knew about the depression - he was 1st person to figure it out based on my diet, which is why everyone else knows also). we had a few rather intense conversations back then (he disclosed a lot to me in an effort to get me to relax/trust him more) but then things petered out and it's been just a random friend catch up thing (we'll see each other in groups, nothing more). i had thought we had dropped back to 'acquaintance-ish' level and that i wouldnt see him once uni was over, but then he bought me a really thoughtful birthday gift last week which would've taken ages for him to find. so i guess i'm probably confused as to where we stand now anyway. muh.

But then I thought, you don't have anything to be ashamed of or embarassed about. You were hurt by others and that is affecting the way you are today. That is normal.

to be honest, he might've figured this out already, but i guess it's up to me to acknowledge outright? sometimes i feel like it's the elephant in the room. even if he hasnt guessed, he has said certain things to me in a way which makes me know he's clued in on some of my anxieties & is doing his part to minimise it.

It might be helpful to think through how he may react and how that would affect you. But on the other hand, it's probaby not a good idea to over think it either.

for the most part i think he would be great. he's a good person and he'd respond in a decent way. probably give me a hug and thank me for telling him.

a small part of me worries he'd be disgusted, move away etc, but i think that's largely my own insecurities. actually, even if he was disgusted i don't think he'd let on. probably say the right things immediately but maybe stop hanging out with me after. i don't know.

i think immediately he'd be good, but i guess the concern is that it would be TMI and he'd freak out a bit? i guess the problem comes down to intimacy - if i knew we were more close then maybe it'd be less of a problem. i think my main worry is that it's like telling someone who is nice but who doesn't particularly care either way. they would say the right stuff, but also be a bit confused about what you want from them because it's not the sort of thing you tell someone you aren't terribly close to. does this make sense?

Originally Posted by WePow

Deli, can you do the old trick of making it about a different person - for example say "I had a friend who once had this happen to her...." and just watch to see the response? That is what I have done my whole life. It may not be ideal, but it has allowed me to see what people are like before I let them in on MY world. Keeps me safe. And sometimes I have found the rare person who will respond with the way I need them to respond - and then I have found a friend and can open up further.

gosh, ok. i guess the reason i want to say something is really for his benefit, and kind of to 'excuse' my sometimes crap (inexplicable) behaviour. i dont really want him to know the ins and outs... just i know sometimes i withdraw and it creates distance because i think he takes it personally and i want him to know that my pulling away is more because i'm triggered than because i don't like him. e.g., on monday i had a really bad headache and was rubbing my head and he noticed and stopped his lab work and took over (he gives all of his friends head massages, so it wasn't any particular favour for me). but for me it was a big deal because i dont let people touch me for very long, and i had my eyes closed but i thought "ok, just go with this because you trust him" and it was really nice... but it was all quiet and i had my eyes closed and i started getting that panic/dissociation starting feeling and i wasnt really sure what to do. i let him finish in his own time but really i would've liked to have asked him to stop, without offending him? i was really shaken up afterwards and left the labs, whereas if i'd just asked him to stop earlier then it'd would've been ok because i would've taken a babystep risk without the flashbacks impending.

Originally Posted by Eileen2010

Not sure if this is going to make sense. Disclosure not only effects us, it effects the person we tell. The average person isn't trained in how to react, they struggle with it. They don't know what to say, or how to respond...it's a huge responsibility. And there we are, looking for the right response, ready to end the relationship if it isn't the right response. See where I'm going...

Of course I am not saying you should never disclose, but when you do...have compassion on the other person, remember they aren't T's, and their response will probably be sub par.

thanks for your reply, eileen. it's easy to get so caught up in wanting to protect myself that i forget to look after him & how the disclosure might affect him too. i certainly wouldn't end the relationship if the response wasn't right... i genuinely think i want to tell him only to alleviate his stress? i'm not looking for emotional support from him or anything (ive got pdoc & austin-t for that). just i worry that every time we get a bit closeish i manage to stuff it up by the ptsd thing intruding. and if i can explain that then maybe i won't lose the level of intimacy we had/are rebuilding. we were a lot closer at the beginning of the year, but i shut him out so many times that i think he just took this HUGE step back. now it seems we're getting a bit closer again, and i dont want to mess it up by making the same mistakes.

Originally Posted by Fartraveler

Or, maybe you could limit the details that you disclose? Just tell him something like: there's some stuff going on that makes some stuff kind of uncomfortable for you, and it's just something you're working on, and you just wanted him to know because you thought it might be affecting your interactions. (Or whatever.)

Yes, no need to go TMI, but I've found that for me it's possible to give a little bit of info, and that's often enough.

-Far

i was thinking maybe asking him if he knew about ptsd? his best friend is in the army so i think he would know about it a bit. and then saying that i have it so sometimes when i freak out/back off really quickly it's because of the ptsd and not anything to do with my wanting to actually get away from him? [edit: just saw your post, tree - it's reassuring that this is something that has worked for you.]

GRRRR. it's so upsetting, this whole thing, to me. he really is a great guy, and it's only because he's a great guy that i'm even feeling safe to take little risks (get a head massage, walk to his car alone with only him & none of my friends there, let him hold my wrists when everyone's wrestling over a soccer ball etc). but because he's the first person i'm taking these risks with it also means i'm getting triggered a lot more, and thereby freaking out in a way that i haven't done before (in front of someone else, where it's hard for me to control my social interactions, because i'm making myself vulnerable in order for this to happen). which means i'm sending off all the wrong vibes, when really i just want us to be good friends. and i dont know how to address the issue, without owning up to the fact that i keep doing this and giving an explanation?

phew, so sorry for the massively long post!

[velcro003]

I think the most important thing you need to figure out Deli is how you stand with him. Maybe just feel it out for a bit. See if he wants to hang out more, just as friends. Then if you think you guys have more of a solid relationship, you can put out feelers. Like asking if he knows about PTSD. And if so, say "I just want you to know that I have it as well, and if I freak out, that is why." Thats simple and to the point, and I don't see why it would have to lean into a deeper discussion if you don't want it to.

And if he asks more, you can say "I've had some rough times in my life, but I'm not comfortable sharing it." If he is a decent human being, he'll realize that is a boundary he doesn't need to cross right then. If someone said that to me, I would tell them that is completely fine--but I'll always be there if they ever want to talk more. That I won't judge or anything of the sort.

[deliquesce]

thank you, (((((lovely velcro who i've missed terribly much)))) .

he's coming to a dance class with me next week and we're having dinner after, so it's nice that we're picking up the friendship again. usually another one of my friends comes with me but i think she'll be doing a mad rush with her thesis, so it'll just be us. it's nice that he's hanging out with me individually again. we've already picked where we'll have dinner after & what we'll order. it's SO AWESOME to have another vegetarian around so we hit all the organic health cafes when we dont have the "meat eaters" around to complain .

i think i'll only bring it up if i mess up again. ie, i wont tell him just out of the blue because that would be unnecessary, but maybe if i freak out and cant successfully cover it up.

i like your wording, velcro, about how to say it. i think if he did ask me i'd be a bit more open - he's been really open with me before, and i appreciate that he's answered my questions honestly. he doesn't tend to ask me much at all, so i'm not worried that he'd pry or even ask for many details. he usually gives short (validating) responses and then changes the subject to something happier.

[googley]

Deli-
When I have told people IRL about things, I have done it in small steps to see how they react. I might say first, (in the context of an already started discussion,) my child hood was really hard. Then I see how they take it. I might wait to see how they act then next few times I see them. And then if something comes up again, I might add, "It sucks because my parents were emotionally abusive." Then another time I might add that I was assaulted in high school. Between these times I would see how they respond and how they act. If they don't respond well, I wont tell them any more. I think it is good to do it in small bites and see how they react. Also, I wont disclose anything more than I feel comfortable. And that is really a personal thing. I also wont disclose to someone I haven't known for a while. Is this the guy you were intimate with a while back? I may be way behind the times and not know how current relationships work, but it seems to me that if he and you are comfortable being intimate, it would make sense that he would be able to support you in hearing at least the most basic of information.

[BlackCanary]

When I was in college, I think I handled this by saying "There was a thing that happened to me in high school - it's not about you. I appreciate your being understanding if I seem skittish."
If he's savvy, he'll get it and leave it at that. Telling him more details, even if he asks, may lead to discomfort for both of you.
You just have to maybe work out a signal, something as simple as "I need a minute". Lets you get your space, lets the triggered feeling pass through.

Little by little is my advice on this

[deliquesce]

Originally Posted by googley

Is this the guy you were intimate with a while back? I may be way behind the times and not know how current relationships work, but it seems to me that if he and you are comfortable being intimate, it would make sense that he would be able to support you in hearing at least the most basic of information.

yeah, this is the guy. we were intimate a bit near the beginning of the year but it all petered off into being friends who kind of ignore that it even happened . i think when the stuff at the beginning of the year was going on that he didnt really want to know me - i was just meant to be some random stranger while he got over his ex; but now he actually knows me and it makes it worse because i dont want him to think i'm damaged.

Originally Posted by BlackCanary

When I was in college, I think I handled this by saying "There was a thing that happened to me in high school - it's not about you. I appreciate your being understanding if I seem skittish."
If he's savvy, he'll get it and leave it at that. Telling him more details, even if he asks, may lead to discomfort for both of you.
You just have to maybe work out a signal, something as simple as "I need a minute". Lets you get your space, lets the triggered feeling pass through.

this is great advice, canary - thank you . you are probably right that telling him more even if he asks might make him uncomfortable (and then i would be sad). i need to practise some of these phrases so that if i need them i'll remember them and not panic. "i need a minute" is good, even just saying it would probably help me feel a bit more grounded.