[geez]

We'll it's Tuesday and I had an appt today with T. I read her this in my session today.....

I'm taking another risk and I'm being honest with you and I hope I don't get punished for it this time.

I feel like I'm being punished for being so honest with you. Being punished in the sense of you taking the hug away from me. The only reason I can think of is that I repulse you or somehow scare you. I'm being honest to learn more about myself and who I am what ever that means in your safety. I feel like that was perhaps a mistake.

In general I look forward to my appts with you however I think I spend too much time outside of therapy with you taking space in my head. I don't want to look forward to seeing you. I don't want to need you. I don't know where I would be if I weren't in therapy right now. Would I even be here?

It sucks to have needs and it sucks to depend on others for some of those needs. If I weren't in therapy I would be alone with these feelings and that would not be good. I have allot of fear right now. Fear of myself and making a mistake or ruining my life. Inside I feel like everything is a mess. On the outside I have a husband that loves me and two amazing boys that I love with all my being. Feeling helpless. Feeling hopeless. Feeling like giving up on anything positive in my life.

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We talked about the hug and she asked how I thought I was being punished. -
She also asked how could she be punishing me for a hug when a hug never happened (it wasn't like we hugged and now she's refusing a hug).
I told her that the hug was on the table as a yes in one appt and then in the next appt you told me it wasn't possible. She told me she thought about 'the hug' between appts and realized the awkwardness that would be there as she never typically hugs (unless it's a good bye your leaving town forever etc..). She told me she typically never hugs anyone and that she's sorry about the timing of it all but she is going to continue that policy. She said initially when I asked the question she was kind of thinking on the fly and afterwords she thought about it allot between appts and that it has nothing to do with me and that it's about her. I told her that it hurts and feels personal. She told me it is nothing I did and she isn't repulsed by me in any way. She has never felt that way about me and everything she has thought of about me has been far from it.

I told her I felt like I needed to distance myself from her a bit as I feel like I 'need my appts.' She takes up too much space in my head. She offered me to do every other week perhaps as something for me to think about.... she's not pushing me to do that but is merely offering a suggestion.

There were other things we talked about such as the gaping hole I have inside etc.. The support I get here on PC . In summary I left kind of feeling ok in a way. I guess there's only one way to go from here and that's up.

Thank you all for listening. Peace.

PS - My husband in the last week randomly has offered unsolicited support to me in finding 'who I am' or whatever that means for me to lead a happy life. That's a good thing and for that I am very lucky and truly blessed. - sometimes all is needed is a tiny thread to hold onto.

[WePow]

((((((((((Geez))))))))))) You are so brave and honest. I think that is what it takes.
You did so well.

[geez]

Almost Forgot!!
My T asked me what I needed from her .

I told her 'I don't know' (in my head I wanted to say a hug but felt so humiliated to even say that). She did say also that she is there to help me in the safe context of her office. To give me comfort without actual physical contact such as a hug. I then told her that I've always felt like I do need her/the appts to help me feel ok. She said I'm looking for something I never got as a child and I need to feel accepted. I did feel like she was spot on about allot of things she was telling me. (even though the no hug rule sucks I 'get it'). I suppose she's not all bad ?

Perhaps when I see I her and I'm feeling thankful for her help I can say: "I'm not going to hug you but if I could I would" -

[Sannah]

Very good Geez!

[WePow]

((((((((((((Geez)))))))))))) And you could squeeze your eyes tight and when she asks what you are doing you could say "I am giving you a heart hug!!!" :-)

[chicken_wing]

Or wrap your arms around your chest in a self-hug and then say to her "see you could be apart of this too but you're missing out."

[rainbow8]

Geez, would your T let you do any sort of visualization where she's holding you? My first T never touched me but she always said the goal was to have a "part of her inside of me". It's been so many years now but I've never forgotten that.

Or, when my current T agreed to "climb into my heart" when I asked if I could climb into hers. She says she's "here with me." Maybe you could tell her something like that is what you need from her.

My T wants me to feel the good feelings of her holding my hand without actually doing it, so again, it's not "real" except occasionally, but something I can visualize.

I'm sorry about her policy, but many Ts have that rule. When I emailed one of my former Ts about what I was looking for in a newT, and I said "someone who would be open to hugging", she said something very negative about having to get my hugs outside of therapy. This was a Psych D who never hugged me.

I'm glad T told you it wasn't anything personal and was about HER, not you. She sounds like an excellent T from everything you said.

[geez]

WePow love that idea!
Chicken I just 'hugged' myself and odly it was great!!!

LOVE YOU GUYS!

[geez]

Originally Posted by rainbow8

Geez, would your T let you do any sort of visualization where she's holding you? My first T never touched me but she always said the goal was to have a "part of her inside of me". It's been so many years now but I've never forgotten that.

Rainbow I don't know about the visualization part of T holding me... not sure how I would ask that? I'll have to think about that and do you have any suggestions

During my appt today she did say that when people have their needs met as a child they carry that within them and feel it within themselves.. a sense of self... For example a parent saying to a child: good job we're proud of you; I love You.

When we don't recieve that growing up we have this empty space and are always looking for that acceptance. We then need to create that for ourselves... and I'm looking for T to create that for me. I however need to create that for myself. I don't want to need T in my head if that makes sense?

In addition we talked about how my emotions always feel like an emergency - like I'm going to die. This is something based on what I experienced growing up on the few times I braved showing my feelings.

Thank you as always for listening and being so supportive

[mixedup_emotions]

Wow, that sounds like a very tough but honest session.

[sugahorse1]

(((Geez))) - awesome work! That took a lot, to read that to T. You were honest. Well done. It will bring you on leaps and bounds in therapy, and you'll soon see how far you've actually moved forwards.
I can really relate to your relationship with your T - we seem to have T's that are very similar. And to an extent I think we a partially dealing with similar issues. I have a loving boyfriend of 5 years, had loving parents (so it seems) yet I still have a huge empty part that I try and fill with anything. I also possibly make demands on my T which cannot realistically be met. I need to learn that first though

geez, that's really great that you were able to tell your T exactly how you felt about her confusing messages around hugs. And it's even more impressive that you kept on trying to explain when she didn't get it at first. I'm so glad that your T was able to reassure you over some of your interpretations of her behaviour.

I really like the idea of saying "I'm not going to hug you but I would if I could". My T doesn't allow touch, but she encourages me to tell her if I feel like I'm needing to touch her, so we can talk about the feelings behind that. Being able to tell her my wishes for her also contains them somehow.

I totally understand about wanting to be able to do it all for yourself, and not wanting to need T. But for me at least, I think that needing T, and having T do some of it for me, is a necessary in-between stage. I am learning from her what to do for myself. And even though it was so hard, accepting that I need T and think about T and love T was the right way for me to go, rather than constantly fighting with myself to need and think about and love her less.

PS Oh, and I totally understand about emotions being dangerous emergencies. So glad you can start to process this in therapy.

[alcira]

geez, it is great that you were able to talk about the hug and your Ts response to you and clarify things with her. There have been a number of occasions where I've wanted to give T a hug (not really wanting her to give me a hug) because I felt she needed it (though maybe I was the one who needed it) but I never dared to even mention it, let alone do it. In fact, I am not sure I've ever touched T. I don't remember if we shook hands the first time we met. I really appreciate your courage for bringing it up with her and talking about it.

[rainbow8]

geez, I just reread all of your threads about the hugging situation with your T. I can relate because of what just happened with my T and me about emails. If I hadn't been honest with her, if I hadn't emailed her back after she sent me the first response, she wouldn't have "taken away" the agreement that she would answer 1 email each week. If only......

But I did what I had to do at the time, and here I am, not getting what I want from T. So, I'm going to think like you. I can imagine what my T would write back, or better yet, what she would TELL me in response to what I'm writing. I won't be disappointed then.

How is it going for you regards to your T's policy now?

[geez]

Hi (((Rainbow))) I feel OK with my T. I understand her policy and I certainly wouldn't want a hug out of courtesy or for her to feel uncomfortable with me giving her a hug. I know she's a hugger in real life based on some things she has mentioned (so I guess). What's important is that we feel 'contained' in session. That can mean different things for different people.

Just this past session I was telling my T about an experience I had in college with presenting an art project to a professor. This professor was really tough on grading and she gave me an A+ on my sculpture My T then told me that I found the way into her heart (the professors heart). I then said: awww you really think so? Thank you!
I felt so warm inside. My T is a professor so what she said meant allot to me Just little things that she says to me that I know aren't BS. I have a giant BS detector so I know

Another thing was before Christmas she sent me a holiday card and it was so meaningful to me. It was a general 'wishing you and your family a happy holiday' with an A+ sticker on it . It was nice of her and in response I sent her an electronic holiday card with pics of my family via email. She commented back via email with a warm response about the pics.

It may not be hugs but it's little things like that within the frame of the relationship that can both be safe and meaningful. And I'll take that

I think I finally get the hug thing. I was struggling with that and brought it up (in a round about way) with my T.

Although the human touch can be very healing, for someone like me (and maybe some of you), to rely on that hug from your therapist would take away from the emotional healing that really needs to take place.

What I mean is this. If I am really distraught in therapy, and my T gave me hug, that would immediately disengage my emotions in that moment. I would release that pain within her hug. Does that make sense?

Sure, I would feel so much better, but it wouldn't have taught me anything at all. I would have relied on her hug, rather than me completely working through that emotion on my own.

I know this sounds like a bunch of crock, but I really think I finally get why they don't hug. It is for our benefit. It feels crappy at times, but I do understand their logic behind it.

[SpiritRunner]

Originally Posted by Squiggle328

I think I finally get the hug thing. I was struggling with that and brought it up (in a round about way) with my T.

Although the human touch can be very healing, for someone like me (and maybe some of you), to rely on that hug from your therapist would take away from the emotional healing that really needs to take place.

What I mean is this. If I am really distraught in therapy, and my T gave me hug, that would immediately disengage my emotions in that moment. I would release that pain within her hug. Does that make sense?

Sure, I would feel so much better, but it wouldn't have taught me anything at all. I would have relied on her hug, rather than me completely working through that emotion on my own.

I know this sounds like a bunch of crock, but I really think I finally get why they don't hug. It is for our benefit. It feels crappy at times, but I do understand their logic behind it.

I do follow what you mean about not relying on the hug....releasing the pain within it. And I think for some, healing takes place best without the touch, outside that sort of framework.....either it distracting from the feelings that need to be worked through or not being safe in some manner.
I think for others....it's a definite need, a need for safe, stabilizing touch, maybe safe touch that would help draw out the feelings and help them be felt.
My T does not touch in session, and though sometimes I wish she might hold my hand or something - I think it will help me better in the end to learn how to let my feelings come without thinking I need touch to aid them to come out. So I know what you're saying in that respect, I think....
But I also truly do have a need for there to be touch in the therapy, because touch is healing.....I had little healing touch growing up and so many of my core issues are based around that desperate need, for someone who sees the hurt to reach out and offer a caring touch. So she does hug at the end of a session....and for me, it is both a healing and a grounding thing, particularly after a very hard session.

[chicken_wing]

Originally Posted by Squiggle328

I think I finally get the hug thing. I was struggling with that and brought it up (in a round about way) with my T.

Although the human touch can be very healing, for someone like me (and maybe some of you), to rely on that hug from your therapist would take away from the emotional healing that really needs to take place.

What I mean is this. If I am really distraught in therapy, and my T gave me hug, that would immediately disengage my emotions in that moment. I would release that pain within her hug. Does that make sense?

Sure, I would feel so much better, but it wouldn't have taught me anything at all. I would have relied on her hug, rather than me completely working through that emotion on my own.

I know this sounds like a bunch of crock, but I really think I finally get why they don't hug. It is for our benefit. It feels crappy at times, but I do understand their logic behind it.

What you say makes A LOT of sense. I still want a hug or handholding from my T though!

Poetgirl76 & chicken wing: I agree with you both. If I had a choice, I would want her to give a hug sometimes, or just touch me in some way. Touch is definitely healing for most of us.

I guess I am trying to see things from a therapist's point of view and try not to take it personal that my T feels it is best not to touch during therapy.

I did notice today that as we were leaving she actually stood really close to me when I was showing her some pictures I had. I think this was her subtle way of making me feel that she is 'present' with me. I think she kinda knew I was a little hurt by the email she sent concerning touch.

[sugahorse1]

Squiggle - I think your post makes a LOT of sense. I'm just not sure where I fit in. i think for me, touch may be a NEED by now. So not having it is causing more damage

[rainbow8]

Me, too--sugahorse. This is the first T who will touch me and SHE says touch is healing. I agree with her! But I had other Ts who were excellent even though they didn't touch me. I still felt close to them. You have to go along with what your T's rules are, or switch Ts. I wish my T would email me back but she won't. Reality hurts.

[SpiritRunner]

Originally Posted by rainbow8

Me, too--sugahorse. This is the first T who will touch me and SHE says touch is healing. I agree with her! But I had other Ts who were excellent even though they didn't touch me. I still felt close to them. You have to go along with what your T's rules are, or switch Ts. I wish my T would email me back but she won't. Reality hurts.

reality does hurt, doesn't it? but it's something we have to learn how to deal with to keep/stay healthy and balanced in life.....

[Muser]

Geez....I am such a "hugging" person I would be lost without it. I wonder after reading your post if I at times make other people uncomfortable with that but I seem to always get smiles in return. I'm not much of a talker so I think I rely on my "hugs" for what I can't articulate.

What Sguiggle328 says seems to be very poignant....very insightful.

This may sound silly but when I add a to a message it is because if I could I would.

Wishing you well, dear one.

[geez]

Originally Posted by Muser

Geez....I am such a "hugging" person I would be lost without it. I wonder after reading your post if I at times make other people uncomfortable with that but I seem to always get smiles in return. I'm not much of a talker so I think I rely on my "hugs" for what I can't articulate.

What Sguiggle328 says seems to be very poignant....very insightful.

This may sound silly but when I add a to a message it is because if I could I would.

Wishing you well, dear one.

Thanks ((Muser)) I am not a hugging person in real life but would like to be. I find I keep everyone at an arms length (not out of choice but by 'training' based on how I was treated as a child - so to do the oposite of that I find difficult unfortunatly). I am however very comfortable with virtual hugs and like to give them freely because it's so hard for me to do that IRL.

BTW don't apologize for giving any hugs ever

I am happy in a way that hugging isn't an issue that I have to deal with in therapy because my T doesn't allow it. Secretly I wish I could just be like 'normal' hugging people and be able to do that freely without feeling so awkward and uncomfortable about it. I feel like I'm missing out.

Thanks for listening and I love your 'name' BTW. It speaks for who I am.