[rainbow8]

I posted the following in lyib's thread, but it bothers me and I didn't want to hijack that thread so I'm starting my own.

I feel a lot of shame about my relationship with my T even though she tells me that she is not judging me, and that I shoudn't judge myself either. I'm ashamed of my repeating the same pattern I've exhibited with all of my Ts, of wanting them too much. I'm ashamed of holding her hand and that it feels so good, and of asking her to do it. I'm ashamed of how much I care about her and that I tell her I do. I'm ashamed of how honest I am with her about my feelings for her. I'm ashamed of wanting her to sit next to me and wishing she could hold me. I'm ashamed of looking up things about her and her family on the internet. I'm ashamed that I want to do all of the above. I also use the word pathetic to describe it, dizgirl. It's pathetic how I keep doing this over and over with all of my Ts and can't stop. I'm ashamed of all of my therapy.

[SpiritRunner]

oh rainbow, there's no need for shame.....you are working through your needs with your T. and if I understand it right, you have gone further in working through your needs, the needs of your parts, with this T than any other, because this one DOES allow you to need her and does do things for you like hold your hand! you are making such progress in understanding your dependency on Ts and in understanding your needs, and working to know how to meet them yourself. there is no shame in that.
just have joy that you have such a good T who is helping you so much to learn about your needs, who can meet some of them, and is teaching you to meet them yourself!

[Sannah]

Did you feel shame while growing up?

[vaffla]

I empathize so much with your needs :-(. I only expressed it a little bit in my therapy, because I knew my therapist didn't like it when i was feeling like that. But oh, do I understand the desperation and the hunger. My heart goes out to you. Don't be ashamed. You are human, and those are human needs that weren't met in your childhood. It is not your fault!

[Dr.Muffin]

the thing about shame is that it is a terrible motivator....no one ever shamed or belittled someone into making meaningful, long-lasting, positive changes, so i dont know why we think we can do it to ourselves

i hope you can get to a place of self-compassion and self-acceptance, rainbow. you deserve it.

[swimmergirl]

(((((((((rainbow)))))))))

Why do you feel shame about it? Is it because you don't feel worth the care/attention she is giving you?

[granite1]

((((rain)))) it is so hard for you these days i just wih i had something i could say to help .i did read this book called Letting go of shame byRonald potter-efron it was not a bad book

[WePow]

My T says "We don't do shame."

Shame can create a cycle for us that is not healthy. You have reaons you need to reach out to your T in the way you do. The healthy option is to search inside to see what is underneith that need and desire.

[rainbow8]

When I read what I posted, I feel the shame all over again.

poetgirl: thank you for what you wrote. I know it's true, but I FEEL the shame still.

Sannah: I don't remember feeling shame about needing people, but I felt it about physiology--growing up stuff.

vaffla: thank you. Yes, it's a feeling of desperation and hunger. I'm sorry you feel that too.

Dr. Muffin: thank you. I hope I can get to that place too.

swimmergirl: Good question! It's not that I don't feel worth it. It just feels wrong to feel so good. It's misplaced, and I know all about transference. I don't think I had those feelings for anyone, though as a child, I must have had them for my mother, so it feels like it's wrong to feel this way about 5 different Ts, making them so important. It feels wrong to care more about my T than my family and to feel better with her. That's what I'm ashamed of.

granite: thanks so much for the book suggestion. You're right. I'm having a hard time since last week. I'm anxious about many things, including therapy. Things don't seem right.

WePow: I want to search for what's underneath but what if I don't find it and I still feel the way I do?

rainbow, I know. I used to feel the same. Sometimes still do.

Can you read some stuff about 'radical acceptance' in DBT? After 26 years of trying (unsuccessfully) to change my feelings, I finally decided to try to change how I felt about my feelings. It set me free, and now I can work on my feelings without the barrier of overwhelming shame...

I'm a firm believer in that what a person's feelings are never wrong. How we perceive things can be a little "off" perse, but as far as feelings go, they are yours and they are okay to have.

[Sannah]

Originally Posted by rainbow8

it feels like it's wrong to feel this way about 5 different Ts, making them so important. It feels wrong to care more about my T than my family and to feel better with her. That's what I'm ashamed of.

This is important. This pinpoints where your shame is coming from.

Originally Posted by rainbow8

When I read what I posted, I feel the shame all over again.

poetgirl: thank you for what you wrote. I know it's true, but I FEEL the shame still.

Sannah: I don't remember feeling shame about needing people, but I felt it about physiology--growing up stuff.

vaffla: thank you. Yes, it's a feeling of desperation and hunger. I'm sorry you feel that too.

Dr. Muffin: thank you. I hope I can get to that place too.

swimmergirl: Good question! It's not that I don't feel worth it. It just feels wrong to feel so good. It's misplaced, and I know all about transference. I don't think I had those feelings for anyone, though as a child, I must have had them for my mother, so it feels like it's wrong to feel this way about 5 different Ts, making them so important. It feels wrong to care more about my T than my family and to feel better with her. That's what I'm ashamed of.

granite: thanks so much for the book suggestion. You're right. I'm having a hard time since last week. I'm anxious about many things, including therapy. Things don't seem right.

WePow: I want to search for what's underneath but what if I don't find it and I still feel the way I do?

I think I would feel some shame myself if I had not been there when lets say my beloved parent was sick and when they died, because I could not deal with it and was attending my own needs, not the persons need who I loved the most? So maybe you don´t feel wrong for caring more about five different T´s more than your family. Maybe you feel shame for caring about yourself and no one else?? That would make grieving a bit hard I think? Maybe thats the essence of a lot of problems? I truly know what it is like loosing a parent and have to deal with sickness and death and it is terrifying but...still

[Freefall1974]

Good morning Rainbow.I have learned, while working with my T, that shame is the basis for my issues. I would never have believed that 3 years ago. It all boils down to the family of origin stuff FOR ME. It can be toxic. I hope you can work through that. Carrying that is difficult at best.

Please look at the dates in this thread. It is over a year old.

[Freefall1974]

Originally Posted by Apteryx

Please look at the dates in this thread. It is over a year old.

Oops. I was just reading, not looking at dates. Saw the post before mine and it was earlier today. Oh well. Thanks for pointing it out. Have a great day.

Yes, I know - I don't look at post dates either normally

Originally Posted by Apteryx

Yes, I know - I don't look at post dates either normally

My fault. Just presumed it was from May 2012, not 2011 Sorry

[unaluna]

Originally Posted by lonelybychoice

I think I would feel some shame myself if I had not been there when lets say my beloved parent was sick and when they died, because I could not deal with it and was attending my own needs, not the persons need who I loved the most?

Can I answer this anyway? Then I am off the hook, cos when I was living with my mother and got food poisoning (3 times!), the first time it happened, there was a moment where it was very clear that she felt I had brought it upon myself (shame) and she was more concerned with being late to picking up her girlfriend for their casino outing that evening than with me (more shame). She wouldn't let me call for an ambulance; she wasn't going to leave unless I told her I was okay, so I lied and told her I was fine (wth). She left, I got sick again, almost falling down the stairs (not thinking clearly, obviously) and finally called 911. She showed up at the hospital late that night stinking of cigarette smoke, I had the nurse throw her out. It feels too weird to think that I'm that person now. I'm not that person any longer. I am someone else now - without shame, but not her daughter.

[rainbow8]

Originally Posted by lonelybychoice

I think I would feel some shame myself if I had not been there when lets say my beloved parent was sick and when they died, because I could not deal with it and was attending my own needs, not the persons need who I loved the most? So maybe you don´t feel wrong for caring more about five different T´s more than your family. Maybe you feel shame for caring about yourself and no one else?? That would make grieving a bit hard I think? Maybe thats the essence of a lot of problems? I truly know what it is like loosing a parent and have to deal with sickness and death and it is terrifying but...still

Reading this thread again was good for me. I realized I am not ashamed of myself the way I was a year ago. I realize that I have reasons for my pattern and feelings for my T. I've been trying to understand and deal with them honestly. No one can take that away from me. I'm a work in progress and that's okay. My T believes in me too.

I couldn't help the way I acted when my Mom died. My Dad was there for her. Yes, over and over I wish I could have acted differently and I've "written her letters" about it, at the request of my Ts. My Mom could have initiated conversations, too but she didn't. We loved each other very much. I did NOT make the same mistake with my Dad. I was there for him until the end, and expressed my love freely.

Originally Posted by Freefall1974

Good morning Rainbow.I have learned, while working with my T, that shame is the basis for my issues. I would never have believed that 3 years ago. It all boils down to the family of origin stuff FOR ME. It can be toxic. I hope you can work through that. Carrying that is difficult at best.

Yes, shame is a biggie for many of us.

Originally Posted by lonelybychoice

My fault. Just presumed it was from May 2012, not 2011 Sorry

It's okay that it was from a year ago. I don't mind--really!

Originally Posted by hankster

Can I answer this anyway? Then I am off the hook, cos when I was living with my mother and got food poisoning (3 times!), the first time it happened, there was a moment where it was very clear that she felt I had brought it upon myself (shame) and she was more concerned with being late to picking up her girlfriend for their casino outing that evening than with me (more shame). She wouldn't let me call for an ambulance; she wasn't going to leave unless I told her I was okay, so I lied and told her I was fine (wth). She left, I got sick again, almost falling down the stairs (not thinking clearly, obviously) and finally called 911. She showed up at the hospital late that night stinking of cigarette smoke, I had the nurse throw her out. It feels too weird to think that I'm that person now. I'm not that person any longer. I am someone else now - without shame, but not her daughter.

I'm sorry your mother was like that, hankster. I'm glad you've worked through the shame.

[dizgirl2011]

Hey Rainbow,

I am a bit confused why you refered to me about using the word pathetic? I am hoping you don't think I feel you are, as I don't. I can understand a lot of what you have said and I share so much of these same feelings.

It's sad to feel ashamed for what we want most in the world- to feel cared for. I also wish I didn't need my T so much and I try my best to not rely on her but then sometimes something happens that makes me realise how much I do and it's hard.

I am glad that your T tries to reassure you that you don't need to feel shame about it.

[rainbow8]

Originally Posted by dizgirl2011

Hey Rainbow,

I am a bit confused why you refered to me about using the word pathetic? I am hoping you don't think I feel you are, as I don't. I can understand a lot of what you have said and I share so much of these same feelings.

It's sad to feel ashamed for what we want most in the world- to feel cared for. I also wish I didn't need my T so much and I try my best to not rely on her but then sometimes something happens that makes me realise how much I do and it's hard.

I am glad that your T tries to reassure you that you don't need to feel shame about it.

dizgirl, this thread was from over a year ago!!! I don't remember for sure, but I think you mentioned that YOU felt pathetic about therapy and I was saying I feel that way too. I know some people don't think so, but I've come a long way since I created this thread last year. I understand my feelings and don't feel ashamed anymore. I accept my needs and am trying to deal with them. Yes, we rely on our Ts. It is what it is--for now. Hopefully, we will be able to rely on them less one day.