[InTherapy]

So I had an extra session with T today due to a bunch of family drama going on ... not "regular" family drama either, but "big" stuff... lawyers, gardian ad litems... make a statement, take a side, etc etc etc

So this is what T and I talked about near the end of our session:

I told T I have been having a really hard time not cutting the past few days. That I lay in bed and toss and turn and I can't sleep, trying to see a solution to the problem but I don't see any solutions. Only bad outcomes.

And I'm tired and I just want to cut.

Only I don't actually want to cut. It's just easier to say than "I want to burn myself." I know that sounds stupid because why should one be easier to say than the other? But I guess I just have a lot of practice saying "I want to cut", because I almost never want to burn.

T asked me if I had ever burned myself before and I said yes but not usually because it hurts a lot worse to me.

So her conclusion was that since I was so upset I needed worse pain or something. I don't know.

But then she started talking about how I should try not to hurt myself and use some of the strategies we've talked about in the past but IF I DO end up hurting myself then I should "not pass judgement" on myself and "be kind and forgiving to myself" and stuff.

And I was really upset when she was telling me this and I knew it was wrong! But I was pretty upset and crying and I couldn't really figure out why she was "wrong" I just knew she was.

But...

I think I've got it now...

When someone does something bad, you don't "forgive them" or "choose not to judge them"... That's just not what we as a society do. If someone robs a bank, you don't say, "Be kind to yourself!" We say "You're a bad person and you need to be punished."

I don't understand why my T is saying these things to me, it's very distressing! She's shaking up my snow globe!

I don't SI but I have another unhealthy coping mechanism. When I discussed it with my T he said of course if I could not do it...that would be the best but that if I can't help it and I do do it...then I should not judge myself it is just a coping mechanism... so its like some people drink, some people eat, some people cut, some people burn ...(although I agree that society might not view it all as equal) they are all ways to deal with distress.. My T says not to judge myself because at that moment that is the only coping mechanism that works. Later, when I learn to deal wiht the distress better and have more coping skills, I won't turn to that one anymore...

so listen to your T.

[missbelle]

But then she started talking about how I should try not to hurt myself and use some of the strategies we've talked about in the past but IF I DO end up hurting myself then I should "not pass judgement" on myself and "be kind and forgiving to myself" and stuff.

I never cut but I ate..like anything...then from guilt, I ate more... I think that is what she is saying.....Forgive yourself because if you cannot you will just cut more!

We are on a journey here and sometimes we have major set backs. That doesn't mean we are looser's or criminals, or bad..it means we messed up and it can be fixed...."today is the first day of the rest of your life' In other words we always, and I mean always, have another day to learn, to grow, to get better....to stop!

[Luce]

I understand what your T is sayng, I think. My T never said it to me, but I began saying it to myself and it was so healing and helpful. It was a way to support myself, I suppose.
For me it wasn't about Si , but when I was trying really hard to give up binging and purging. I would try to fight the urges for as long as I could, but when I simply couldn't resist and gave in to it I would mentally beat myself up so bad. The effect of that was deeper depression, hopelessness, and setting the cycle in motion all over again.
But then I decided to forgive myself for it instead of acting as though I was the most pathetic person in the whole world. I decided to acknowledge myself for all those minutes that I succeeded in not b+p before I gave in, to give myself credit for my efforts, and to be gentle with the hurting person who so desperately needed the release that b+p offered.
It was the turning point in my healing from my ED. A little self forgiveness really can go a very long way.
I think your T is on to something.

[here today]

I agree with Luce.

But I also understand the distress at having your snow globe shaken up!

If someone robs a bank, their behavior is bad -- they are taking something that doesn't belong to them, etc., etc. Doesn't have to mean that they are a "bad" person necessarily. Plus, punishment doesn't always work that well in changing behavior anyway. Acceptance and forgiveness -- that may be a new idea for sure!

[stopdog]

I do not see my SI as bad - it is in some ways for me a way to be kind and to stop the more intolerable other. Even with the punitive aspect, for me, it has served a purpose and kept me from greater harm. It may not be the most desirable way to handle certain things, but it works and keeps me alive and alleviates a great deal of prolonged distress for me. Is there any way to change how you consider si? Not to make it a desirable activity, but to give it an understanding of its usefulness even while acknowledging the usefulness may be at an end or need to be replaced with something else?

[unaluna]

idk if it sounds like the same thing to you all, but my T was kinda startled when I told him I finally realized, "I'm allowed to eat." i'm allowed to eat breakfast, lunch, dinner. BEFORE I get too starving. and i'm allowed to eat lightly, to not feel stuffed. these were things that were NOT allowed to me as a child, so I never learned them until recently. it seemed like there was always too much other noise, too much other stuff, too much yelling, too much activity, going on. but all in my head, cos I do live alone

[WikidPissah]

Originally Posted by stopdog

I do not see my SI as bad - it is in some ways for me a way to be kind and to stop the more intolerable other. Even with the punitive aspect, for me, it has served a purpose and kept me from greater harm. It may not be the most desirable way to handle certain things, but it works and keeps me alive and alleviates a great deal of prolonged distress for me. Is there any way to change how you consider si? Not to make it a desirable activity, but to give it an understanding of its usefulness even while acknowledging the usefulness may be at an end or need to be replaced with something else?

When I accepted the si in this way I actually was able to change it. Looking at it as a coping skill instead of a repulsive behavior was key for me.

[LoneWolfie]

My T once said to be kind to myself and to be honest it went right over my head! She also mentioned self soothing, couldn't wrap my head around that one either. I have tried the bubble bath, it didn't help.

Maybe it is because I have never had children, that it is just difficult for me to get my head around it. I think having kids, you learn to do these things because well you need to for children.

I don't consider myself maternal in any way. I have cats and they are my kids but definitely not the same!

in, the session before last i shared some sensitive material with t, and when i left he said "I want you to be kind to yourself" it kinda gave me permission to do the things i like and not feel guilty for them
i si as well, and if i am allowed to forgive myself i think that would go a long way in healing.
I am glad your t said this to you and that you shared with us, it really helps me , thank you!

[TheWell]

My T said the exact same thing to me for the exact same reason. I had been self harming and I was beating myself up about it. I was struggling so hard to not self harm. He told me not to focus so much on not self harming, that I was stressing myself out more trying to not self harm. He also told me to be kind to myself.

[TheWell]

I've burned myself too, it does hurt worse. When I described burning myself was when my T actually got worried enough that he talked to my PDoc about putting me on Naltrexone to try to control the self harm. It has worked BTW I've been clean for 4 months.

[Dr.Muffin]

Originally Posted by InTherapy

So I had an extra session with T today due to a bunch of family drama going on ... not "regular" family drama either, but "big" stuff... lawyers, gardian ad litems... make a statement, take a side, etc etc etc

So this is what T and I talked about near the end of our session:

I told T I have been having a really hard time not cutting the past few days. That I lay in bed and toss and turn and I can't sleep, trying to see a solution to the problem but I don't see any solutions. Only bad outcomes.

And I'm tired and I just want to cut.

Only I don't actually want to cut. It's just easier to say than "I want to burn myself." I know that sounds stupid because why should one be easier to say than the other? But I guess I just have a lot of practice saying "I want to cut", because I almost never want to burn.

T asked me if I had ever burned myself before and I said yes but not usually because it hurts a lot worse to me.

So her conclusion was that since I was so upset I needed worse pain or something. I don't know.

But then she started talking about how I should try not to hurt myself and use some of the strategies we've talked about in the past but IF I DO end up hurting myself then I should "not pass judgement" on myself and "be kind and forgiving to myself" and stuff.

And I was really upset when she was telling me this and I knew it was wrong! But I was pretty upset and crying and I couldn't really figure out why she was "wrong" I just knew she was.

But...

I think I've got it now...

When someone does something bad, you don't "forgive them" or "choose not to judge them"... That's just not what we as a society do. If someone robs a bank, you don't say, "Be kind to yourself!" We say "You're a bad person and you need to be punished."

I don't understand why my T is saying these things to me, it's very distressing! She's shaking up my snow globe!

does beating yourself up after you've done something you're not proud of ever really help?

generally speaking when we do things that we view as "bad" there are one of two paths we can take....we can beat ourselves up, let that behavior define us, descend into a shame spiral and likely end up doing it again and again because we feel hopeless and worthless and generally pretty crappy.

OR....we can acknowledge that our behavior was really not great or helpful, understand the context in which it happened, and allow ourselves the space to make a better NEXT choice.

i think that's what your therapist was saying.

In Therapy. I'm with you. My T says the same thing. Makes my blood boil. Must be "textbook". Now that Dr Muffin just explained it-it makes so much more sense.

[Perna]

SI is a behavior, habit, addiction, defense; it is not "you" but something you do. You are not bad for doing it, you might be bad for hurting someone who was not threatening you but not if you did it in "self defense"? Think of your SI as "self defense", you feel threatened and need help defending against the perceived threat until you can learn how to defend yourself in other, better ways, or turn the perceived threat into a non-threat.