[CantExplain]

We had a discussion about my fantasy of the “Good Mother”.

T: One who would support you the way you wanted to be supported, love you the way you want to be loved, and never challenge you.

This fantasy has come between us the whole time I have worked with her. I have always judged her by this standard and when times were tough, she never measured up. She became the Bad Mother, which is also a fantasy. I couldn’t see the good things she was offering me. This connects with my black-and-white thinking and my need to control her.

But when times were good, she did measure up, and fantasy and reality merged. What bliss! And this explains most of my attachment.

Alas! I have never yet let go of the fantasy, and I find, to my shame, that the fantasy still matters more than the woman in front of me. By quitting therapy, I keep the fantasy intact. I am free to imagine her as I wanted her to be. And if she gives me the farewell letter I’ve asked for, that will reinforce the fantasy too. (Which is precisely why she might decide not to write it.)

[stopdog]

Do you think you might decide to give up the fantasy instead of the therapist?

[CantExplain]

Originally Posted by stopdog

Do you think you might decide to give up the fantasy instead of the therapist?

That's certainly an option.
I would have to persist with this therapist.
And it's almost possible I might do that.

There is some good stuff coming out. That's why they make you do the termination sessions: you're in a different frame of mind and perhaps more receptive.

[CantExplain]

Where does the Good Mother come from and why do I cling to her?

SPECULATION:
My mother was very good to me as an infant, but then changed for the worse. I keep hoping for my good mother to come back. That's impossible, of course. But there is a young and deep-seated part of me that is convinced she will.

Don’t orphans fantasise that their real parents will come back for them and everything will be all right? There must be a name for that complex. And a cure.

[CantExplain]

Thinks: This is the root of my difficulties with several other people on PC. They perceive this fantasy at some level and try to debunk it. But I'm not ready to let go of it and I feel triggered. And they can't understand why I am triggered and I can't understand why they can't understand, etc.

I'm really excited about this new idea. And like a fool I've broken with my therapist and won't see her until the 11th.

[stopdog]

I don't get the use of the term triggered in this instance. I do understand wanting the fantasy on some level even though I can't understand wanting it with a therapist (I think they are wily and untrustworthy). I also can understand not wanting to be talked out of it.

[CantExplain]

It's only four hours since T raised this idea, and I'm still working on it.

The previous idea was that our conflict was pure ego. That was a depressing and futile prospect. I was faced with the choice of losing or walking away. (Nobody wins against this T!) So I chose to walk away.

But this current idea (that it's all about fantasy mothers) is much more constructive. If we could kill the fantasy, we would both win, and much of the conflict between us would evaporate. (Inject scepticism here.) It might even allow me to see T as supportive. (That's a real stretch, CE.) In which case, quitting would be the wrong thing to do. (Calm down. This is all highly speculative.)

So how do we kill a fantasy? I guess that's T's area of expertise.

I think you can start to kill it by recognizing a pattern and the fantasy. I too have a good mommy will save me fantasy and have all my life. No one would ever measure up to that fantasy, as it is perfect in my mind.

[ECHOES]

There ya go again Black/White, Either/Or, Good/Bad. I know that dance

But, guess what?! You can continue to see her and keep the fantasy, now that you know it is a fantasy.

win-win!

[Oceanwave]

just let go of her. If you feel she is the bad mother she probably is. just get out of that relationship, it cannot be good for you. it sounds like a poisonous relationship.

[CantExplain]

EPIPHANY:
I have accepted that the Good Mother is a fantasy. The next step is to own it as my fantasy.

I need to accept that other people do not share this fantasy, that other people can legitimately have different views on the nature of support and the duties of a parent.

[ECHOES]

I need to accept that other people do not share this fantasy, that other people can legitimately have different views on the nature of support and the duties of a parent.

Separateness.

[CantExplain]

The Perfect Parent is a fantasy and T can never measure up to that. OK, I accept that is true.

But it is also true, that in a crisis, T could be a much better parent. And this is no mere fantasy, because I know two people who are better parents to me in a crisis.

It may be that kicking me when I am down is good therapy. But to me, it feels like abuse and I won't put up with it.

[stopdog]

CE - I believe a client has every right to not put up with whatever they deem to be abusive therapy. The problem lies in that the answer, I believe, is to find a new therapist usually rather than the original one changing. I think the original one should be able to find a way to not seem abusive, but in my opinion, the reality is they get just as stuck as a client.

[CantExplain]

Originally Posted by stopdog

CE - I believe a client has every right to not put up with whatever they deem to be abusive therapy. The problem lies in that the answer, I believe, is to find a new therapist usually rather than the original one changing. I think the original one should be able to find a way to not seem abusive, but in my opinion, the reality is they get just as stuck as a client.

I think you are right. One thing is certain: current T is not budging.

[Chopin99]

T is not budging because she is trying to teach you something. In my session yesterday, I was told that once one accepts *whatever*, the need begins to fade. The fact that my need for maternal touch is still there, it means I am not letting go of something. It is most likely a "good mother" fantasy.

I'm starting to believe there is no "good mother". No mother is perfect. No one can replace our mothers. T usually says that everything is as easy as choice. This time she did not. Acceptance is a process.

I believe your T wants you to let go of the fantasy. If she is worth her salt, she will let you do that in whatever manner it takes; with or without her.

Realize that your T really cares; even to the point of sacrifice. That was another lesson I learned yesterday. I told T that I realized through this last rupture that while it seemed really harsh, I knew she was only doing it for my own good. Her tears told me the answer. It wasn't easy for her, but she did it anyway...and it turned out for the good.

[Anne2.0]

Originally Posted by CantExplain

I need to accept that other people do not share this fantasy, that other people can legitimately have different views on the nature of support and the duties of a parent.

I think that this statement is a step in a really positive direction. Most of us could do better with accepting that different views of most things are legitimate, rather than being stuck in being True Believers, usually of our own correctness.

However, I would point out that what you identified as an epiphany seems flatly inconsistent with a statement you made a few posts down in this thread:

"It may be that kicking me when I am down is good therapy. But to me, it feels like abuse and I won't put up with it."

To me this statement seems like it is the exact opposite direction of accepting different approaches to support-- it claims that if you do not engage in the support I want, that is abuse.

I do not question at all that you know what is best for you and your therapy, and that you should seek another therapist for whatever reason makes sense to you.

It doesn't really matter to me what someone thinks is bad therapy or not, although I might disagree with someone's analysis of that. But I find it offensive to label things as "abuse" when they are so clearly not. It's offensive to me as a survivor of actual abuse, it's offensive to me as someone who works with abuse survivors, it's even offensive, in my opinion, to people who have been abused by therapists who have assaulted them in physical actions or emotional tearing down or financial shenanigans. Sometimes people say that using the "abuse" word trivializes the experiences of people who really understand what that words means and have had those experiences. I see the point in that, but I think of it more as anyone who throws around that label so carelessly and casually demonstrates insensitivity and a privilege that I so wish I had been able to have. I wish I could label everything my T has said that I don't like as abuse, but I actually get the meaning and unfortunately the implications of what using that word means. It feels to me that you haven't had to suffer the consequences or the implications of what that words means, yet you are trying to claim the benefits, including the sympathy of others, by using that word.

I'm not trying to tell you what to think or what to do. I suppose if you need to see yourself as a victim you can certainly continue to do so, and I feel like I've said everything I wanted to say here. You might even claim that I have victimized you by what I've said or by being critical. So be it. This is one of those times where I have said what I said here because I needed to say it, not because I have some expectation that you care about what I say or that you even have read it or that you will somehow change as a result.

My T has often told me that I am particularly concerned with the "precision" of words and language, and I guess this is yet an example of that. I actually happen to think that words have particular meanings, and perhaps this needs to read in the context of something-- or perhaps everything-- about me. I have had other discussions with people IRL about the casual and misdirected use of this word, so it's something of a repetitive issue for me. Perhaps it is unfortunate that it is something that I can't let go of without commentary, but there it is.

[Perna]

Originally Posted by CantExplain

Where does the Good Mother come from and why do I cling to her?

Your wonderful imagination.

No one wants the Bad Mother around/being thwarted in our desires. The "I hate you!" with door slamming punctuation of a young child to teen is as legendary as the two year old's temper tantrum and "No!" response.

Clinging is sort of a immature/don't-know-self-well reaction to me. If one hasn't figured out how to work to fulfill one's own desires or smile and gently chide or soothe one's self when having a "Mine!" day that isn't going well, one rolls out the soft blankie of the wonderful imagination to do it for us.

[stopdog]

I think abuse, like everything else, is relative. I tend to think most things are not abuse, but if someone else sees it that way for themselves, then who am I to question it.

[CantExplain]

Originally Posted by Chopin99

T is not budging because she is trying to teach you something.

Whatever the lesson is, I'm not learning it.
T has a very limited range of teaching tools and is not taking my emotional learning difficulties into account.

Her tears told me the answer.

If I could see her tears, that might balance the equation. But I'm not seeing any.

[CantExplain]

Originally Posted by Anne2.0

But I find it offensive to label things as "abuse" when they are so clearly not.

If you don't like that word, I withdraw it.
Let's not argue about whose pain is worse.
Let's just leave it as "kicking me while I'm down."