[NowhereUSA]

trigger icon for suicidal ideation and planning.

i've deal with sui thoughts my whole life however i've never felt this bad. not even when my family and my brief prevT had me hospitalized. and i don't feel briefly sui. it's like something i experience all the time. you'd have to hospitalize me for months. this time my t thinks it's exacerbated by postpartum.

anyways, the sui ideation has gotten almost overwhelming in the last few months. i do have an actionable plan, my t knows this. my hubs knows it. everyone knows it but i don't think they take my safety very seriously. except i don't know that i want them to. i feel so conflicted. like, i like the fact that pretty much my hubs will let me go wherever and not check up on me. it makes it easy because it would be ages before he'd realize something was wrong. yes, i could tell him, but i don't want to lose that freedom. complications.

i guess i feel like a fake. i go to therapy every week and i tell my t how i'm feeling and i'm honest (mostly, more on that later). he puts me thru the rigamarole of promises and has been only successful in getting me to promise to be around next week.

but i feel so fake. like, if i'm going to kill myself, why am i talking to him? why do i tell him? i'll swear to myself i'm going to keep my mouth shut and then some little bit comes out. i do give him promises but honestly, when i decide to execute the plan, our agreements won't really mean anything to me. like i think i should just stop talking about what's in my head.

(fyi, i hate the hospital. i would rather be dead than in the hospital).

i see my pdoc on tues. and my t has already talked to him so i can't really fake the questions about my ideation. besides, i don't think the pdoc will do anything because i'm seeing my t like right after so he'll let my t handle things. except i've thought about bailing last minute on my session.

my head feels like it's going to explode with all this internal conflict. *sigh*

sorry for the long rambliness.

[Perna]

It sounds like for you, conflict is good I had a heck of a time one afternoon not jumping out my high rise apartment window but made a dental checkup appointment for a couple weeks later instead. Can't be rude and bail on the dentist! (What???) In other words, my "Self" kept me safe. Luckily I had begun to realize that when things were toughest my "unconscious" kicked in or my body did its thing and that I could, in that way, trust "myself". That made me feel more in control and like I would do what I needed to and what was best for me and that I did not have to do so much overthinking.

Keep talking with your T, promising you will see him next week and "waiting". Feeling so horrible, especially if it is exacerbated by postpartum won't last forever. You are stronger than "It" and you know you want control (so "It" isn't going to win). Maybe your pdoc will have a different med that might help with the postpartum exacerbation that your T thinks you have? Ask him what he thinks of T's thought?

I know "knowing" what may be wrong does not help one feel better. I use to get suicidal ideation with my period when I was a teen and knowing I felt so bad, etc. because of my hormones did not help one whit (it was a bit like later when I'd get drunk and the next day have a horrible hangover and wish I hadn't gotten drunk :-) but that week would pass. We cannot know what might happen tomorrow/next week/next month/next year but I do know I am an excellent, tough "waiter" and, for me, that has made a difference. My life turned around starting in my late 30s and I'm glad I hung on until then. Truly, the last 20-25 years have more than made up for the first 40.

[NowhereUSA]

yes. i 'sabotage' myself likewise and as of late i have wondered if that makes me insincere in my desire. perhaps it is because i have become worse in my depression and now i feel more certain of the inevitable. do i tell my t? i know his response - not necessarily the hospital but there is nothing he can do and i don't know that i want to argue the finer points of philosophy on it myself. god i sound morbidly hopeless.

ADs have never worked on me and i've been on quite a few plus some enhancers like abilify and even some bipolar meds. nothing but side effects. we had a med before i had my last baby that at the time i said worked wonders but it was so long ago (i couldn't take it during pregnancy) that i'm doubting my memories. i only remember the session my t knew something was different and he had no idea about my medications. so maybe it was doing something. but it doesn't now. it was an off-label use.

i feel so utterly hopeless and i hate talking to anyone who isn't my t because i swear everyone reads the same stupid book and says the same thing to me. *sigh*. think of your family! they will hurt. and that's like the worst thing to say because i've lived my whole life doing what other people want to my own self-detriment. i'm like oh - stay around like a husk so that other people won't hurt? that's all i'm worth?

i know the "right" answer is to talk to my t. to admit these thoughts. i just don't see how it will be any different from all the other times i've talked to him. i'm a tough case and it's not just him who has said that. i have had even my family doctor look up experimental depression treatments because she doesn't know either how to help. my pdoc... well i'm not really thinking he's going to have anything.

*sigh*

be a good girl and do the right thing and talk to t or be decisive and do what i want. this inner turmoil is exhausting.

[NowhereUSA]

well. i sent an e-mail to my t trying to outline my thoughts. i did hold a card in my sleeve though. i didn't tell him that the agreements he's been getting from me are worthless. i also didn't tell him that i have a back up plan either.

but. i did express the level of danger that i'm in tho i know i can be okay until i see him on Tuesday. we'll see how it goes.

[feralkittymom]

It may not make sense, and I doubt it will make you feel better, but being aware of the conflict in your head is probably what is keeping you out of the hospital. It's actually a sign of progress and stability that you are aware of feeling so conflicted. There is a part of you that knows and wants to keep going, and that part can help to keep you safe. The turmoil is more at the front of your consciousness and feels stronger--more immediate--but it really isn't stronger. As Perna said, you need to keep giving yourself the time to wait the bad feelings out.

[ThisWayOut]

I got nothing useful, but wanted to send support. I can relate a lot to what you wrote, minus the kid thing... but the hopelessness, the plan, the conflict. ♡

[ScarletPimpernel]

I've been in a similar place. I have suffered from daily suicidal ideation since my teens. The thoughts are there on good days and of course bad days.

I've made all the promises to my T. I think the only one that actually works is that she made me promise to call her before I do anything. In my mind, I figure if I don't call her and have a failed attempt, I'm going to be in trouble with the one person whose support I will need.

Like Perna, one of the things that keeps me going are my appointments. "Can't do it today, I have my dentist appt. Can't do it tomorrow, I see my T. Cant do it Wed or Thurs, I see my pdoc on Fri. Can't do it on Sat or Sun, I have to do laundry on Monday". Yes, this is my actual thoughts for this week.

My worst times are at nights and Thursdays. My fiance and I don't sleep in the same room, and he goes to school on Thursdays and is gone for 7 hours. During these times, I utilize the crisis line and any minor excuses (like a Dr. appt) to keep me holding on.

I also look at what I've gained because I'm still alive. I have an awesome T and Pdoc, two beautiful dogs, I've met many good people and have seen people do good acts for others. I got to see my neighbor's newborn baby. I just saw my little sister after 8 years. What will tomorrow bring that I might miss if I'm no longer alive?

It is difficult when your own mind is working against you. But you are meant to be alive. You are meant to be in other's lives, and you are meant to experience all the small beautiful moments that lie in front of you. You are valuable. Not simply the role you play in other's lives, but because you are your own unique miracle.

Try to hold onto whatever thought, feeling, or idea that can convince you to keep going. Take a day at a time. An hour. A minute. But you are worth fighting for your own self.

[Perna]

One positive for me about hanging in there is that all the earlier stuff now "makes sense" and is "neatly" :-) part of me and cherished. Even the parts that use to discourage me the most, the 10-25 years I wasted in fantasy have been useful and helped me in this future life I cannot have imagined/known about while I was living through the pain and confusion.

I was fortunate and had a friend when I was in college predict my future and I took some of what she said to heart and hoped for that and, sure enough, it came. We do go toward what we want, hope, and dream, what makes me, "Me". I had a "life" dream (night) in my early 30s and its images stayed with me and helped me hang in there too, along with a lot of therapy and just putting one foot in front of the other.

If you cannot have or feel/experience the things you would like yet, (one of my favorite words, "yet"), then look and latch on to their symbols and representations. My keychain carries a 19th century brass house key that represents my heart's private library. You know: the one with the French doors leading out into the walled garden, the wood floors, spiral staircase, worn oriental carpets, deeply cushioned arm chairs with lace antimacassar :-) wood-burning fireplace, big, antique library table and roll top desk covered in books, piles of paper, all my projects?

[precaryous]

I have been in a similar place, too. I have needed the pain to stop since I was at least ten years old.

My grandmother successfully Sui when I was 18 after a long struggle with depression. She let my dad, her son, find her. All of her pictures came down off the wall and no one talked about her anymore. That doesn't mean her leaving wasn't painful. It reinforced my belief that I was destined to end up the same way.

Years have passed and I am now near the age she was when she died. In the meantime I have fought with depression my whole life. A few years ago I discovered I was seriously ill. Interestingly, I have endured tests and procedures to prolong my life. I guess it's one thing if I decide to take my life...another entirely if something or someone is trying to take it from me before I am ready. The way I feel now...if I die, I will miss leaving certain people in my life. I will miss the birds migrating with the seasons, I will miss the smell of freshly cut grass, I will miss being under a big blue sky.

[NowhereUSA]

Originally Posted by precaryous

I have been in a similar place, too. I have needed the pain to stop since I was at least ten years old.

My grandmother successfully Sui when I was 18 after a long struggle with depression. She let my dad, her son, find her. All of her pictures came down off the wall and no one talked about her anymore. That doesn't mean her leaving wasn't painful. It reinforced my belief that I was destined to end up the same way.

Years have passed and I am now near the age she was when she died. In the meantime I have fought with depression my whole life. A few years ago I discovered I was seriously ill. Interestingly, I have endured tests and procedures to prolong my life. I guess it's one thing if I decide to take my life...another entirely if something or someone is trying to take it from me before I am ready. The way I feel now...if I die, I will miss leaving certain people in my life. I will miss the birds migrating with the seasons, I will miss the smell of freshly cut grass, I will miss being under a big blue sky.

this is me. i've needed the pain to stop since i was 10 and i'm into my 30s now and i've never had more than the briefest respite from it (i'm talking months, never years). it's like torture.

i've just gotten to a place where i'm too tired to hang on. it's not about needing reasons, it's pure exhaustion. a marathon runner can have all the reasons in the world, but if the body is going to give out, it's going to give out and there's not one thing the runner can do about it.

idk what my t is going to do when i see him tomorrow. i can't promise him anything. my entire brain is screaming this has to end *now* and i'm limping along going 'i just have to make it until tomorrow...' except there's no immediate relief.

there's nothing anyone can do! i've done the antidepressants and the extras and bipolar meds (i've got a running list of all the meds i've tried including MAOIs). i've done the therapy (my t says i'm incredibly hard working and i'm doing the right things and that i'm very skillful).

they just can't make the pain go away i'm tired of being in pain. i feel like i'm suffocating.

[precaryous]

Originally Posted by NowhereUSA

this is me. i've needed the pain to stop since i was 10 and i'm into my 30s now and i've never had more than the briefest respite from it (i'm talking months, never years). it's like torture.

i've just gotten to a place where i'm too tired to hang on. it's not about needing reasons, it's pure exhaustion.

idk what my t is going to do when i see him tomorrow. i can't promise him anything. my entire brain is screaming this has to end *now* and i'm limping along going 'i just have to make it until tomorrow...' except there's no immediate relief.

they just can't make the pain go away i'm tired of being in pain. i feel like i'm suffocating.

I know this feeling. I am glad you see your T tomorrow and hope they come up with a plan, dear NowhereUSA.
Please let me know how it goes.

[ThisWayOut]

I can totally relate to all that. I hope you are able to let your t in on how you are feeling.
I can relate to the pain being unbearable, and being utterly exhausted.
I wonder if maybe a specialized inpatient program might help? Like a residential treatment program. You go for a few weeks or a month, you focus intensely on whatever it takes to get to a point of relief, and you get supports in place to help it continue once you leave. I was in the same place you are, and 3 years ago was able to start something like that, but then my insurance decided to stop paying so I could not continue. That place helped a lot, and I was able to function really well for another almost 2 years (but then I dropped myself back into the place of all my nightmares by moving back to my childhood home. I think it would have been easier had I completed the work I started while inpatient, but that didn't happen).
I just thought I'd throw that treatment option out there. I know it takes a lot to be able top walk away from your everyday life for upward of a month or two, but you'd be walking away for much longer if you gave in to the plan to kill yourself. It might be worth a shot, and you might actually get some relief from it.

[NowhereUSA]

i tried googling residential treatment programs. they are expensive! (none near me, i'd have to travel to another state). i wish i had that kind of money they sound kind of like something i'd benefit from

[ScarletPimpernel]

I don't really know resources outside of San Diego, CA. We have crisis houses here. They don't do intense treatment, but they're like a hospital minus the hospital and doctors. There are counselors there 24/7, and they help you find resources in your community to further your treatment. Here it only costs like $100 to stay for 2 weeks.

Maybe you have something like that in your area? Maybe you have a crisis line that you can call?

I am also in my 30's. I have suffered with this for 20 years now. I did have good treatment about 9 years ago, but it all dropped out at the same time. I coped by drowning myself into a computer game. That became my reality for 8 years. I finally sought help again, and now I have even better treatment. But similar to you, I'm exhausted. My T and Pdoc know this is my last time. I want to live, I truly do, but not with the pain. But I have to hold onto whatever little hope I can find. I have to believe that this is all worth it.

I hope you find that it's worth it too. I'm glad you're reaching out. You're still fighting. I can truly relate to the immense suffering. You're not alone. You are valuable: even to us here on PC. Your strength to even post here is giving a voice to those who can't speak up yet.

[NowhereUSA]

thank you. i'm not excited about seeing my pdoc tomorrow. i don't think he's going to say anything - i mean, would they have withheld some secret treatment? my t has been working hard to find a solution. even had me go get a whole lot of blood work done.

i'm just tired of the pain. it's hard because everyone goes back to the script (i'm sure my pdoc will - but there's so much to liiiiiveee foooor... and he's the type i might imagine that if he weren't overworked would probably break into song. he's a good doc, just quirky). it's like - no joke. there's lots to live for but it doesn't do me a lick of good. it's like telling me to stay seated at a delicious meal but i can't taste any of it.

i have a good life. but i can't derive any pleasure out of it

Have you considered ECT treatment? I had a pdoc suggest that once when I was in my sixth year of a really dark depression.

[NowhereUSA]

i have seriously considered ect. right now money is an issue. i have health insurance but we don't make a lot of money and it covers ECT at around 80%. but i have a $700 deductible to meet first. *sigh*

If it works, it would be worth it though, right? Many places will let you make payments.

[NowhereUSA]

Originally Posted by My kids are cool

If it works, it would be worth it though, right? Many places will let you make payments.

i don't know. where i'm at right now just makes me think no. it took us five years to dig ourselves out of the hole i created with my last mental health crisis. i carry this horrible guilt about that. about my therapy. about my doctor's visits. i know that our kids could have so much more if i weren't so sick.

i look at the price tags and i think, no, i'm better off dead and not sucking the bank account dry.

I have those same guilt feelings. My experience was that once I felt better, I started making a lot more money.

[NowhereUSA]

i'm a sahm which is what i want to do (we also live in the middle of nowhere so even if i wanted a part time job, i'd have to compete with the high schoolers for the lone fast food joint). my hubs is trying to find a job that pays more but hasn't had luck yet. so we're stuck on one income next to some cornfields.

i know you're trying to be helpful. i just always wanted to be happy sahm who raised her kids and then when they got older went back and got my grad degree. right now we're lucky if the dishes don't smell and people have at least one clean outfit because i'm so low.

admittedly some of this also just comes from not wanting to try anymore. every time i think about even the next hour i want to bawl (except i can't). every time one of my children whines, i want to put a gun to my head. i've always been a fighter/survivor but in the last week, i can't muster that fire up anymore. i try and instead i just lay down and imagine it's over.

I'm not trying to make you feel worse, really. I do feel for you. I was at a point where I had to break the day into little segments in order not to kill myself. As in, I won't kill myself before I get the kids breakfast. I won't kill myself before I get the kids to school. I won't kill myself before lunchtime. Etc. My suicidal ideation also was a gun to the head, btw. And I had the gun already. I truly and deeply hope that something improves for you rapidly. Maybe try discussing the money thing and the ect with your husband? My husband kept telling me he would rather spend the money and have me alive than not have debt and have me gone.

[NowhereUSA]

haha. i'm the one who controls the finances in the house. i hate debt. is it sad that i'd rather kill myself than end up with debt? yeah. that's how bad my thinking is. i'm sure my hubs would agree with you tho. better me alive and with debt than without. but the guilt. and the shame. and the guilt.

[DoggieDad]

Wow, just wow! I have no advice, but I am just amazed. I, too, feel like I'm a "wolf crier" at times. I thought I was the only one with what seems to be constant SI. For over 40 years. I refuse to dispose of my various methods (I currently have 3 options ready to go) 'cuz it gives me comfort to know they're there if I "need" them.

I have been bad enough to have been hospitalized probably close to 20 times. Most in the last couple of years. A pdoc at the hospital hospital (as opposed to the MI hospital) flat out told me it wasn't if, it was when. They also told me they didn't want me to come back. Not because they want me better but because they're afraid that I'll suicide after they let me out and my family will sue them.

I feel I need someone around 24/7 to be totally safe. I've considered committing a crime so I can be put in prison, so I'll be safer from myself. I'm thinking solitary since I'm TS. But then I'd never be able to cuddle my critters again. And I know that would be even more unbearable.

Every day I have to come up with reasons to stay. Sometimes it's fairly easy, others not so much. But, so far I've managed, obviously. Would help if I could be more open with T, but she doesn't like to discuss it. She believes in positive thinking. Well, yeah. Sometimes it just ain't there, though.

Okay, I've started rambling. Just know you're not alone.