[Petra5ed]

I've touted how great I think my T is, but suddenly I'm afraid of him. I'm worried my strong transference is a sign he's manipulating me. He's recently started seeing my husband again, after telling me he would refer him elsewhere. I feel like he could divulge my secrets. I feel like he has too much control over me. I'm thinking of taking a break, but even the prospect of that seems too much. I'm in a weak state right now and my depression is unmedicated. Has this happened to anyone else? I used to feel that I could trust him, but now I feel like I need to keep secrets.

[HazelGirl]

Can you talk to him about all this?

[Depletion]

I remember the situation with your husband I thought that it was just awful. I can't believe that he would do that again. I also remember your thread where you were considering telling your T your true feelings. I think that your T is committing a huge ethical violation by seeing your husband, and the fact that your transference is so strong only makes it more likely that you will be horribly devastated when something further goes wrong.

I feel very strongly that you should find another T. I'm almost certain that it is an express ethics violation to see two members of a couple like that. Please look for help elsewhere.

[Petra5ed]

I will try to bring it up. I said something before and I thought I was heard, he said he would refer him to another guy. It's getting more complicated now. We both started with him in couples a couple years ago...

[harvest moon]

I agree with Depletion.. You should try to address it. I cannot understand why he would see your husband again. It seems really wrong to me and far too complicated to solve. Please try to talk to him about it..

[nicoleflynn]

Unless you are seeing him as a couple, he is not supposed to divulge any information about you.

[Depletion]

Maybe I wasn't clear. This T, is violating Petra's boundaries by doing what he is doing. This is not a give him another chance situation. It wasn't acceptable the first time, and it is way beyond ok now. Petra, you have to look for someone else end of story.

[Petra5ed]

I did google and found out it's not entirely unethical to see us separately Ethical Question: Is it ethical for a therapist to treat both a husband and wife in separate sessions? | Ask the Therapist. I agree it's odd, and from my point of view has been hard since we did couples then my husband stopped, then I spent well over a year developing a personal relationship with my therapist, then my husband returned without mentioning it to me until after he'd been. My therapist has said things like he wants to make sure my husband is doing certain things to "take care of me." And most recently he told my husband he thought I was depressed and needed to be on meds again. I don't think they discuss my transference, at least I fin hope not!

[Utterly]

Originally Posted by Petra5ed

I did google and found out it's not entirely unethical to see us separately Ethical Question: Is it ethical for a therapist to treat both a husband and wife in separate sessions? | Ask the Therapist. I agree it's odd, and from my point of view has been hard since we did couples then my husband stopped, then I spent well over a year developing a personal relationship with my therapist, then my husband returned without mentioning it to me until after he'd been. My therapist has said things like he wants to make sure my husband is doing certain things to "take care of me." And most recently he told my husband he thought I was depressed and needed to be on meds again. I don't think they discuss my transference, at least I fin hope not!

I agree with this. Its not unethical for a couples therapist to see clients individually, although it does necessitate careful internal boundaries in the therapist. Marriage and Family Therapists get extra focus on dealing with the dual relationship complications that come up.

My wife and I both saw a couples therapist jointly and individually. Both methods were useful and therapeutic in their own right. Having the whole group together is usually the norm, but not the only way to go.

[Depletion]

Originally Posted by Petra5ed

I did google and found out it's not entirely unethical to see us separately Ethical Question: Is it ethical for a therapist to treat both a husband and wife in separate sessions? | Ask the Therapist. I agree it's odd, and from my point of view has been hard since we did couples then my husband stopped, then I spent well over a year developing a personal relationship with my therapist, then my husband returned without mentioning it to me until after he'd been. My therapist has said things like he wants to make sure my husband is doing certain things to "take care of me." And most recently he told my husband he thought I was depressed and needed to be on meds again. I don't think they discuss my transference, at least I fin hope not!

But Petra didn't you already set a boundary. And isn't the nature of the therapy now individual? I think that's really only ok it the therapist is see you as a couple. Its not clear if that is the case. But more importantly, I don't think that your T should have started seeing you H again without discussing it with you first. And if a boundary was already set he really should have turned your husband away. It seems like the whole situation makes you feel betrayed and uneasy. I'm not sure your T should see you H if that is how you feel about it, unless the purpose is to treat you as a couple separately.

[Utterly]

Originally Posted by Depletion

But Petra didn't you already set a boundary. And isn't the nature of the therapy now individual? I think that's really only ok it the therapist is see you as a couple. Its not clear if that is the case. But more importantly, I don't think that your T should have started seeing you H again without discussing it with you first. And if a boundary was already set he really should have turned your husband away. It seems like the whole situation makes you feel betrayed and uneasy. I'm not sure your T should see you H if that is how you feel about it, unless the purpose is to treat you as a couple separately.

The original therapeutic agreement was with them as a couple. Its completely up to the therapists discretion how she handles individual meetings. Just because one person meets individually first doesn't mean they have "dibs" on the therapist.

The therapist still has an therapeutic duty to BOTH partners. That might mean referring but not necessarily.

[Petra5ed]

Originally Posted by Depletion

But Petra didn't you already set a boundary. And isn't the nature of the therapy now individual? I think that's really only ok it the therapist is see you as a couple. Its not clear if that is the case. But more importantly, I don't think that your T should have started seeing you H again without discussing it with you first. And if a boundary was already set he really should have turned your husband away. It seems like the whole situation makes you feel betrayed and uneasy. I'm not sure your T should see you H if that is how you feel about it, unless the purpose is to treat you as a couple separately.

I think this is what's been difficult for me yeah. We did something like 2 months of couples, then over a year of just me, then this gray area we are in now. When my husband first brought up he'd been back to the therapist I was surprised, this whole time I had been asking him to get back in therapy and we have been growing further apart. So I'm caught in a catch 22 really, of wanting and encouraging my husband to go to therapy, and then fearful and uncertain he's seeing "my" therapist, who I've fallen in love with. The way my husband brought it up was odd too, he kept it a secret then after mentioning he had gone back suddenly was referring to our t as "his" therapist when we have always just referred to him by his name. I felt like I was being attacked, like he discovered my feelings for my therapist and went behind my back to do something...

[Depletion]

Originally Posted by Utterly

The original therapeutic agreement was with them as a couple. Its completely up to the therapists discretion how she handles individual meetings. Just because one person meets individually first doesn't mean they have "dibs" on the therapist.

The therapist still has an therapeutic duty to BOTH partners. That might mean referring but not necessarily.

Right but I'm under the impression that the therapy became individual a long time ago, and if it did then to start seeing H again isn't ok. Plus Petra had a thread about this a while back where she said she wasn't ok with the dual relationship. I would expect an individual therapist to obey a client's wishes when it comes to treating other people in that person's life.

Petra, will you explain what the current agreement is with your T. Have you ever formally, or informally agreed with him that he would treat you, and only you. How come H won't see someone else?

[Depletion]

sorry posted at the same time as you lol.

[Depletion]

Originally Posted by Petra5ed

I think this is what's been difficult for me yeah. We did something like 2 months of couples, then over a year of just me, then this gray area we are in now. When my husband first brought up he'd been back to the therapist I was surprised, this whole time I had been asking him to get back in therapy and we have been growing further apart. So I'm caught in a catch 22 really, of wanting and encouraging my husband to go to therapy, and then fearful and uncertain he's seeing "my" therapist, who I've fallen in love with. The way my husband brought it up was odd too, he kept it a secret then after mentioning he had gone back suddenly was referring to our t as "his" therapist when we have always just referred to him by his name. I felt like I was being attacked, like he discovered my feelings for my therapist and went behind my back to do something...

So you have never had any kind of agreement from your therapist about who he is treating?

[Petra5ed]

We've never had an express agreement. When my husband stopped coming for over a year, I certainly thought and felt I was in individual therapy. When my therapist saw him again I was shocked and hurt. I told him I was angry. He agreed to refer my husband, and did. Since then I had marital issues come up and I had one group session again after I asked for a divorce. It's not that our relationship is that bad, it's just devoid of emotion. Maybe this opened the door again. Maybe my therapist feels guilty about my transference. I have no clue

Hi, for my two pennith's worth, if your T said he'd refer your husband somewhere else & then didn't, then I personally would tell him to go away, ending in off!!! If you are thinking that he is not trustworthy, even in a minute way, then the writing is on the wall, so to speak. It doesn't sound safe or comfortable!! Sending hugs though. XXX

[Depletion]

Originally Posted by Petra5ed

Last time this happened I was myself surprised with how much it bothered me. I told my therapist I had a lot of misgivings. He said he was (and did) tell my husband to see one of his colleagues. He said basically don't worry about it, this guy is a better fit for your husband than me. My H also corroborated this. Then some life changes happened, and I brought up marital problems. My t said am you should have your H come in. We did one group session after I asked for a divorce, with my t. Since then my husband has come in maybe 2 times? Now I come to hear my t is seeing him for free until he finds a job, my h is unemployed.

I'm not really sure that a T should see two people who are getting a divorce. That sounds like the kind of thing where the internal wall could get very tricky. Have you contacted a divorce attorney yet? You may wish to discuss this situation with them.

It sounds like your T is really trying to be helpful, but I'm really worried that he could be over extending himself. I know that its technically legal what your T is doing, but it really sounds like a situation that could get very messy.

[Lauliza]

Originally Posted by Depletion

Maybe I wasn't clear. This T, is violating Petra's boundaries by doing what he is doing. This is not a give him another chance situation. It wasn't acceptable the first time, and it is way beyond ok now. Petra, you have to look for someone else end of story.

This is true. Petra, your T is violating the code of ethics by seeing your husband as a separate client. He shouldn't even do actual couples therapy with you because he works for you already- he might not be objective. Your T can see you both together if you think having your H involved in your therapy. But he shouldn't see him as a separate client at all. Of course you are upset and don't feel heard. This is important to address with him and/or his supervisor if your T still doesn't hear you. At the very least you need another T.

[Petra5ed]

Originally Posted by Depletion

I'm not really sure that a T should see two people who are getting a divorce. That sounds like the kind of thing where the internal wall could get very tricky. Have you contacted a divorce attorney yet? You may wish to discuss this situation with them.

It sounds like your T is really trying to be helpful, but I'm really worried that he could be over extending himself. I know that its technically legal what your T is doing, but it really sounds like a situation that could get very messy.

We're not getting a divorce, I just said that in a fight

[Partless]

Originally Posted by Petra5ed

I've touted how great I think my T is, but suddenly I'm afraid of him. I'm worried my strong transference is a sign he's manipulating me. He's recently started seeing my husband again, after telling me he would refer him elsewhere. I feel like he could divulge my secrets. I feel like he has too much control over me. I'm thinking of taking a break, but even the prospect of that seems too much. I'm in a weak state right now and my depression is unmedicated. Has this happened to anyone else? I used to feel that I could trust him, but now I feel like I need to keep secrets.

I wonder if this is a common thing. At times when I was seeing a therapist, I would suddenly start to fear my T after a session, like I would look at them and as if suddenly realizing I was looking at a stranger and I would feel vulnerable. But then it would pass.

[Utterly]

Originally Posted by Partless

I wonder if this is a common thing. At times when I was seeing a therapist, I would suddenly start to fear my T after a session, like I would look at them and as if suddenly realizing I was looking at a stranger and I would feel vulnerable. But then it would pass.

The transference definitely could be bringing up unreasonable jealousy issues, conceptually bad sibling rivalry.

[Lauliza]

I didn't realize you saw this T as a couples therapist first, I apologize. So so seeing you both individually while also seeing you as a couple isn't unusual. But if you then started seeing him as your T it becomes difficult, though I guess not really unethical. Definitely not ideal for you though, especially with the transference. Its such a complicated situation to be in no wonder you feel the way you do. I know I would not be comfortable with this situation and wouldn't trust him either. I think it's a good idea to tell him how you're feeling and look for a new T. Can he give you referrals?

[StressedMess]

Originally Posted by Petra5ed

My therapist has said things like he wants to make sure my husband is doing certain things to "take care of me." And most recently he told my husband he thought I was depressed and needed to be on meds again. I don't think they discuss my transference, at least I fin hope not!

But this is the part that concerns me! Is your therapist talking about you to your husband without your permission? Is he trying to get your husband to gang up on you and get you to take meds? What???

[Lauliza]

Originally Posted by Petra5ed

then I spent well over a year developing a personal relationship with my therapist, then my husband returned without mentioning it to me until after he'd been. My therapist has said things like he wants to make sure my husband is doing certain things to "take care of me." And most recently he told my husband he thought I was depressed and needed to be on meds again. I don't think they discuss my transference, at least I fin hope not!

I was in couples therapy where my H began seeing the T after I stopped going (I didn't think it was helping). The times that he did see us individually he explained beforehand that I we had something that we wanted kept secret from our spouse (like an affair), not to tell him because he couldnt guarentee confidentiality. That is the difference with couples counseling, which I'm sure you're aware of. So the thing that I think is most important here is clarity. I think you should have a discussion with this T (and your husband if you want) regarding what kind of therapeutic relationship this is. Is he your T or his he still a couples therapist in this case? There is a difference in terms of confidentiality so it's an important question to ask. I'd jus ask directly what you can expect as you thought that he became your individual therapist but now are confused. Has he been thinking of himself as a couple's T all along and not yours? I would tell him I was concerned about confidentiality and that what you want is your own therapist who works only for you, not for the both of you as this guy seems to. If you're afraid of his thinking you're paranoid, don't be. I can't say how this T will respond, but those are reasonable questions and things he should have brought up to you when your husband started seeing him again.