[thelostone0409]

I am trying to set up an appointment with a psychologist for the first time (I have been in therapy before and seen a doctor that gave me medication) so will I be prescribed medication for my anxiety, ocd and depression on the first visit?

I have been on many medications before from my regular doctor but she told me that I need stronger medication that she will not give me, so I have no choice but to see a psychologist.

[ThisWayOut]

In the US, a psychologist (PhD or PsyD) cannot prescribe medications, only an MD (psychiatrist or other medical doctor) can do that.
An generally, a psychiatrist would prescribe on the first visit, since (in the US), they specialize in medications and generally do not do therapy.

[stopdog]

It seems 3 states do allow for it. What an alarming trend.
APA Applauds Landmark Illinois Law Allowing Psychologists to Prescribe Medications

[ThisWayOut]

“Allowing properly trained clinical psychologists to prescribe"

As long as their training is thorough, and they are under the over-sight of an MD, this might be a good thing... kinda like allowing APRN's to have scripting privileges under the supervision of an MD.

[Chummy]

My psychiatrist prescibed me medication on my first appointment. But I was already seeing a therapist. I don't know if that will make a difference.

Originally Posted by stopdog

It seems 3 states do allow for it. What an alarming trend.
APA Applauds Landmark Illinois Law Allowing Psychologists to Prescribe Medications

I don't really find it alarming at all. My therapist has started getting additional training in psychopharmacology and has worked closely in training with the psychiatrist in his office. Our state hasn't started this yet, but I suspect he'd be very good at it. My understanding is, like with NP's, they work under direct supervision of licensed physicians. The benefit of his training has been that he's been hugely helpful to me in dealing with medication questions. He has better background than most therapists in meds, so he can talk knowledgably about meds and is more aware of when problems I'm having may be due to medication issues versus psychological issues and has steered me toward my pdoc at exactly the right times. He doesn't give med advice per se, but he is very astute at weeding out med issues vs. therapy issues which can be pretty complicated when you are dealing with bipolar disorder or other mental illnesses that may require both therapy and meds at the same time. That kind of discernment has been invaluable for me.

[stopdog]

Originally Posted by lolagrace

I don't really find it alarming at all. .

That we do not agree at all on this is not that much of a surprise. I think there needs to be a lot less drugging up of humans in the us in general. So more people pushing the drug company agenda is not, in my opinion, a good thing. I am not so worried about their qualification or oversight by someone else.

Originally Posted by stopdog

that we do not agree at all on this is not that much of a surprise.

lol!! . . .

We must be cross-posting. I don't disagree about medications necessarily, but in cases where a client does need medication treatment, a psychologist handling meds at least might do a better job actually than many pdocs of sorting out the medication issues vs. the therapy issues. I love my pdoc, but he is medication focused and doesn't always see the forest for the trees, while my therapist actually is better at discerning which issue is actually at play. His ability to sort out the two has been great input (and my pdoc has appreciated his input at those times also); I love the fact that my therapist is able to talk knowledgably with my pdoc about medication vs. therapy issues. Not all therapists have that kind of medication knowledge which can really be a disadvantage for those of us that do require both medication and therapy. I realize not every person in therapy has need for medication though, so it isn't really a need or even desire for many people in therapy to have a therapist capable of understanding both.

[BudFox]

Originally Posted by lolagrace

Not all therapists have that kind of medication knowledge which can really be a disadvantage for those of us that do require both medication and therapy.

I would question whether any human being requires psych drugs… ever. Perhaps in acute cases where they are in real danger, but why else?

If you study the outcomes literature and know the facts, it is clear these drugs actually do more harm than good over the long term. Across the board.

I agree with stopdog, doesn't matter who is doing the Rx'ing, since they are all beholden to the same corrupt system that is systematically obscuring/distorting the facts.

Sorry for the soapbox rant, but I just finished a book on this subject and am horrified...

Originally Posted by BudFox

I would question whether any human being requires psych drugs… ever. Perhaps in acute cases where they are in real danger, but why else?

If you study the outcomes literature and know the facts, it is clear these drugs actually do more harm than good over the long term. Across the board.

I agree with stopdog, doesn't matter who is doing the Rx'ing, since they are all beholden to the same corrupt system that is systematically obscuring/distorting the facts.

Sorry for the soapbox rant, but I just finished a book on this subject and am horrified...

Many people who deal with bipolar disorder and schizophrenia, who deal with the manic, severe depressive, and psychotic episodes that can and often do occur with these serious mental illnesses need medications.

[BudFox]

Originally Posted by lolagrace

Many people who deal with bipolar disorder and schizophrenia, who deal with the manic, severe depressive, and psychotic episodes that can and often do occur with these serious mental illnesses need medications.

I have pretty severe depression. I would not touch SSRIs or other psych drugs.

Again, the data is out there, these drugs wreck brains and wreck lives over the long term.

I think the basis of all this drugging is the idea that mental illness is biological in origin AND that this hypothesis has been proven scientifically and borne out by studies. According to this book none of that is true:
Anatomy of an Epidemic: Magic Bullets, Psychiatric Drugs, and the Astonishing Rise of Mental Illness in America: Robert Whitaker: 9780307452429: Amazon.com: Books

BudFox, I'm not going to debate medication with you. You may not need medication at all to manage the symptoms of your depression. If not, fantastic. I agree that not everyone needs medication treatment and that far too many people are on meds with symptoms that can be managed in other ways.

Severe mental illness also wrecks many lives short and long term, and people are helped and their symptoms better managed with medications in many cases. People have to be treated individually and make those decisions for themselves. Unless you yourself are living in a person's mania or psychosis, you really can't know what may or may not work to address their symptoms.

End of my part of this discussion.

[stopdog]

OP - did you see a psychologist or psychiatrist?

Originally Posted by stopdog

OP - did you see a psychologist or psychiatrist?

The OP said psychologist, but perhaps he/she was mistaken. It wouldn't be the first time someone didn't quite understand the difference between a psychologist and a psychiatrist. But the OP said he had been in therapy before so it's hard to tell. Perhaps he'll return and clarify.

[Ididitmyway]

Originally Posted by BudFox

I would question whether any human being requires psych drugs… ever. Perhaps in acute cases where they are in real danger, but why else?

If you study the outcomes literature and know the facts, it is clear these drugs actually do more harm than good over the long term. Across the board.

Agreed. Though many people who take those drugs claim that they have been helped by them, but, I think, the definition of "help" varies from person to person. One might find it helpful to be numbed to their emotional pain and I don't blame them because the pain may be too much to handle, but this shouldn't be confused with "treatment". These drugs don't "treat" anything. In the best case scenario, as I said, they numb you to your pain, but that scenario is not as common as people would like to believe. In many instances, they don't even help to manage symptoms but, to the contrary, they aggravate the initial conditions. Besides, there was a study that discovered that in many cases when people felt that their symptoms were alleviated it was due to a placebo effect. What they clearly do is the massive damage to the body on many levels and increase the risk of suicide. This whole scam is promoted by Big Pharma to protect and increase their profits and this is criminal IMO. People are lied to about what these drugs actually do and don't do.

That all is not to say that those drugs don't have their place. They are needed as an emergency measure in crisis situations when someone is in an imminent danger to themselves or others but once the crisis is over and the person is stable they should be discontinued. This is not just my opinion. More and more prominent psychiatrists are speaking out against medicating people on the regular basis and against using DSM alltogether, including the former chair or APA Dr. Allen Frances. Anyone who wants to educate themselves on the subject can google Dr. Frances, Dr. Terry Lynch, Dr. Breggin, Dr. Gabor Mate, read the blog Beyond Meds and Mad In America - Science, Psychiatry & Community. There are many other sources to look into but those above are a good start.

[pinkflower17]

Originally Posted by stopdog

It seems 3 states do allow for it. What an alarming trend.
APA Applauds Landmark Illinois Law Allowing Psychologists to Prescribe Medications

I agree. This scares the hell out of me.

[Skywalking]

I hear your concerns, but let's break it down a little:

1. The pharmaceutical industry makes money off of drugs and is riddled with corruption.

2. Unscrupulous or simply poorly trained doctors can overprescribe medication to people who won't benefit from it.

3. Some people benefit from psychiatric medication.

All of these things are true.

Just because there is corruption in the pharmaceutical industry and medical field doesn't mean that psychiatric drugs should not be used. There are people who get to live relatively normal lives because of psychiatric medications. There are people who would be dead if not for these drugs.

No, psych meds are not for everybody. There are side effects. They're gosh-darned expensive and not everybody can afford them. There are other treatments that can be explored, and some illnesses are better addressed by using those treatments in addition to medication. My psychiatrist strongly steered me toward a holistic approach at the same time he reached for his prescription pad.

As to only using drugs in an emergency, some chronic illnesses like bipolar and schizophrenia require constant medication to stay stable. Going off of them, as a lot of bipolar folks can tell you, makes things far worse. Some of these drugs have to be taken for life to be effective. It's not the drug. It's the illness. It's a physical, biological chemical imbalance.

But telling me I don't need the medication that's helped me not cry myself to sleep every night, not feel so empty inside, because you read a book or a blog that says psychiatric medication is bad...I know you're speaking in general, but it boils down to actual people's lives. I'm one of those actual people. There's a lot of them on this forum.

And it makes me feel personally insulted and angry, y'know? It feels as if you are saying you know me and my needs better than I do, because you've read a book or a blog.

This is a topic that brings out a lot of emotion on all sides, and there are a lot of perspectives to consider. And this thread didn't start out as a debate over it. But I find it hard to leave such statements unchallenged.

[stopdog]

I don't think any of it was directed at anyone personally. I know a lot of my clients have been severely messed up by the drugs and get severely penalized by the system when they try to go off of them - and therapists as spies for mds or dispensers themselves, is to me, a bad plan. But if someone wants to take the drugs or decides they are better off with them- have at it.
I just don't like them being forced on anyone.

I am still waiting for the op to come back and clarify or comment.

[Skywalking]

I'm sure it wasn't meant that way, but generalized statements affect specific people if you're part of the population that's being generalized about; and I'm not shy about letting people know I don't appreciate it.

I do hear you, and agree, but again, these are separate issues. No, no one should be forced onto drugs or penalized for not taking them. But I strongly object to throwing people who do willingly take them and benefit from psych meds, under the bus because the system itself is corrupt. It's ableist.

I do apologize for getting off topic, but again, I feel a need to challenge these sorts of statements because I feel they're potentially very harmful and only add to the stigma against people with mental illnesses.

[stopdog]

I did not see that happening, but everyone does have opinions on this. It seemed like the OP was not unwilling and perhaps even seeking drugs for the situation - I hope the OP is finding something useful for her in the system.

IMHO a psychologist who is your T is less likely to pass out drugs then a psychiatrist. I live in the first state to implement that law. The T has to work w the person on drugs and knows more about what's going on w client. U see a surgeon for surgery, u see a psychiatrist for drugs. That's their job. And they usually make the decision on what drugs, doseage, how long u should be on them in what, a 15 minute evaluation. If u are after drugs, a lot easier to fake a 15 minute eval. Dr shopping has dropped significantly here which I think is great for the people who honestly need prescription help.

[stopdog]

I actually believe that people should be able to md shop without interference. I don't want the drugs and I don't want them foisted involuntarily on people. But I also despise the god-like way in which those people act like they do over all drugs. I actually believe in deregulating all of them and letting people take whatever they want.

[AncientMelody]

Originally Posted by cavaliers

IMHO a psychologist who is your T is less likely to pass out drugs then a psychiatrist. I live in the first state to implement that law. The T has to work w the person on drugs and knows more about what's going on w client. U see a surgeon for surgery, u see a psychiatrist for drugs. That's their job. And they usually make the decision on what drugs, doseage, how long u should be on them in what, a 15 minute evaluation. If u are after drugs, a lot easier to fake a 15 minute eval. Dr shopping has dropped significantly here which I think is great for the people who honestly need prescription help.

Not always the case. My psychiatrist has longer appointments and is good about looking at the overall factors in a person's mental health: their nutrition, sleep schedule, exercise, life stressors.

[Skywalking]

Originally Posted by stopdog

I did not see that happening, but everyone does have opinions on this. It seemed like the OP was not unwilling and perhaps even seeking drugs for the situation - I hope the OP is finding something useful for her in the system.

I'm sorry for the confusion - my comments were not directed to the OP, but to other responses in this thread. And I hope the same.

[stopdog]

Originally Posted by Skywalking

I do apologize for getting off topic, but again, I feel a need to challenge these sorts of statements because I feel they're potentially very harmful and only add to the stigma against people with mental illnesses.

I think it is just as harmful, if not more, to not acknowledge the differences and information out there about the harm and ineffectiveness of drugs. Information is not something to be feared - read up on both pro and con and then decide if taking what the medical/drug establishment wants to foist upon you - if you choose to go ahead and use it-then great - but the info about the cons is no more dangerous than the massive proselytizing/advertising/push by so called experts for it. Knowing the cons is a very good thing I believe. Then pick what works for you.