[Myrto]

So I saw the new therapist today. She's supposed to help me process things with my current T and hopefully help me detach from her. I immediately told her that I was there because of another therapist. She didn't say much, except point the obvious ("your attachment to your T seems very strong" well, no kidding). The thing is, she said that if I wanted to work with her, I had to leave my current therapist. I'm not allowed to have two therapists at the same time. My plan was: to see her one week and see my current T the other week. Alternate between the two of them until I feel ready (when? I don't know) to eventually leave my current T. I think it's ridiculous: why can't I have two therapists? This is my money and my time. Obviously I can't leave my current T, it's completely impossible, I'm absolutely not ready. But I'm seriously annoyed with this T telling me I have to stop one therapy in order to start a new one. I suspect most therapists are against mutiple therapies at the same time. I'm stuck with my current T apparently.

[Waterbear]

Oh Myrto that is rubbish. Did she understand your plan to transition? I understand the reason a lot of Ts don't want to work with someone in therapy with someone else long term (not sure I agree but I understand) but surely she can't expect you to finish straight away given that she understands your attachment is very strong. Maybe she doesn't want that attachment to form with her and this is her get out. I think that Ts do this a lot rather than just being honest and that kind of stinks in my opinion. Good on you for going though and I hope you can continue to search.

[feileacan]

Is this a psychodynamic T? If yes, then it makes a lot of sense. Psychodynamic therapy is about working with transference between you and the T. If you see another T at the same time, to whom you also have strong feelings, then it is confusing and may obstruct developing the transference in the relationship with this T. I don't believe the reason is that this T would not want you to form an attachment with her. Perhaps it is rather the opposite. But she can't help you work through those feelings when those feelings are actually mixed with someone else.

I have actually been in this situation. I relocated temporarily and wanted to see a new T there, while also keep contact with the old T. My new T agreed to see me but only when I stop talking to my old T meanwhile. I was also very attached. But in retrospect I see a lot of sense in that requirement. It helped us to develop our own relationship and although I talked to him about my old T, I quite quickly developed transference and attachment to him as well.

[growlycat]

If you are seeing two therapists for distinctly different purposes it is supposed to be ok. Also transitioning to another therapist seems legit as I am doing it right now. I'm closing shop with one t as I search for the next. Did you remind her that the goal was to transition away from the other therapist??

[stopdog]

I personally would just tell them okay and continue to do what I wanted. I would have no qualms lying to the therapist about such a thing. A little harder here because you want to talk to the one about the other. Could you take a break from the first one for a month and see the new one for that time before making the decision?

I have two psychiatrists. In addition to my primary psychiatrist I see a second for CBT and psychotherapy.

Originally Posted by stopdog

I personally would just tell them okay and continue to do what I wanted. I would have no qualms lying to the therapist about such a thing. A little harder here because you want to talk to the one about the other. Could you take a break from the first one for a month and see the new one for that time before making the decision?

I second this. I was just about to suggest the same thing.

[atisketatasket]

I think this is a "rule" each therapist sets for themselves - they do have a right to set their own working conditions. The new one probably thinks something like she can help you deal with your attachment better if you're not seeing your current therapist.

You're not stuck with your current therapist. I'd go with SD's advice: lie - if your current therapist acts up again, you can always say that whatever the incident is, it happened six months ago. Or a break from the current one.

[Myrto]

Originally Posted by Waterbear

Oh Myrto that is rubbish. Did she understand your plan to transition? I understand the reason a lot of Ts don't want to work with someone in therapy with someone else long term (not sure I agree but I understand) but surely she can't expect you to finish straight away given that she understands your attachment is very strong. Maybe she doesn't want that attachment to form with her and this is her get out. I think that Ts do this a lot rather than just being honest and that kind of stinks in my opinion. Good on you for going though and I hope you can continue to search.

Yes I told her that my goal was to eventually leave my current T but of course I can't do it right now. I think she was quite keen on working with me so I don't know.

[Myrto]

Originally Posted by growlycat

If you are seeing two therapists for distinctly different purposes it is supposed to be ok. Also transitioning to another therapist seems legit as I am doing it right now. I'm closing shop with one t as I search for the next. Did you remind her that the goal was to transition away from the other therapist??

She was against ANY psychotherapy going on at the same time as hers. She said it wasn't therapeutic even if it was a transition.

Some therapist mind; others do not. Some prefer not to be in a situation where they end up being the middle-man between client and old therapist. Others find some clients have difficulty juggling various messages they are getting from more than one therapist - that it sets up a situation of contention with the client setting one therapist's views and techniques against the other (not even necessarily intentionally, just invariably). Some find trying to counsel a client about a therapist while the client is still actively seeing that other therapist as a complicated conflict of interest and won't do it as a matter of professional courtesy.

You can keep going and lie about it. Wouldn't be my style; I don't know that I would be very good at keeping that kind of secret while at the same time trying to discuss it. I'm a lousy poker player. Or, you can keep looking for someone willing to work with a client in transition and still seeing their old therapist.

Do you think the new T may have gotten the vibe that you may not really be willing to separate from your old T? That could also be a factor if that was the case.

[Myrto]

Originally Posted by stopdog

I personally would just tell them okay and continue to do what I wanted. I would have no qualms lying to the therapist about such a thing. A little harder here because you want to talk to the one about the other. Could you take a break from the first one for a month and see the new one for that time before making the decision?

I guess I could lie. But that defeats the point of therapy doesn't it? I could also take a break but it wouldn't resolve the problem which is that she wants me to drop my current T

[Myrto]

Originally Posted by lolagrace

Some therapist mind; others do not. Some prefer not to be in a situation where they end up being the middle-man between client and old therapist. Others find some clients have difficulty juggling various messages they are getting from more than one therapist - that it sets up a situation of contention with the client setting one therapist's views and techniques against the other (not even necessarily intentionally, just invariably). Some find trying to counsel a client about a therapist while the client is still actively seeing that other therapist as a complicated conflict of interest and won't do it as a matter of professional courtesy.

You can keep going and lie about it. Wouldn't be my style; I don't know that I would be very good at keeping that kind of secret while at the same time trying to discuss it. I'm a lousy poker player. Or, you can keep looking for someone willing to work with a client in transition and still seeing their old therapist.

Do you think the new T may have gotten the vibe that you may not really be willing to separate from your old T? That could also be a factor if that was the case.

Yeah I don't know about lying because I would be supposed to have left my T while on reality still seing her so she is bound to wonder why I am
not more depressed. Maybe she got that vibe yes although like I said she seemed quite keen on working with me. Bah I don't know.

[unaluna]

Originally Posted by Myrto

I guess I could lie. But that defeats the point of therapy doesn't it? I could also take a break but it wouldn't resolve the problem which is that she wants me to drop my current T

I agree that purposely lying defeats the point of therapy. It is difficult enough to discern the truth in ourselves, imo, without adding another couple layers of deceit. Also, hanging on to a t just makes it easier to hang on to old ways without changing. Ouch! (Pointing finger at myself there!)

I also think that lying would likely be counterproductive especially given that your major goal is to address the relationship with the first T while not ready to give it up. I mean, it sounds like you are being asked to solve your problem in a practical sense before addressing it...

I know that many therapists are firmly against "sharing" patients but for me personally, this attitude (not allowing you to see the old T anymore) would be a red flag in the context of your situation. Maybe yet another controlling therapist?

Originally Posted by Xynesthesia

I also think that lying would likely be counterproductive especially given that your major goal is to address the relationship with the first T while not ready to give it up. I mean, it sounds like you are being asked to solve your problem in a practical sense before addressing it...

I know that many therapists are firmly against "sharing" patients but for me personally, this attitude (not allowing you to see the old T anymore) would be a red flag in the context of your situation. Maybe yet another controlling therapist?

Could be controlling, or just trying to head off what could be a mess down the road. Myrto knows her situation, but the therapist really knows nothing at this point and kind of has to work assuming the worst case scenario. I can't really fault the therapist for being firm about certain policies and attempting to be proactive in this kind of situation.

It is one thing to help a current client in an effective therapy situation find a new therapist and transition into a new healthy new therapy situation due to insurance changes, moves, retirement, etc; I think quite a few therapists are willing to see a client finishing up with an old therapist under those circumstances where everything is above board and generally the dynamic is healthy on both ends of the equation. But to take on a client who is in conflict with a current therapist at the same time that client is still seeing the therapist they are in conflict with is a more difficult scenario that I can see many not willing to get involved with. There are some out there willing to do so, but I suspect it is harder to find.

Therapists and pdocs set up their policies to avoid those kinds of conflicts of interest. Thus, some will not see family members; others will not see people who are in therapy with other therapists, etc.

[atisketatasket]

I don't see why this particular lie defeats the point of therapy. If you went in and told some story about a made-up trauma, THAT would defeat the point of therapy. But this? You need some help, and you may have to fudge a bit to get it.

[unaluna]

Also, two ts (or two drs) may give conflicting (medical) advice - like if you have a bad back, one dr may recommend bed rest, another may recommend exercise. Whose advice are you going to follow? Who is going to be liable if you follow the advice of both? This is kind of a dumb example, but i think you can see my point. Two meds may work against each other or be too much. Psychologically things may also get confusing.

[unaluna]

Originally Posted by atisketatasket

I don't see why this particular lie defeats the point of therapy. If you went in and told some story about a made-up trauma, THAT would defeat the point of therapy. But this? You need some help, and you may have to fudge a bit to get it.

ANY lie defeats the point of therapy!

Originally Posted by unaluna

ANY lie defeats the point of therapy!

It may not defeat the point of therapy, but I do think lies get in the way of openness, candor, trust (which could be argued to be the point of therapy - but that is obviously debatable - I don't think there is ONE point of therapy).

I'm not sure how a person could work on their complicated relationship with their old (actually current) therapist while still seeing that therapist but while lying about seeing that therapist to the new therapist. Just saying that is complicated and messy. Lies have a way of revealing themselves.

Yes, therapists do have different policies on this issue, unfortunately, you found one that has a policy that is not in your favor.

I also think some think a client is acting out by doing this, and they don't want to deal with someone who has one foot in the door and one foot outside the door. I can understand this, but that doesn't seem to be the case here. Did you tell her you have already made the decision to transition?

I also think that a therapist doesn't necessarily have to assume they are working within the worst case scenerio. The last time I saw a therapist for a similar reason, she understood me and my situation and was fine with seeing both until I was ready to make a full transition. Maybe she'd be more understanding after a second visit?

It doesn't sound like a good idea to lie about it because it's always going to be a huge elephant in the room-if you can imagine that scenario.

Sorry you are going through this. Could you tell your current therapist that you are taking a break even if you plan on quitting entirely? That way, it won't feel traumatic to break it off entirely as you know there's that crack in the door to go back if something falls out with this one. I think that's reasonable if you are doing it to protect yourself. That way, you can make the final break after you get established with this one, knowing that you have her support.

[AllHeart]

I have heard of some t's that will reconsider working with a client that sees another t after the initial meeting. Did she understand that you are in no position to leave your current t because of the intense attachment and that you are in need of a second t to help prepare you to make that move in the future? If you felt this t was good otherwise, it might be worth making your case one more time for her to reconsider allowing you to keep current t until you are able to make changes.

[stopdog]

Originally Posted by Myrto

I guess I could lie. But that defeats the point of therapy doesn't it? I could also take a break but it wouldn't resolve the problem which is that she wants me to drop my current T

Actually, I do not agree that it defeats the purpose of therapy to lie to them about certain things like their attempts at controlling what I do outside of the 50 minutes I pay them for.
I thought the idea was that you wanted to drop your current therapist but just did not know quite how to get away. A short (month) break where you engaged with a different therapist, might help you with perspective. But it was just a suggestion. I believe that in these sorts of situations, sometimes one must make some compromises/go outside the box/ make some uncomfortable choices that are not final- or things will never change.

Originally Posted by Skies

Could you tell your current therapist that you are taking a break even if you plan on quitting entirely? That way, it won't feel traumatic to break it off entirely as you know there's that crack in the door to go back if something falls out with this one. I think that's reasonable if you are doing it to protect yourself. That way, you can make the final break after you get established with this one, knowing that you have her support.

This sounds like a reasonable plan, and it may be one the new therapist could get behind.

[stopdog]

Originally Posted by unaluna

Also, two ts (or two drs) may give conflicting (medical) advice - like if you have a bad back, one dr may recommend bed rest, another may recommend exercise. Whose advice are you going to follow? Who is going to be liable if you follow the advice of both? This is kind of a dumb example, but i think you can see my point. Two meds may work against each other or be too much. Psychologically things may also get confusing.

Originally Posted by unaluna

ANY lie defeats the point of therapy!

I see two of them and have done so for over 5 years - I have NEVER had a problem with this. Ever.
I would never let a therapist dictate what I do outside of their office. I barely would let them tell me what to do inside their office.
Actually, if I ever have to see mds or - I always get information from more than one of them too. I look drugs up myself.

And I don't believe the second part at all either.

OP - good luck.