[piggy momma]

I feel like I want to discuss this with my therapist, but I'm also terrified to, so I wanted to feel it out here and see what you guys think.

Last Friday I was really struggling with some things so I texted my T and asked if I could see him for a few minutes. I felt like we were disconnecting in email and my mood was plummeting fast. He replied back and said "it's never just a few minutes". But said he'd be around at noon. Well, his email was less than welcoming, so I didn't bother going up at noon. I texted him around 12:30 and just said "sorry I fell asleep". I was feeling him out to see if he was still...grumpy. A few emails back and forth and we decided I'd go up at 2pm.

When I went up at 2, I said to him that I felt like his response was a bit abrupt considering this is the first time I have EVER asked to see him outside of a session. He turned so red I was actually scared, and tempted to turn around and walk out the door. He said he wasn't going to argue over semantics and what did I want.

So I told him I only needed five minutes (didn't even take my coat off). I told him what I wanted and left feeling pretty confident I was going to be fired at my regular session on Monday, based on what he was saying (I'm not making progress, nothing is changing, he doesn't know what to do with me, I'm going to have to sell him on my progress on Monday, etc).

I went home completely and utterly devastated. I had been trying to reach out to him for several days because i was so depressed and having suicidal thoughts. I just wanted to be heard for five minutes and it went so wrong. I should add here that I am borderline, so I have EXTREME emotional reactions to everything.

That evening I wrote him a three page (single spaced) suicide note. It was long, and detailed. There was a lot of anger and spite in it. I wrote it with the intention of causing him pain and hurt. I fully planned my suicide. Every detail. I had planned on doing it Monday after he fired me.

But Monday came and we had a really, really good session, and he didn't fire me. And we did some really good work together. We talked everything through. I told him I was actually afraid of him on Friday because of his anger at me.

Now I'm struggling with whether or not to tell him I wrote him this long letter. I feel guilty not telling him. I feel like I'm withholding information when we're trying really hard to trust each other.

On the other hand, he has really, really strict rules around suicide, and I'm afraid if he knows how close I was he actually will fire me. I'm trying to trust him, but I don't think I can with this.

It's really bothering me. I don't know what to do. Any suggestions?

[susannahsays]

I wouldn't. I remember seeing you wrote a suicide note, and I figured something along these lines had happened. I hope this doesn't feel invalidating of your pain, because I do recognize that you were very distressed - but I was not concerned that you would commit suicide after your session. So it seems pointless to risk telling your therapist about this suicide note, perhaps even a self sabotaging behavior, or perhaps a way of seeking attention and care.

[Amyjay]

I can't speak to whether you should tell him about it or not.

But, this is really good learning/growing material for you. You felt so utterly overwhelmed and devastated that you had fully planned what to do about it. But in that plan you gave yourself a chance - you were going to wait until after Monday's session.

Then Monday's session came and it was better and you felt better, and the overwhelm passed and you were able to abandon your plan.

This is the learning and the change right here. When those devastating feelings overwhelm you, try to observe the cycle of what happens... because the cycle is they will overwhelm you, and then they will go. They will ALWAYS go. Even when in the middle of them it feels like nothing will ever exist again except for what you feel in that exact moment.

The more you can learn about that cycle and hold on to your knowledge of that cycle and keep a part of yourself detached and observant and waiting, the more stable and even-keeled and growing you will become.

Has this cycle happened before? Does it always follow a similar path? What things bring you out of it and back to even-keeled and rationally-thinking again?

The key to ending or healing this cycle and reducing the danger from it is in understanding it and bit by bit, developing the ability to hold on to the knowledge of it through the hard times.

In my experience being able to discuss this cycle with one's therapist is actually really helpful too. Sometimes when overwhelm is triggered the therapist can prompt or remind the observant remembering part of self or "wake them up" or activate them to remind them. Then that part can step in and hold the safety until the overwhelm subsides. It can become part of a shared understanding of a safety plan.

[Omers]

As long as you are not still feeling suicidal I would not share it. I had a T that used to have me write letters when my emotions got really high but then never actually sent them after the mandatory 24hr cooling off.

[piggy momma]

I am no longer suicidal, no.

@Amyjay - the suicidal ideation is definitely a pattern for me. My default response to everything is always that I have to kill myself. I have the tools to deal with depression and despair and adversity, but when it comes time to use them, I throw them out the door. It drives my T crazy.

I was feeling better by Sunday, so I made up a "suicidal ideation worksheet" to fill out when I have those thoughts. It's basically a mood log based on Dr. David Burns Feeling Good Handbook. My previous T used to make me do them and even though I hated doing them with every fibre of my being, I have to admit they helped.

So anyway, I did a worksheet based on everything that had led up to the initial thoughts of ending it, and I included that we were arguing and it was distressing. I filled it all out and brought it to my session on Monday and we talked about it. He was beyond impressed that I did that. And it did help, so I don't expect a recurrence of last weekend but hey - I'm borderline - I'm full of surprises.

[susannahsays]

I'm really impressed that you took the initiative to do that, too - especially since you hate filling them out! It takes a lot to do things we hate even when we know they are in our best interests. I would know...

[piggy momma]

Originally Posted by susannahsays

I'm really impressed that you took the initiative to do that, too - especially since you hate filling them out! It takes a lot to do things we hate even when we know they are in our best interests. I would know...

Thank you! I felt like I had to do something if I was going to try and save our relationship, and I knew deep down that the cognitive restructuring DOES work for me. And, I feel like I have a tool again going forward that I hadn't used in about five years so I feel less powerless now and more in control.

[Amyjay]

Originally Posted by piggy momma

I am no longer suicidal, no.

@Amyjay My default response to everything is always that I have to kill myself.

And yet, despite this defualt position happening over and over and over again, you haven't. So maybe this default position is actually protective. It could almost be seen as a self-soothing technique, similar to cutting or drug abuse or bulimia. After all, once there's a definite plan to end the pain once and for all it does become a little easier to cope moment to moment, doesn't it? The feelings become less intense, then over days they return to baseline, then life can continue on again.

Until the next time (which is every bit as intense as the last).

When you can hold on to the cycle or pattern once it is activated, it becomes much less scary and much less intense. It starts to lose its hold on you.
Instead of being swept up by the roller coaster you begin to be able to observe it. Then instead of just observing it you begin to be able to apply the brakes a little. Eventually you can pull the emergency brake and hop off the roller coaster altogether as soon as the ride begins.

[piggy momma]

Originally Posted by Amyjay

And yet, despite this defualt position happening over and over and over again, you haven't. So maybe this default position is actually protective. It could almost be seen as a self-soothing technique, similar to cutting or drug abuse or bulimia. After all, once there's a definite plan to end the pain once and for all it does become a little easier to cope moment to moment, doesn't it? The feelings become less intense, then over days they return to baseline, then life can continue on again.

Until the next time (which is every bit as intense as the last).

When you can hold on to the cycle or pattern once it is activated, it becomes much less scary and much less intense. It starts to lose its hold on you.
Instead of being swept up by the roller coaster you begin to be able to observe it. Then instead of just observing it you begin to be able to apply the brakes a little. Eventually you can pull the emergency brake and hop off the roller coaster altogether as soon as the ride begins.

This is so spot on, and so incredibly helpful. Thank you for giving me another way of looking at it.

[Waterloo12345]

Thanks Amjay for your posts. It really resonates with me.

[ScarletPimpernel]

This is one of the reasons I'm always open and honest with my T: to break the cycle. My cycle is me wanting to test her to get reassurance. I've since learned to identify that need and catch myself before acting out. I'll tell my T that I want to test her to see if she cares, and that what I really need is reassurance. She is more than happy to provide it. Now I'm starting to learn how to challenge my thoughts that cause me to doubt her and my relationship so that I can reassure myself. It's hard!

This is also why I appreciate my T being somewhat "blank slate". She doesn't usually get her emotions mixed in with mine.

I wouldn't know what to do in your situation with the way your T is. Seems like you're the one having to "walk on eggshells". It's not supposed to be that way in therapy. Sure there's a level of respect required, but otherwise, you should be able to say anything. And if you're suicidal thoughts, actions, and/or threats are simply cries for help and/or a protective action (mine are), then your T "should" be the one you can be open with. Even if you're serious, you T should be there for you! My T and Pdoc always check with me if my thoughts are active or passive. I deal with passive thoughts daily, so I definitely don't need or want a T that's going to overreact.

I'm guessing you're attached to this T? If you're not, I'd suggest finding another T, one who you can be open with. If you are attached, well, I still think honesty is best. Just be aware of the consequences.

[blackocean]

After your post saying that he told you to stop talking about suicide, I wouldnt unless you are actually suicidal right now, because it could get you terminated if not hospitalized. If it really is that detailed and long with a plan. He may not believe you if you say it has passed.

I would be uncomfortable even asking this question as to whether or not it's safe to tell my therapist something-anything-- especially something intense or distressful.

If I found myself in that position, I'd find a new therapist.

[Anne2.0]

Originally Posted by piggy momma

I told him I was actually afraid of him on Friday because of his anger at me.

Did you just discover a pattern, perhaps THE pattern? People's anger makes you afraid, when you're afraid your mood plummets and you think about suicide.

For many of us, fear trips up down some particularly pathway before we recognize it's happening. It felt to me like there was a neurological circuit, a groove, where when I was afraid the synaptic sparks would just fly, like I was on automatic pilot.

So maybe the question for therapy is about the thing that prompted the suicide note, not the note itself. Assuming I've got it right, the questions I'd be curious about exploring in therapy are: 1) why other people's anger makes me afraid? [if you grew up in a house with an explosive person or were physically abused or witnessed abuse, this is probably an obvious one]; and 2) how can I identify I'm afraid before that physiological/neurological/automatic thing starts happening that plummets my mood down? [the earlier you can identify it's happening, probably in your body, like heart beats faster, breathing quickens, etc, the better chance you have to stop it before it trips over and over]; and 3) once I can get a tiny wedge of distance between my fear and my present-based mind, what can I do to relieve my fear instead of thinking dark thoughts?

I think the suicidality is like the band aid you use for the deeper and more complicated problem. And it makes sense to think about escaping from the pain when you feel awful and low. It's a coping mechanism, I think, that has somewhat paradoxically served you, because it's protected you from your own fear. It's deeply rational and it's familiar. But if you can interrupt the fear spiral before it takes over your body and your brain, you can be free of it.

[junkDNA]

it could be misconstrued as manipulative as a lot of behavior is termed that for those of us who suffer BPD

[piggy momma]

@Anne2.0 - conflict terrifies me and I shut down immediately.

Even now, at the age of 44, I can’t handle any kind of arguing. My mom and her husband live with me. They argue a lot. Every time I come into the basement and I’m scared. I bury myself under my covers and just wait for it to be over. Growing up my parents never argued in front of us kids (to their credit) but I was abused and my parents never showed love to each other or us kids.

I can’t even begin to describe the feelings that come over me when two people start to argue. This might be some good fodder for therapy.

[ArtleyWilkins]

Do you consider what is going on with your therapist "arguing"? Is that actually what is going on? Or is that your internal interpretation? If that is actually what is going on, that really isn't therapy; perhaps a different therapist is in order. If that is your interpretation, then that is what you need to discuss in therapy. Not what he is doing that you don't like, but rather, why do you tend to set up situations of argument with your therapist? You don't like arguing, but you repeatedly set up points of argument with your therapist, often a criticism of him, almost like you are trying to get a rise out of him. Even your suicide note was, in your own words, meant to hurt him. You were setting up conflict for some reason. What do you get out of that? Might be worth thinking about. We almost always do things because we are getting something out of it (may not be something positive, but it somehow satisfies some internal desire or need, again not always a positive need). Just an observation.

[Rive.]

Originally Posted by piggy momma

It's really bothering me. I don't know what to do. Any suggestions?

I don't think anyone is in a position to say whether you should tell him or not.

A couple of questions to consider: what do you hope to achieve by telling him about this letter? Will you be able to cope with his response, even if it means termination?

[SlumberKitty]

I don't think I would. If you are suicidal, you need to go to the hospital. But telling him about a note that you wrote when you were in a suicidal state may not be helpful. You said that when you wrote it that it was to hurt him. So telling him about the note may be hurtful to him as well. Just a thought. Hope you are feeling better. HUGS Kit

[velcro003]

I would tell my T if I had written a note, but your relationship seems different, so in your case, I don't know.