[velcro003]

Hi everyone! I haven't posted in a long time, minus the "Dear T" thread. I still read and catch up on everyone though

This past session, we got on the topic of our relationship. Besides talking about sex, this would be my least favorite and most anxiety-producing topic to talk about. I don't think we've ever talked so specifically and open about the relationship between T and me.

She told me that the type of therapy she practices, is all about the relationship, and I went 'Ewww, gross." (so mature, I know). She asked me what was so gross about it, and I said that talking about it hits too close to the heart. She agreed and said that it is touching on my "original wound," of attachment trauma.

We moved on a bit, but at the end of the session I knew I wanted to tell her that I care about her and our relationship together. It was SO hard to do. I told her that thinking about this topic makes me want to cry my eyes out (and I don't cry and never have in the nearly 6 years we've been together). She said it was a good thing. I am human and humans need to feel cared for.

I struggle with that, because if I could have my way I wouldn't have any emotions around this topic, and would never have to feel vulnerable again. She said if that was true, I would have stopped therapy a long time ago. There is a reason I keep coming back.

That is when I managed to tell her that I cared about her. Eek! Her response was "I hope so! What is the point of all of this if we don't care about eachother?"

Hmmm. I still don't actually believe my T would care about me. Why would she? Yes, she has gone above and beyond (in my opinion) here and there to help me, but that is her role as a T.

ANYWAY--Have you told your T that you care about them? How did it go? How did your T respond, and did you believe them?

[LostOnTheTrail]

Hi Velcro,

I am glad your T responded well. I showed R how I feel about our relationship through poetry, and then tripped over myself when it came to asking permission to put the piece out into the world.

She assured me that she would be 'honoured' to be associated with it. That was a couple of years ago, and whilst we had a Zoom session last week, I had the privilege of holding the book that contains my work up to the screen so that she could see it.

At one point I thought I saw her wiping her eyes. I think caring is part of the role, but if it doesn't come from a genuine place, then it couldn't exist. I have also been surprised by the depth of caring I felt from R at times, but I have to see it as genuine.

Why would they choose that job if they didn't care?

[Lostislost]

This is also one of the most awkward topics for me to discuss with T as well. Glad it went ok for you, I can feel the anxiety around it now just thinking about my experience of it.

I know therapists probably wouldn’t do their job unless they cared about their clients. But at the same time I have really grown to dislike the word ‘care’, it has all sorts of weird associations for me, most of which are unpleasant. Once I felt really close to T, and then he pulled away from me in a massive way. I thought, maybe he doesn’t know how close I feel to him? I told him I loved him. I got the ‘I care about you’ response. I didn’t mean I loved him in a romantic way but I guess that’s what people always seem to think with that word. Or because of the types of abuse we had, maybe he thinks everything is sex related with me. I have never seen him cry so I don’t know if that’s a measure of how much he cares or not.

The times I have felt closest to him are strange I suppose. Usually when we communicate outside of sessions, as then I don’t feel like I am just a client. Sometimes when he has given me a small thing, that makes me feel close. Once when he ended an email with ‘Love’, although I don’t know if that was an accident, I hope not. But if I was to bring it up in a session like hey I love you, I know he would just come back with ‘I care deeply about you and all my clients’ (even though pre pandemic he said he hugged other clients but not me....!) so that’s a awkward one to swallow and usually makes me feel empty. Got super emotional writing this out. Thanks for sharing your experience of it.

[Lonelyinmyheart]

I've seen several T's over the years and I've never been under any doubt that each of them cared in their own way, on a very human level. Out of the four main T's, I told three that I cared about them, and each of the T's responded with the utmost respect and empathy. Two of the three T's, which includes current T, work on the premise that the relationship/attachment IS the work together and is what heals at the end of the day, so talking about the relationship is a big thing to them. It is scary for me especially with current T because our relationship has a lot more meaning and depth than with any other T but at the same time talking about it is healing, both because of what I receive from T and because it brings up what I didn't get as a child and allows me to grieve. There's nothing that feels out of bounds to talk about, even when my feelings are confused and/or deeply needy. She always accepts them. T goes above and beyond for me in various ways that I prefer to keep private, but it leaves me in no doubt that she cares deeply and that I'm truly blessed to have found someone like her.

[Kidfle]

Interesting! Never had this conversation with my T. Recently my T had a family emergency in another State. The hospital provided him with a private office with WIFi so he could 'work'. Asked how his brother-in-law was doing. He gave me some general info. My T has a serious heart problem, well controlled. But during our session, he laid his head back. Very unusual. Just blurted out: Are you OK? Do you want to end early? He said no. His sleep schedule was just upset as a family member was staying with patient 24/7.

Afterwards felt weird that I did that. It was none of my business. Kept reminding myself that I am paying him to be my therapist. He's not my friend. He talks with me 3 hours a week. Specific times and length of time. He has 'professional' caring. Can call otherwise in an emergency but not just cuz I want to talk something over.

How do you all draw the professional line from caring for each other?

[LonesomeTonight]

So the first time I told my current T that I cared about him, I want to say it was within the first year of seeing him. And he responded with, "You can't care about me! You don't even know me!" And that was...very difficult. It felt invalidating. I said how I care about a lot of people that maybe I only know in a certain way, like, say, neighbors.

Maybe a year later I mentioned caring about him and brought up what he'd said before. That time, he said he understood it, because he felt like I did know him pretty well by then. And I think he said something like it was OK and that it made sense that I cared about him. That certainly felt better than the time before. (Now, my asking if he cared about me...that's its own long story, which I can share in a separate post if you want. It led to a bit of a rupture at one point actually. But I didn't think that was what you were asking about here).

With my former marriage counselor, when I knew his wife was sick, at one point, I told him I cared about him. Maybe in the sense that I was concerned about whether he was doing OK? (This was like 4 or 5 years ago.) And he said that if I cared about him, that meant he was doing something wrong, because the care is only supposed to go one way in a therapy relationship (from client to therapist). Which also made me feel invalidated... I said something about how I was just a caring person in general. And he seemed to kind of accept that? Though we ended up having a brief phone conversation that night because I still felt bad about it.

So...I don't have the best history in this area. I forget if I ever told ex-T.

[RoxanneToto]

I think it has to go both ways, though, you’re two people in a kind of relationship? I’m trying to organise my thoughts here, but something I watched on YouTube about PTSD recovery kind of comes to mind - to heal, it helps to “give” love/care rather than just receive it. Genuine caring relationships are a two way street. In any case, if you’re a caring/empathetic person, it’s not surprising you’d end up wanting to give something back to your T at some point.

[stopdog]

I did not tell a therapist I cared about them because I didn't care about them any more than any other random stranger. I did not find them caring either. I did not feel cared for or about with either of the women. I don't even understand how it would with one of those people- I did not know them and they did not know me. I do with real people in my life but not those people.

[KLL85]

I haven’t told him I care about him and probably never will even though I do, as I’m pretty sure I would be met with silence or a response like LonesomeTonight got ‘you can’t care about me as you don’t know me.’ My T reveals very little about himself, I only know he is married and has kids because I looked him up on social media. I’ve no idea about any of his likes or dislikes. He is very much a blank canvas which I’ve told him I struggle with. But last week he did tell me he was in pain due to a bad back, so he may need to stand up and walk around for a little while. I know this will make me want to ask him when I see him next how his back is, but he would view this as overstepping boundaries, but to me it’s just a way to show I care.
I also wouldn’t tell him I care about him because I worry he would automatically assume there was more to it and think there was some romantic connotation to it which is definitely not the case at all. My transference is all paternal based but I get the impression he sometimes thinks I have romantic transference towards him.

[velcro003]

Originally Posted by Lonelyinmyheart

I've seen several T's over the years and I've never been under any doubt that each of them cared in their own way, on a very human level. Out of the four main T's, I told three that I cared about them, and each of the T's responded with the utmost respect and empathy. Two of the three T's, which includes current T, work on the premise that the relationship/attachment IS the work together and is what heals at the end of the day, so talking about the relationship is a big thing to them. It is scary for me especially with current T because our relationship has a lot more meaning and depth than with any other T but at the same time talking about it is healing, both because of what I receive from T and because it brings up what I didn't get as a child and allows me to grieve. There's nothing that feels out of bounds to talk about, even when my feelings are confused and/or deeply needy. She always accepts them. T goes above and beyond for me in various ways that I prefer to keep private, but it leaves me in no doubt that she cares deeply and that I'm truly blessed to have found someone like her.

I am glad. you have such a good response from your T! What I bolded is what my T believes/practices as well. She said that if our relationship is secure, it is a jumping off point to other relationships in my life, that I can have that outside of therapy too. I don't know how much I actually believe that, though.

Originally Posted by Kidfle

Interesting! Never had this conversation with my T. Recently my T had a family emergency in another State. The hospital provided him with a private office with WIFi so he could 'work'. Asked how his brother-in-law was doing. He gave me some general info. My T has a serious heart problem, well controlled. But during our session, he laid his head back. Very unusual. Just blurted out: Are you OK? Do you want to end early? He said no. His sleep schedule was just upset as a family member was staying with patient 24/7.

Afterwards felt weird that I did that. It was none of my business. Kept reminding myself that I am paying him to be my therapist. He's not my friend. He talks with me 3 hours a week. Specific times and length of time. He has 'professional' caring. Can call otherwise in an emergency but not just cuz I want to talk something over.

How do you all draw the professional line from caring for each other?

I think the professional line are boundaries. The therapy relationship should be well-boundaried. I am lucky that my T is open and I know she is married, has kids and some of her mental health history. She had to miss the past session because her daughter broke her arm, and we talked about it at the beginning of this session. She "let" me convey sympathy for her daughter and family, but then she quickly moved on to how I was doing.

Originally Posted by LonesomeTonight

So the first time I told my current T that I cared about him, I want to say it was within the first year of seeing him. And he responded with, "You can't care about me! You don't even know me!" And that was...very difficult. It felt invalidating. I said how I care about a lot of people that maybe I only know in a certain way, like, say, neighbors.

Maybe a year later I mentioned caring about him and brought up what he'd said before. That time, he said he understood it, because he felt like I did know him pretty well by then. And I think he said something like it was OK and that it made sense that I cared about him. That certainly felt better than the time before. (Now, my asking if he cared about me...that's its own long story, which I can share in a separate post if you want. It led to a bit of a rupture at one point actually. But I didn't think that was what you were asking about here).

With my former marriage counselor, when I knew his wife was sick, at one point, I told him I cared about him. Maybe in the sense that I was concerned about whether he was doing OK? (This was like 4 or 5 years ago.) And he said that if I cared about him, that meant he was doing something wrong, because the care is only supposed to go one way in a therapy relationship (from client to therapist). Which also made me feel invalidated... I said something about how I was just a caring person in general. And he seemed to kind of accept that? Though we ended up having a brief phone conversation that night because I still felt bad about it.

So...I don't have the best history in this area. I forget if I ever told ex-T.

I have such admiration that you were able to tell T you cared about him in the first year! I am pretty sure it took a couple of years for me to just not feel like running out the door half the time, much less care about my T. I don't like his answer though that you can't care about someone because you don't know them.

Originally Posted by stopdog

I did not tell a therapist I cared about them because I didn't care about them any more than any other random stranger. I did not find them caring either. I did not feel cared for or about with either of the women. I don't even understand how it would with one of those people- I did not know them and they did not know me. I do with real people in my life but not those people.

I get that, though my T knows the most about me, friends next, and family last. So in a way she knows me best.

Originally Posted by KLL85

I haven’t told him I care about him and probably never will even though I do, as I’m pretty sure I would be met with silence or a response like LonesomeTonight got ‘you can’t care about me as you don’t know me.’ My T reveals very little about himself, I only know he is married and has kids because I looked him up on social media. I’ve no idea about any of his likes or dislikes. He is very much a blank canvas which I’ve told him I struggle with. But last week he did tell me he was in pain due to a bad back, so he may need to stand up and walk around for a little while. I know this will make me want to ask him when I see him next how his back is, but he would view this as overstepping boundaries, but to me it’s just a way to show I care.
I also wouldn’t tell him I care about him because I worry he would automatically assume there was more to it and think there was some romantic connotation to it which is definitely not the case at all. My transference is all paternal based but I get the impression he sometimes thinks I have romantic transference towards him.

My first T was definitely more blank slate than my current T. I spent 5.5 YEARS tortured in that relationship; convinced she hated me and wanted me to quit. She spent every session waiting for me to talk, and I just couldn't start sessions that way. I was too nervous. I think that is hard that you fear he would assume there is more to it than it really is.

[velcro003]

Originally Posted by RoxanneToto

I think it has to go both ways, though, you’re two people in a kind of relationship? I’m trying to organise my thoughts here, but something I watched on YouTube about PTSD recovery kind of comes to mind - to heal, it helps to “give” love/care rather than just receive it. Genuine caring relationships are a two way street. In any case, if you’re a caring/empathetic person, it’s not surprising you’d end up wanting to give something back to your T at some point.

Yeah, this is what my T has said--that we are in a relationship together and the only way for it to work is if care goes both ways. It is hard for me to hear that, because I am very avoidant and afraid of vulnerability in all its forms.

[Rive.]

I don't believe it is in a T's job description to go above and beyond. Only a few chose to do so, exemplifying the care they have for their clients. I think more than words 'I care about you', such actions lend weight to the 'truth' of those words. It's easy to say things... it's harder to follow through.

[Elio]

As you might remember, caring and loving feelings around and about my T is a major part of my therapy. My T has said and done things that let me know she cares. I would even say that she loves me - given the many different types of love that is out there. She has told me she cares about me, she has never said that she loved me - but she has said yes or something to the affirmative when I said that she loves me.

I know my therapy with her would not have gotten to where it is without this type of relationship - where the caring is genuine.

My T knew before I told her and before I wrote that I love her. Interestingly, she is just as .. good? with me saying I am mad with her or at her. I think this is because talking to the person in the relationship about any feelings I have about them or the relationship is extremely difficult. In any case, I would say that my T would agree that a lot of it (therapy) is about the relationship.

[SlumberKitty]

The only T I have told that I care about them, indeed that I love them, is former T. She handled it well. She said I know when I told her that I love her. She did tell it to me back on our last session together. I didn't think she would but she did. I knew she cared about me because she went above and beyond in so many ways. She showed me that she cares. I've never told any of my other T's that. And indeed, I guess I care about them because of course they are humans, but I don't care about them more than I care about other people. Just former T. I love her to the moon and back.