[Waterbear]

My Ex T and I had a brief exchange of texts a couple of weeks ago and she said that she was meeting with her supervisor later in the month to talk about how to end her work with her clients. When I spoke to my temp T about that we both found it strange that she was planning on doing this without asking her clients what they felt an ending looked like for them, and suggested maybe I give some thought to that and maybe email my Ex T with my thoughts.

I have been finding doing this insanely hard though. I know what I think an ending looks like for me, but it is conveying this to my Ex T that is difficult. I am so incredibly angry and I can't seem to write anything that isn't either a) ridiculously long or b) an outpouring of my anger, resentment and struggle.

I feel like I need to work through this anger with my Ex T before we can start to cement the work that we did and facilitate the positive separation that we have both agreed we ought to try and achieve. I can't imagine she has any idea how I am feeling right now and so I am scared that she is going to think that a nice ending session is possible, whereas I can't even imagine sitting down in the same room as her with all these thoughts and feelings going on inside of me.

Every time I try and visualise us sitting in her room, I just can't. In my head I either can't even get up the path in the first instance or I just stand there, staring at the wall, unable to sit or interact, until I decide I can't do it and walk out into the garden trying to find a rock to crawl under.

The post is titled "advice needed please", but I am not entirely sure what I am looking for. Help maybe? How do I even start to explain to my T what I feel like I need? How do I let myself be heard here and help myself to get my needs met in an honest yet respectable way?

(I think this will take 3 or 4 sessions minimum. Work through the anger and the resentment. Try and unravel the confusion. Let her know how I feel and what I think and hope that she can accept and apologise for her part in all of this. For me to own my part in all of this too, and understand where these thoughts and feelings are coming from. Try to cement the work that we have done. Talk about any possible future correspondence between us. Say goodbye.)

Maybe I just send her that?!?! Thanks in advance!

[Yaowen]

Dear Waterbear,

I am very sorry you are in that situation. I can't even imagine what you are going through. What is the reason why your ex- therapist is ending her work with her clients?

Sincerely yours, Yao Wen

[Waterbear]

Thank you for your kind words Yao Wen. I think half the problem I that I just don't know why she is stopping work. She had a bereavement, she told, me, but then said that she had been planning on winding down her private practice before that. We had planned to have five months to come to an end but then all of a sudden she just said she couldn't provide a service any more. She mentiomed something about an illness in the family, but I just don't know what happened and how we went from her having one week off for a bereavement, to six weeks off, to five months to finish to all of a sudden in the middle of a session saying she couldn't do I anymore. I'm very confused and disappointed in how this has been managed by her and her supervisor. Basically I've just been left in the dark it seems!

[wheeler]

Having been I. A somewhat similar situation I was not able to get to a place of ‘non anger’ with my T. Our therapy ended and I had to work it through with my new T. That took longer than I expected but I finally came to a better place.
Can you work on this with temp T?

[Waterbear]

Thank you Wheeler. I am sorry that you went through a similar situation and that you weren't able to get to a place of non anger with your T. It's so hard and I think it takes time to work through, time I guess may not be available if Ts are ending with clients. I am working on this with Temp T, but it just feels like something that I want to work through with Ex T because it is that relationship that has broken down, and in order to be able to cement the work that we did, I feel I need to repair the relationship first, if that makes sense. Even if I worked on this with Temp T I would still have so many questions and things left hanging, which I do really want to try and tidy up if I can. I just need to figure out a way of doing that!

[Rive.]

An ethical therapist would provide closure sessions, more than one... and after discussion with their client.

These sessions are also meant to be a safe, i.e. supported and validated, space for clients to express whatever feelings they are grappling with.

I don't know if you had these. I find it ironic (unless I misunderstood) that your T is meeting with her supervisor, yet it seems she terminated with you already. But you are still left with unresolved feelings. A closure session might not necessarily bring 'closure', esp. if a client does not want (or is not ready) to end with a T but at least, it ought to provide some sort of movement towards resolution.

Here it feels like there is still huge unresolved business between the two of you. That is not right.

[Lonelyinmyheart]

I'm not saying this is the right approach at all, but if it were me, I'd be tempted to take the ball into my own court and write a closure letter to T if a certain amount of time had passed and I couldn't bank on her providing any sort of adequate closure session(s). I'd want to take back some control in a situation where I felt I had none. I'd write a letter detailing what I felt I'd achieved with her and how I'd hold onto that, but also go into my anger and sadness that the relationship ended in the way it did. I'd be real and honest because that's the only way I think I could start to even think about letting go of how things had turned out and process it with someone else.

Obviously I'm not in your situation and don't know your T or relationship so the only person who can decide is you and there are no easy options in such a horrible situation which your T could and should be managing a lot differently. You can only take care of yourself and do what feels most manageable to you. I know you probably won't want to say anything hurtful to T and I wouldn't either, but writing it in a non critical way but making clear the impact on you might be a way to begin to find closure. I don't know. As Rive said, there's so much unresolved between you and it's so unethical to leave you like this.

[Waterbear]

Rive, thank you. No, we had no such thing as of yet. She just said in the middle of a session that she couldn't do it anymore. No nothing else. That day was goodbye as far as I knew it. I begged her to reconsider, to take a break and continue when she could. She said she was taking an extended break but still offered me no session, no referrals, no plan. I agree, not ethical at all. But in her mind maybe this is no different to all the extended breaks we have taken because of Covid. It's completely different though and I'm angry about it all. I've been asking for my things back (bookz paintings, writings) and all I get told is it's on her to do list. The last time I messaged she replied saying she has indeed decided to end her work and that she was meeting with her supervisor to see what that might look like for her clients and that she would be in touch in due course. My temp T and I agree that it seems bizarre that she hasn't even bothered to ask me what I think an ending looks like. Right now she has little to no idea of what is going on for me and how difficult but imperative an ending is.

I'm struggling with how to manage those enormous feelings and thoughts as I try to let her know what an ending might look like for me, so she can at least have that in mind when she meets with her supervisor (who I am possibly more annoyed with as she should have been the one to make T see that this is just wrong on so many levels).

Other thing I am struggling with is that none of this seems like my T at all. I just can't put this alongside how I know her to be, and how she has shown herself to be for the last five years.

[Rive.]

Of course it is different.. She just left you dangling, without rhyme or reason. You are right - her saying she couldn't do it anymore(?!) is way different than taking a break owing to covid. In the latter instance, she did not abandon you. It is not only bizarre but she is not abiding by the 'duty of care' that are part of the professional and ethical standards of the profession.

It seems something happened to your T (personal life? burnout?) and she lost her ground and professionalism, as her clients are paying the price.

I am sorry she was so unethical with you and is causing you so much pain.

As for what to do, unfortunately you cannot make her stay and/or reconsider. Maybe, check in with yourself re:
(a) would you be able to trust her and continue working with her IF she were to reconsider?

(b) would you like to take it further i.e. complain to her supervisor (usually clients are able to ask for details of the supervisor and approach said supervisor!)

(c) would it be possible (if you wished) to have a session with ex-T, temp T and you?

(d) how would you feel writing a letter to that ex-T with honesty? It doesn't have to be 'flaming' but it seems, again, that your voice-feelings-needs are dismissed. At least you may have a platform to voice them. Maybe have your temp. T read them? Maybe just write it for yourself? Then sit with it and see if you want to send? It might not change anything but (to me) what she is doing is plain wrong. Your voice ought to be heard. But that is my gripe. Please do what feels more suitable/comfortable for you.

I also agree that the supervisor ought to tell your T to do her job ethically. Maybe the supervisor does not know the 'whole' (objective) truth if your T was not forthcoming with the supervisor?

[Waterbear]

Thanks Lonelyinmyheart. I think that is what I am leaning towards, and why my email about closing sessions is turning into an essay. There is just so much that needs to me said and I am scared that I am not going to get the opportunity to say it, let alone have her acknowledge, understand and apologise for her part in it. Right now, for some bizarre reason, I am still trusting/hoping that she will do the right thing, but with each passing day and week I am losing that faith and it is further damaging the solid ground that my life now is built on. You are right about taking back control in a situation where you feel you have none. That is exactly how I feel.

I just need to figure out whether to 'give up on her' now, and take that action or whether I can write something shorter and briefer to lead in to hopefully sharing all of this with her in person.

I simply can't get my head around the fact that this is happening. After all she has done for me, all that she has been for me, all that we have achieved together, to literally dump me from a great height just has been one of the most confusing things I have ever experienced.

[LonesomeTonight]

Would it be possible for your Temp T to talk to your Ex T? You may need to grant written permission (not sure how it works in UK, but you'd need to in US). Or even for your Temp T to email Ex T? To let her know how much this is affecting you and to find out if there's a possibility of a meeting, whether just you and Ex T, or the 3 of you? (At one point, after a rupture with my then-marriage counselor, I had discussed with my T the possibility of the 3 of us meeting, and they were both open to it, but we ended up deciding not to. So T's can be open to this.)

Just wondering if she might at least be willing to give some sort of answer to your Temp T, even if not open to meeting.


And I'm sorry you're dealing with all this... Your ex T is acting very unethically. If she's unable to continue practicing, for whatever reason, she needs to formally tell you that, give you referrals, etc. And should give you at least one termination session, if she's at all able to. She definitely should not be leaving you hanging like this. She should also return your stuff, even if it's leaving it in a box on her porch (I think you were seeing her at her home, right?) for you to pick up.

[Lonelyinmyheart]

I know you probably won't want to do this and I completely understand why, but if she's registered with bacp you would be within your rights to report her for failing in her duty of care. As someone else said, her speaking to her supervisor doesn't necessarily mean she's being forthcoming with information.

It's really bad that she hasn't returned your stuff either. As Lonesome said, all she has to do is put it on her doorstep for you to collect. Not doing that is just another example of how unethical she's being. Something has obviously happened in her life but but she's a trained professional and should be at least taking steps to ensure her clients have adequate support. I'm just so sorry you're dealing with this.

[Waterbear]

Thank you Lonesome. Interestingly enough, 3 of the 6 therapists that I 'interviewed' mentioned them talking to my ex T in order to start with a certain baseline, so I know that it is a thing here in the UK too... I just don't feel like my T would be up for that, but I could be wrong.

That's a really good point about Temp T emailing Ex T. I hadn't considered that and actually, I wrote a draft email this afternoon to my Ex T pretending to be Temp T, just to see what I would say if I was looking on from outside, removing myself and my hurt/anger/resentment from the email as far as possible. It was a very useful exercise and I may use some of that in my email to her (obviously I wouldn't pretend to be someone I am not though!)

I will certainly talk this through with Temp T on Tuesday, as Ex T may say more to her than to me, but honestly, who knows. Definitely an idea to consider though, so thank you very much indeed.

I do think Ex T is planning on trying to end with me properly, and I wonder whether my whole "please just take a break, reconsider and then see how you feel in a couple of months" may have indicated that I was ok with things being left hanging, but surely as the professional she should have known how hard this would have been for me, even if I didn't know that for myself. I am trying to give her a break, because I know she is human, but like you say she still has a job to do and at the very least I do think she should have 'passed the baton' so to speak. Just to tell me to find someone else isn't good enough in my opinion. My Temp T actually said a lot of Ts have 'therapy wills', with someone appointed to communicate and support clients in the event of something happening to them, even if only to support them finding someone else to work with. I asked my T on at least two occasions what would happen if the worst would happen to her and I never got an answer - I can only assume she never had a plan and that is poor in my opinion.

And YES! Exactly, how hard is it to just give me my things back. The fact that she can't even find a spare 10 minutes to collect the three things I asked for (I said everything else could wait, but I wanted these back now) and arrange for me to pick them up just goes to show how little I must mean to her.

[Waterbear]

Thanks Lonely, you are right, I don't want to report her. I am still giving her a chance to put things right here. Her supervisor on the other hand..... If I knew who it was I would be very tempted to email her in the first instance and offer her the chance to apologise and explain how she would do things differently in the future before potentially reporting her. But like you say, maybe T hasn't shared the full story with her. Gosh, I just never imagined I would be in this position. Not once I started to really trust her and 'get to know her' - though I am now questioning everything I ever did know. Was it all just a massive cover up? I honestly feel like I have been tricked into turning around (trusting) and then stabbed in the back. I think I am still in shock, and the confusion is overwhelming right now. Thank you.

[amandalouise]

Originally Posted by Waterbear

My Ex T and I had a brief exchange of texts a couple of weeks ago and she said that she was meeting with her supervisor later in the month to talk about how to end her work with her clients. When I spoke to my temp T about that we both found it strange that she was planning on doing this without asking her clients what they felt an ending looked like for them, and suggested maybe I give some thought to that and maybe email my Ex T with my thoughts.

I have been finding doing this insanely hard though. I know what I think an ending looks like for me, but it is conveying this to my Ex T that is difficult. I am so incredibly angry and I can't seem to write anything that isn't either a) ridiculously long or b) an outpouring of my anger, resentment and struggle.

I feel like I need to work through this anger with my Ex T before we can start to cement the work that we did and facilitate the positive separation that we have both agreed we ought to try and achieve. I can't imagine she has any idea how I am feeling right now and so I am scared that she is going to think that a nice ending session is possible, whereas I can't even imagine sitting down in the same room as her with all these thoughts and feelings going on inside of me.

Every time I try and visualise us sitting in her room, I just can't. In my head I either can't even get up the path in the first instance or I just stand there, staring at the wall, unable to sit or interact, until I decide I can't do it and walk out into the garden trying to find a rock to crawl under.

The post is titled "advice needed please", but I am not entirely sure what I am looking for. Help maybe? How do I even start to explain to my T what I feel like I need? How do I let myself be heard here and help myself to get my needs met in an honest yet respectable way?

(I think this will take 3 or 4 sessions minimum. Work through the anger and the resentment. Try and unravel the confusion. Let her know how I feel and what I think and hope that she can accept and apologise for her part in all of this. For me to own my part in all of this too, and understand where these thoughts and feelings are coming from. Try to cement the work that we have done. Talk about any possible future correspondence between us. Say goodbye.)

Maybe I just send her that?!?! Thanks in advance!

first want to say Im sorry that you didnt get notice that your ex-T didnt give you much notice...

second you call her your "Ex - T" so she did not even have to tell you she is going to or planning to or thinking about quitting. you are not on her case load so legally and ethically she can quit or plan to or think about it with out telling you.

third many professionals dont have much of a choice here in the USA. many states now require treatment providers of all kinds to either be vaccinated or no longer work in their profession. that means many treatment providers are thinking about whether or not they want to continue working as therapists or not. if they want to continue working they ..........must ..... get the vaccinations against covid.

for many this is a hard choice to make. do they get the shots going against their personal views about the vaccinations or do they go against their personal views of wanting to work in mental health by not getting the vaccinations and no longer work.

4 most treatment providers do not consult their clients when thinking about quitting working as a therapist or not. thats a personal choice. most weigh their options, which is best for them and their families and then ...........after ........ making the decision to retire from the business, they most times inform their clients and work with their clients to transfer them to other treatment provider options.

Ive had many therapists quit / retire/ go on leave, and had therapists that have died unexpectedly.

in all cases not one consulted me or any of their other clients until .........after.......... they have made their decision.

my own point of view on this is that once a therapist is an "ex" their decision does not affect me. the decision is a private one between the ex therapist and the ex therapists family. then .......After.......... the decision is made then the situation is between the therapist and her job on what is required and how to work with the ex therapists present clients.

maybe you can talk with your present therapist about what treatment provider boundries are on things like whether a therapist must consult their clients before they make their decision or after. that way should your present therapist have to make this decision someday you and the present therapist will know how you and they will be handling retirements/ firing and quitting by treatment providers.

[ArtleyWilkins]

It sounds like something pretty serious has come up for her in her life and she's having to focus on that - major changes. Hopefully she will get back to you once she's made some decisions on how best to provide some closure. Having just had my life completely turned upside down unexpectedly, I can understand how this can happen to people - even therapists. Unfortunately, the rest of the world can often be put on hold while you are figuring out how to get through a major crisis.

I agree with the idea of your current therapist perhaps getting in touch with here, if for no other reason than to figure out how to have anything that belonged to you returned. I would guess that might be the better way to handle this right now.

[Waterbear]

Artley - thank you for offering a different perspective. Now if she could only be honest and straight and tell me as such, this confusion wouldn't be there. At the beginning she said she needed one week off, then very rapidly we went through a process of changing goalposts and then before I knew it we were finishing all together. And if this is the case, the BACP framework does say that a nominated individual should make contact with clients to explain the situation and make support them in making alternative care arrangements. I'm not mad that life happened for her, not at all, I'm disappointed in how it was handled and this being left in the dark has let these feeling grow. Does that make sense?

[LonesomeTonight]

Originally Posted by Waterbear

Artley - thank you for offering a different perspective. Now if she could only be honest and straight and tell me as such, this confusion wouldn't be there. At the beginning she said she needed one week off, then very rapidly we went through a process of changing goalposts and then before I knew it we were finishing all together. And if this is the case, the BACP framework does say that a nominated individual should make contact with clients to explain the situation and make support them in making alternative care arrangements. I'm not mad that life happened for her, not at all, I'm disappointed in how it was handled and this being left in the dark has let these feeling grow. Does that make sense?

I can definitely understand this. I feel that at the very least, she should be giving you some sort of updates. Like, "I don't think I'd be able to meet for another month at the very least," something like that. Or "I'm not sure I'll be able to come back at all, so it might be better to look for someone permanent." Even if she didn't fully explain what was going on with her.


Do you know if she's married? I'm wondering if it's possible her husband either passed away or is very ill. Or else possibly a sibling or, even worse, a son or daughter?


Just thinking of when my former marriage counselor's wife had been sick for a long time (leading him to cancel frequently) and then passed away, though he hadn't planned to tell us any of it (I figured some of it out). I feel it would have been easier for me had I just known what was going on, rather than him randomly canceling without much explanation (and sometimes taking a long time to reschedule). Because at times it made me wonder if it was about me (due to my attachment to him and telling him about my transference).

I can see why your T might want to keep some things private, but I feel like at this point, she owes you at the very least some sense of a timeline, whether she plans to meet with you again at some point, etc. Or at least some sort of closure (and to give you your stuff back!)

[Waterbear]

I agree Lonesome, it is the silence and the lack of knowing which has caused the most incredible confusion and resentment, bitterness, anger and hurt. I understand wanting to keep things private, but I do feel she could have made life much more bearable for me by just opening up a sliver. All of that said, I do have to own my part in this, as it was me who told her just to take a break and then see how she felt in a couple of months. I said that put of desperation though, as a way to get her not to make a decision at the time. She is married, with five children, but at this point have no idea what has happened in her life.

I managed to find the right words today and I emailed her, and will wait to see what she replies with after she has had her supervision. It was the right level of real, honest yet respectful words in my opinion. I know she is human, and humans mess up, and I do think I can move to a point of empathy and forgiveness if we can somehow make the time and the space to work this through. I hope that she can offer me that.

In a way, I wonder whether this has all happened for a reason. I was very wronged in the past and have always struggled to feel anything about that, and have never been able to see a path towards healing, but maybe this is just another step on a ridiculously crazy journey.

I did text her to tell her I had emailed (as I always have done) and she replied to say that she was sorry that she had let me down, that she would read my email tomorrow when she has more time.

[SlumberKitty]

Waterbear, I am glad you found the words to email her. I hope she can work with you to a successful resolution. HUGS Kit