[KeithJ.]

My wife and I (ages 33 and 35, respectively) will be married 10 years, this Friday. Together 17 years total (high-school sweeties). After both of us began working out a year ago, I lost 30lbs./her about 25. Her sex-drive began going through the roof, as she was finally feeling comfortable with her body. (though she has always been a knock-out and thought of as gorgeous by everyone). A couple of months ago she confessed an attraction to her personal trainer. I of course wouldn't stand for it, and squashed the situation before she cheated. She claimed her sex-drive had become very intense and that she needed for me to do more in the bedroom--raw and passionate as opposed to loving and romantic. (Keep in mind, we were both virgins when we met and have been exclusive ever since--further, she never enjoyed being objectified throughout the years we've been together, until now.)

I've been doing my best to please her, but things really came to a head today when I could tell she hadn't been acting herself for a few days. She came out and said she no longer feels sexually attracted to me--that she feels a shyness and insecurity that doesn't help turn her on. I don't want to lose my wife and have told her I will do whatever it takes, counseling, etc...

Any advice/suggestion is welcome...she's my best friend and soul-mate, I don't want to lose her.

[Webgoji]

I have a very similar problem myself; I'm not passionate enough and too loving and caring. My wife is stunning and men are always hitting on her while I'm simply unattractive (to be perfectly honest, not self depreciating). She hasn't said she's not attracted to me anymore, but it's a similar situation.

Something I noticed and you might want to be careful of. By saying you're not forceful or passionate enough, she can be emasculating you to a certain extent. (I'm not privy to the actual conversation, but those conversations can often turn very emasculating.)

I would offer that you should both consider marriage counseling and also talk with each other about trying to spice things up. My wife and I have made more trips to Priscilla's here in town (an adult store with toys and stuff), send each other pictures of ourselves at inappropriate times () and flirt more during the day.

I myself have decided to be a little more ... I guess I would call it selfish ... in bed. I don't pay as much attention to her during certain times and basically get more aggressive about getting my needs met. That creates a more forceful, more immediate sense during our lovemaking; more passion.

So yeah, maybe those are a few things you could try? Best wishes.

Originally Posted by Webgoji

I have a very similar problem myself; I'm not passionate enough and too loving and caring. My wife is stunning and men are always hitting on her while I'm simply unattractive (to be perfectly honest, not self depreciating). She hasn't said she's not attracted to me anymore, but it's a similar situation.

Something I noticed and you might want to be careful of. By saying you're not forceful or passionate enough, she can be emasculating you to a certain extent. (I'm not privy to the actual conversation, but those conversations can often turn very emasculating.)

I would offer that you should both consider marriage counseling and also talk with each other about trying to spice things up. My wife and I have made more trips to Priscilla's here in town (an adult store with toys and stuff), send each other pictures of ourselves at inappropriate times () and flirt more during the day.

I myself have decided to be a little more ... I guess I would call it selfish ... in bed. I don't pay as much attention to her during certain times and basically get more aggressive about getting my needs met. That creates a more forceful, more immediate sense during our lovemaking; more passion.

So yeah, maybe those are a few things you could try? Best wishes.

Great answer Web!! I can only add (from experiance) that women don't always want to be 'made love to' as many romance novels and 'lifetime' movies would suggest. In fact, we like the animalistic too...There has been a bit of contrary information, we women have had to deal with. A fine line thing. Even if passionate *sex* is what we want, and to be *taken* is what we're feeling right at that moment, at what point is it abuse? And are we contributing to our abuse or the consideration by our partner that we want to be abused, because we want a more passionate session in bed???

There is a video which has gotten a lot of heat because on the one hand it shows a woman clearly fighting with a man in a very very passionate way...love hate sort of thing. Pink's 'try'. But the video is fascinating, because there is that very fine line being stretched to nearly the breaking point but still managing to intrigue. As women, we've been trained to think what we're watching is 'wrong' or 'derogatory' or 'inflammatory' or just plain hurtful to women. And if you don't bother about the layers of both the song and the video, you'd see only that. But there *are* layers...one of them, in the video, she gives as good as she gets. Taking the entire thing, song and video and really watching, it is about a sort of co-dependency, but the sexual aspect is definitive.

I would never want my partner to be *that* forceful...but the intent to passion, I definitely would want. In fact, that video is a turn on...and talking to other women (co-workers) they all agree...it is. As long as it's controlled. It's when you start to look down from the tightrope you're walking, that you might find yourself in trouble. Sorry for the long post lol

[Arwen_78]

Well, I think sex is meant to be fun. I sometimes just start trying to see how from my bf is ready to go just watching TV. It's about it just happening for me. I like the just kissing if we run into one another walking around our apartment. Then if we are both ready to jump into bed together we do.

I think maybe trying out different things is a good idea as it's fun. I don't know what is sexy about the idea of posing for a camera but it was something I thought about doing for an ex. He wanted it but I didn't like the idea of it. There is alot you can do just ask her what she thinks would be fun. Maybe get a book of sex positions or sex games... do whatever sound like fun try it once and if not fun forget it.

[hamster-bamster]

Originally Posted by KeithJ.

She claimed her sex-drive had become very intense and that she needed for me to do more in the bedroom--raw and passionate as opposed to loving and romantic. (Keep in mind, we were both virgins when we met and have been exclusive ever since--further, she never enjoyed being objectified throughout the years we've been together, until now.)

Frankly speaking, I have not been able to understand what the word "objectify" means, much as I have tried to understand what it means, but I know for sure that wanting raw and passionate love-making has nothing to do with being objectified, whatever it is that this puzzling word means.

Be a little more "selfish" as Webgoji has suggested. You think she is gorgeous? A knock-out? Can you express those thoughts via, speaking in simple terms, ****ing her? Not trying to please her, but just ****ing her - ****ing is a very direct way to express desire, love, longing, and a whole host of other wonderful emotions. Direct and straightforward, without embellishments. A great way to go. It could be that she is tired of being your soulmate and just wants to be your woman, for a change. Plus, this society places such a huge premium on being thin that even gorgeously zaftig women may not feel at ease in their bodies unless they lose weight. So the transformation that occurred with your wife might - as you yourself pointed out - have happened in response to the weight loss / muscle toning.

In your OP, you draw a line between "raw and passionate as opposed to loving and romantic". The line does not exist in objective reality - it exists in your mind. In my mind, loving/raw/passionate are together, and "romantic" has a different meaning for different people, so without more details I have no idea what you personally mean when you say "romantic". But how one can say that passionate and loving are OPPOSITES is beyond me. And, it can also be so for your wife - she also might not comprehend how passionate and loving are OPPOSITES. Just saying! It is not at all self-evident.

Lastly, if you do not mind a bit of an "edge" in sex, you can ask her what she wanted to do with the personal trainer she was attracted to.

Oh, and since being attracted to a personal trainer is not particularly, um, sapiosexual (sorry for stereotyping ), her sharing the fact that she was attracted to him might have been her attempt to call for more physicality in sex. Just a thought!

I hope things get better.

Everything she said!

[hamster-bamster]

Kathy, sorry I am being dense - you are referring to something that seems very interesting (with those many layers that you described), but I missed what the title is.

Help?

[KeithJ.]

Some interesting points above.

Not to sound defensive, but I'm not confusing or separating raw/passionate with loving/romantic. Our sex up until now, has been very good (her words). It's just that the demand for quantity (I mean at least three times a day) has been a shock to my system, after 10 years of being a couple that would do it a couple of times a week. That pressure has caused me to not perform up to standards for the first time in my life...which has now made me very self-conscious to the point that I'm not enjoying sex--I'm just trying to keep up. It's like I'm not making love to my wife, I'm having sex to placate her and save our marriage. I'm even having a doctor friend bring some Viagra samples to me for the weekend, as we leave tomorrow for a short anniversary trip.

(She's told me how transfixed she's become about sex recently--to the point where she's losing focus at work; she doesn't seem as motivated in other creative projects, etc...) I'm all for going at it hot and heavy in the bedroom, but this seems like borderline compulsion, no?

As to the objectify question: My wife has always been the "knock-out" that had the kindest, biggest heart in the world and was simply adored by everyone because she was down to earth at the same time. She has point blank said, that it's all about her for once in her life. (I understand how everyone needs to take time to be selfish once and a while and indulge themselves--but a complete 180 in personality...is this common?) She has made it known to me, that after all these years of not wanting to be gushed-over; constantly told how good looking she is; and being fondled in public--that this is what she now wants.

It's like the woman I fell in love with 17 years ago, and have been married to for 10 years is now a completely different person....and I'm just expected to shut up and go along for the ride. I've agreed to see a therapist, to discuss my inhibitions/lack of living up to her libido, in the bedroom. She went to one therapy session about a month ago, after I found out about the personal trainer. She didn't like being told she was seeking the father-figure she never had (the trainer is 54). She was looking for someone to validate her disloyal behavior, and didn't get it, so no more therapy for her apparently. I tried to make her understand that the trainer was doing exactly what she paid him to do--build her confidence, shower her with 'atta-boy's' and generally motivate her to lift the weights.

(For the record, I'm a strong personality myself...by no means a push-over. We're both entertainers that can command an audience with our stage-presence--strong willed and bull-headed. Which has made for some deeply passionate arguments about this.)

We went to the Bruno Mars concert last Thursday, and it was like old times. We were clicking on all levels, the conversation, the mood everything. I just hope this weekend works out the same...

[hamster-bamster]

1) to the best of my understanding, Viagra is not the drug for your situation, but Cialis is. Let me explain: my ex husband had things done in an attempt to relieve chronic back pain (spinal cord shots and other such things that were drastic - not a little massage here and there but drastic interventions). I do not remember well, but there was some risk of his developing an ED from that. He did not develop an ED and was fine, but his GP prescribed Cialis just in case, explaining that Viagra and Levitra (sp?) are drugs to pick up girls at bars with more confidence - if you are hitting on a girl at a bar and want a little boost, you take Viagra or Levitra and are ready in a short time.

Cialis (per the guy who was my ex H's long term GP, and who, according to me then H, sounded like somebody what had tried all of those meds in practice rather than by reading medical journals) is the drug for a married guy to take with his Saturday morning newspaper as he thinks about uplifting things to do sometime over the course of the weekend. Cialis is long-acting. So it would fit the bill for your short trip.

2) such a drastic increase in the drive and the expectations of frequency, combined with the loss of focus in professional settings not experienced before might mean that she is entering bipolar mania. MIGHT! Does not mean that she is - she MIGHT, as one of many possible causes.

3) the therapist she saw that one time really owes her an apology and her money back. To suggest that a woman is attracted to an older guy because she has never had a father figure on the first session of therapy is completely unacceptable and unprofessional. Whoever said does not deserve their credentials. There are a myriad reasons for being attracted to a person, one them and and important one at that being "for no reason at all". To jump to simplistic conclusions the way the T did was bad form. You, my dear friend, are also not being at your wisest here. No, you are not - since in the OP you welcome ANY advice/suggestions, be prepared to hear this one.

You wrote that "She didn't like being told". By constructing the sentence the way you did, you are viewing her as a child and not an adult, and are viewing the T as an authority figure who tells your wife what to do. This is wrong both ways - she is not a child, for one, and the T is a hired consultant and not an authority figure. It is quite possible that the T indeed "told her" that she was in need of a father figure - in other words, the T was arrogant enough to tell her, without any shade of doubt, what she was feeling and why. That she did not like it is well justified. Also, look - you are accusing her of disloyal behavior, but she did not behave in disloyal ways - she was attracted but did not act on it. So you are at fault for wrong accusations. Who usually makes careless wrong accusations without thinking of consequences??

Authoritarian parents - that is who.

So basically the T treats her as if she were a child by telling her why she feels what she feels, you are treating her as if she were a child by making false accusations, and...

...at the same time the T thinks that she is seeking a father figure. Which, apparently, is not a particularly good thing. Apparently, she should not be seeking a father figure - she should be an adult. OK, good, but if she is an adult, treat her the way you treat adults (and, ideally, children as well). Either or:

A) either she is a little girl who needs to be "told" things but then do not blame her for seeking father figures,

B) or she is an adult but then give her enough respect by not blaming her for not wanting to be treated by morons who happen to have a license to practice counseling and jump to conclusions on the first session.

Either or - you cannot have it both ways. These two positions are mutually exclusive.

4) being told that she is good looking many times a day is very weird. I wonder though if this just reflects the culture around her - the culture that places so much importance on being thin. But of course weird and tiring/exhausting for you. Can you simply tell her: "Look, two hours ago you looked gorgeous and I said so. Don't you think you also look gorgeous now? Why do I need to re-confirm/re-affirm it so often? Do you really think that your looks change so much as hours go by?.."