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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 07:26 PM
  #1
I have a friend who is somewhat like me. We each live alone. We each are home a lot by ourselves, due to COVID. I'm fairly content being home by myself. I'm not particularly lonely. I've always enjoyed my own company, and I don't have much trouble keeping myself amused. I'm seldom bored. My friend has been calling me a lot - like almost every day. I get the feeling that she's bored and lonely. She calls up and doesn't have much to talk about. I feel like she calls wanting me to entertain her in some fashion. I'm getting weary of these calls. I don't want to be mean, but I'm thinking of just not always answering the phone when she calls. Can anyone relate?

I have two questions. First: Isn't it kind of needy for her to be calling me a lot when she hasn't much to talk about? Last night, she called me at 10:15 p.m. I don't go to bed till about 12, but I still think that's kind of an impolite time to call. Plus, the call was about nothing. Something on a local TV news program caught her attention, and she wanted to know if I'ld seen it. It wasn't anything of great importance. (Somebody vandalized a store in our neighborhood.) I really didn't care, but I acted mildly interested just to be nice. She wanted to discuss it, asking me why someone would do a thing like that. I don't know. I don't much care. I made some small talk. Then I told her I was tired and was ready to go to bed. I just said that to get off the phone.

My 2nd question is how to be less available for these boring phone calls, without seeming mean and unfriendly.

I have a similar issue with my neighbor. She keeps telling me to stop by for coffee. She also seems lonely and bored. When I stop by her apartment, she basically whines about stuff. I listen patiently, but there's a limit to how much I can tolerate hearing her complaints that just go round in repetitive circles.

I guess COVID is leading to people who live alone feeling isolated, bored and lonely. They don't have some of their usual outlets to engage in. I'm in the same boat, but I manage to pass the time in ways I find meaningful - cooking, reading, watching TV, tending to my bird feeders, caring for my plants, cleaning and organizing. I'm kind of flattered to be getting the calls and invitations to stop over. But I'm tired of catering to needy people. And I'm starting to resent feeling used. I wonder if I'm being too antisocial.
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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 08:19 PM
  #2
I think if you don’t want calls at night you will need to let this friend know that you are only available to talk on certain days at certain times because you have other things you need to get done.

I don’t think you are being antisocial as much as you don’t want to become someone else’s caregiver. It’s actually great that you are once again learning you do enjoy your own company and are free to do things for yourself again.
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 12:17 AM
  #3
Thanks, O.E. I'm kind of surprised. I thought I would hate being alone. For 3 months, after my bf died, I did feel horribly alone. Then the grief eased. I learned that the awful pain of fresh grief is temporary. Now I'm able to enjoy my memories. I always did have a lot of interests. For years, caregiving pushed everything else aside.

I'm grateful for people who want to keep in touch with me. But they do tend to put me back in the role of caregiving. I guess it's true that "you teach people how to treat you." Not that I want to be alone all the time. I just want to avoid people looking to me to fill up some emptiness in their lives. I see now why they are so bored. They haven't cultivated interests. They never got into longterm relationships, as I did. When I was in fresh grief, they didn't encourage me to talk about it. They were just glad that now I was available to them. They didn't show much empathy for my sorrow, but now they prey on my sympathy.
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 12:56 AM
  #4
i think this covid has a lot of people more .. "clingy" ..."needy" .. not sure what term to use .. just they find someone willing to communicate with them and suddenly they cant stop reaching out to you ..
its awfully thoughtful of you to have :"taken her on" .. but yes .. let her know after ? pm to please not call you .. .
i know its a pain to stop what youre up to to chat about nothing with her but .. just try to not cut her off per say but let her chat, you pitch in some goofy ditty and kinda .. say hey it was great chatting ... thanks for checking in.. we will keep in touch.. il give you a call later this week or so .. and kinda treat it like YOU had called her and now YOU are done with why you had called her and end the call...
or .. answer and say something along lines that you do not have time right now to talk .. vauge is fine no reason to lie or blab your beeswax to her why you cant talk right now .. few quick yes no ok well hey gotta go but we will talk another time when im not busy ..
or .. you call her ... just say hi ... quick ditti something shes into .. then well just wanted to say hi while i had a minute ..
i know its a royal pain to deal with this sort of ordeal but if you have it in you to just try to hang in there ... i kinda believe she just NEEDS to have contact with a live person now and then... yep .. tag .. youre it but by being there she might not need to constantly keep reassuring herself that she has someone to call if she needs to....
she doesnt talk about anything because she isnt calling to talk about anything.. she calls for comfort of human contact ..
i dont know if this what is really happening in your situation but .. if you give her a yell now and then .. even during ur break at work or just a quick hey thougt of you thought id call ... try and have some silly tidbit specific to her to tell her during a call.. or a joke or did you see or i read ..no need to bring up any topic which would turn into some long drawn on discussion about it .. just some short blub to add interest to her day .. a: that you had thought of HER to know it would interest her & b: .. give her more variety to liven up her day..
plus you do not have to answer each time she calls you either ... thats fine too ..
but if at all possible just you casually and gently take charge of the lenght of time you want to spend on the phone with her. tell her tid bits about what you have been doing, what you are doing, ... share some of your life with her and perhaps she might decide to find some ways she can occupy her time too... maybe
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 07:58 AM
  #5
Hey @Rose76: I'm wondering if you friend assumes you are still emotionally devasted by your loss to the point where they think you are lonely? Do you think that is the case? Or do you think the motivation from your friend is purely "selfish"(I dont mean that in a mean way) and she just wants to ease her feelings of loneliness? Do you feel that she attempts to lean on you a lot? What I mean is, is she someone you would say is a best friend? The kind of best friend that you feel held you up when you were first going through the early days of your bf's death? Or is she just a friend? Another thing that popped into my head was if she's just a basic friend and expects a ton from you then I dont know how fair that is to you considering what you have been through. But these are just speculations.

I think it would be good practice to do a few things. When she calls, maybe answer and say "hey can I call you back later on in the week, I am in the middle of______ (or something) right now and cant talk". I think this may help sort of...."train" her to know that sometimes when you answer you cant talk. Another thing would be to let some calls go to voicemail and skip a day before returning them unless its a dire situation. This may also help "train" her to know that you aren't jumping to call her back asap. Maybe sometimes answer, talk for 5 minutes and then "oh! I have to call you back, so-and- so is calling me on the other line" or "someone is at the door". I think little things like this could help her respect your boundaries better without you having to have some sort of conversation that could end up in hurt feelings. And if you choose to be direct and tell her when its too late to call or that you need space that wouldnt make you a mean person. It makes you a person trying to take care of herself, set boundaries, and learn to live post-grief. Just my thoughts.
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 12:35 PM
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I'm kind of surprised. I thought I would hate being alone. For 3 months, after my bf died, I did feel horribly alone. Then the grief eased. I learned that the awful pain of fresh grief is temporary. Now I'm able to enjoy my memories. I always did have a lot of interests. For years, caregiving pushed everything else aside.
Given all you went through with your partner, it was very understandable that you were overcome emotionally and hense you were often emotionally exhausted. It's actually normal to feel horribly alone as grief is such a personal experience and is often lonely because of that. When another person literally fills your life, it doesn't matter if you knew that the loss was immenent because that genuinely doesn't prepare you for what that loss is going to mean in terms of how much you lived your life around that person. You spent literally years of living a certain lifestyle and if that stops it's actually more of a shock then we realize. And unless another person has experienced this challenge, they won't understand it and give it the value it deserves.

In all honesty, I had a similar experience where I had lost both my parents and my MIL and my dog close together and there were a couple individuals that inserted themselves and their problems into my life and it was more of a "oh poor you, now me, me, me". It was the same thing where my boundaries were invaded and I did not deserve that. It's not a bad thing that you are noticing how this individual is starting to invade your space like this. It's actually showing a stage in your healing that means you are making progress in reclaiming your life and sense of self again. I respect the fact that you are being bothered but you don't want to be mean to this person but want to set better boundaries for yourself. That is actually something that impressed me about you in that you have the fortitude to think before you react.

At least this friend looked for something to talk about when she called you to talk about the news. What is a bother is how she began to take over when it came to thinking it was ok to call you at her whim and it's become more frequent and is beginning to bother you. Sometimes though, it's an annoyance like this can do us a favor because it shows us how much we are gaining ourselves back again. What I appreciate about this problem is how you shared about the things you are beginning to enjoy again. You have not talked about any of this for a long time. It's exciting and heart warming for me to see the progress you are making ((Rose)). What you shared are no longer things you have to do, but instead things you want to do and are beginning to appreciate again. Welcome home to Rose again!!

Perhaps one way to tackle this is to explain to this friend that you would like to set certain times for your conversations with her to help yourself regain a sense of control of your life again because for a long time you set your own needs aside to tend to your partners needs and now you need to take back more control over your life. I think given you know her better than me, you can do this tastefully.
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 12:53 PM
  #7
Thanks, que sera. I like your approacsuggestions and think I'll take that approach. COVID does seem to be a factor in making people not know what to do with themselves. I've always been kind of a loner, so COVID hasn't changed my life quite as much as it has other's. My friend got laid off, which abruptly severed her from her usual contact with people. She always told me she loved her job. Her relatives don't call her much, whereas I hear from my sisters several times each week. (Both our families live at a distance from us.) I'm beginning to think that a lot of people rely on work to structure their lives. I'm happy to be retired. I love being home. She seems not to.

I should appreciate efforts she did make to be nice. During the summer, she would call and offer to bring me some lunch from a take-out place. That's when my kitchen was a mess from repair work my landlady did. It was nice of her. I don't want to be hurtful. She never used to be "clingy" in the past, but that does sort of describe her now. Yet I think she would get reassurance from short exchanges on the phone. I always am the one to wind up the conversation, but she accepts when I say I have to move on to other things. You're quite right that her checking in with me seems to be a security thing for her. A brief chat about nothing or anything seems to basically satisfy her. I think I'll make it a policy to just not answer her calls after, say, 9:30 p.m. Sometimes I think she just tests limits. I've known her to do so with others. I can set boundaries without having to announce what they are. She'll catch on, as she is very perceptive.
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 01:43 PM
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i agree with the other wise, wonderful posters. Perhaps simply being honest and telling them that you don't feel like talking, or at least asking them to call you or go out for coffee when you feel to may be the best option. Hopefully they will understand! Sending many Safe, warm hugs to BOTH you, @Rose76, your Family, your Friends and ALL of your Loved Ones! Keep fighting and keep rocking NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS, OK?!
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 01:56 PM
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I just wrote another post, but it vanished.

Thanks, O.E., for your encouraging words. I have to disagree with one thing. My grief, when it was severe, was not due to me missing a role I played that filled up my life. I was very in love with my bf, and I missed him. I wanted him back because he had loved me.
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Rose76 View Post
I just wrote another post, but it vanished.

Thanks, O.E., for your encouraging words. I have to disagree with one thing. My grief, when it was severe, was not due to me missing a role I played that filled up my life. I was very in love with my bf, and I missed him. I wanted him back because he had loved me.
YES ((Rose)) and that is most definitely the most personal and most challenging loss to learn how to accept. You have made some progress in that respect which is something that you did not think you ever could. That is a very personal journey and very deeply challenging.
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 02:20 PM
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Ok if someone calls me at 10:15pm it’s better be calling from the hospital where they were taken by the ambulance and they need my help. It’s not appropriate time to call in absence of emergency.

I am pressed for time at the moment so I’d think more on this issue later. I am glad that you are doing well and despite still understandably grieving loss of your partner and your love, you are doing so much better. Hugs
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 04:07 PM
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Thanks, divine. I've known this friend for many years. I know her to be someone who will test limits to see what response she will get. She is smart, educated and I believe she knows perfectly well that it is not polite to phone people at 10:15 p.m. to say, "Hey, did you see what I saw in the news today?" I've seen her impose on others to the extent she could get away with. It's like she tests people to see how big a fool a person is. That may beg the question as to why do I even want her for a friend. Well . . . I figure I have my faults too. At times, in the past, I have found her interesting to converse with. She can be decent company. I've enjoyed meeting her for lunch. We've done some fun things together. COVID has taken away so many options for ways we could spend time together that would be interesting. We've gone to movies and plays and concerts together. I look forward to doing stuff like that with her again. Thanks to the current restrictions, we are limited to just conversing. Also, thanks to COVID, we have little going on in our lives to provide subject matter.

I ask her about her experiences over the course of her life, which she loves telling me about. It's like I'm a talk show host and she is my celebrity guest. She really is a tad narcissistic.

I seem to be a magnet for people who tend to be self-absorbed. About 12 years ago, I got burned out on people calling me to talk about themselves and their lives. These same people had little interest in hearing about me. I got tired of doing all the listening. So I started cutting down on my availability. These emotional leeches drifted away, and I sure didn't miss them.

I thought, after my bf died, that I'ld be so glad of company on any terms. That was true for a while. I got hospitalized for serious depression. While, in the psych hospital. I found that my intense grief was relieved whenever I was making small talk with anyone about anythjng. Usually, I was open to what anyone wanted to talk about, which usually was about themselves. Even staff were sitting down with me telling me all about their workplace grievances. I guess I can be a good listener. Now I don't need that constant distraction.

I guess I have to eventually seek out people who are more reciprocal.
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 04:39 PM
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Honestly as I got older I am very selective who I associate with and how often. There is only that much time and energy. I can only listen to people so much especially if they aren’t interested in bettering themselves or want to rehash same things or do small talk. I’ll listen but I have a life to live.

My tolerance for listening to whining in my spare time is getting quite low too. Having said that, if she is a good company and in general a decent person, I’d keep it going but just lessen the amount of contact. It’s great to be nice but no need to be “too nice”.

Don’t answer after 10pm. Just don’t. Let it go to voice mail or she can send a brief text if it is an emergency. Or suggest to talk on a different day. Keep it going but not daily!. Daily quick texts exchange is fine. But not frequent phone conversations.

Some people think if you are retired, you have nothing to do. Please. my best friend just retired, sure she is more available but not like all of a sudden she has all this time or she sits on her butt! People have hobbies and interests and chores! And simply people want to have some space
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Default Jan 14, 2021 at 07:54 PM
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Unfortunately Rose, a lot of people don't know how to listen. They may be fun to do things with and at times can be interesting to converse with, but when it comes to a more personal level of understanding, that's simply not their thing, or is something they don't know how to do.

I tend to be used to that because I have so many around me that have attention deficit disorder and are unable to interact with me on the level that I often desire. Typically, if I need to vent and share emotional challenges, that tends to result in many don't feel statements when what I really needed more was the comfort to allow me to feel. When I was in therapy trying to sort out significant challenges and trying to understand what ptsd was and why I was struggling so much, my therapist actually listened and we also had two sided conversations. Honestly, after a while I thought "wow so this is what it's like to be able to talk to someone who CAN talk and listen". There were times where my therapist could barely keep up with me, he would stop me and say "What you said was very traumatic, let's just sit with those emotions instead of running by them".

Then he met my husband when I brought him with me for a session and that's when he got to see WHY I developed this "rush through my emotions" that I was doing. He also noticed that when I tried to talk my husband tended to take over and interupt instead of actually allowing me to talk. The next time I had therapy and was by myself my therapist said to me "I noticed right away that your husband has severe ADHD, that must be very hard for you to live with". Often we pick a partner that may be harder to deal with not seeing it because it's familiar. Ofcouse there is a lot more understood now then 40 years ago when I got married and even long before when I was young and it was always in my environment.

We needed a box to fit a Christmas present in and there was a box from my parents that was full of pictures, yet also many cards that I made for my father. I used to make my father cards and one thing I knew was for him to enjoy one of my cards it needed to be about HIM personally. My father was a very self absorbed man and while others tended to pick on his passion, I did not do that but instead let him look at his passion that came out touching and comical. He used look forward to my cards and laugh at the same time being touched too, and then he would put them on the refrigerator so he could walk by them in the morning and laugh again. Then he would bring the cards out to show his customers and they would laugh too. My father never really knew how to do for me the way I did for him. Yet, I did get close to him in a way no one else did. My mom would complain how my father never really sat and talked to her unless it was something about one of us, their children. I tried to tell her that the only way to get him talking is to ask him about HIM. My father was educated and very intelligent, but tended to be very self absorbed. The only way to get noticed is to climb in his boat, he doesn't feel comfortable climbing into yours.

I find that some of the most educated people tend to stand in judgement of more than have the ability to look at you as deserving to have your own identity, especially when you need emotional support. Sadly, the typical is "oh so sorry and then the me, me, me". When overcome by emotions to the point you cannot articulate the depth of it, it can be a good distraction to sit and listen. Yet, then it's nice to have someone in your life that CAN be patient and sit and listen, maybe not perfectly, but at least hear you to some extent. Maybe it's not just you that happens to attract the wrong people as much as a lot of people don't have that kind of person in their life or know how to give that way so they tend to gravitate to you because you do have the ability to listen.

My husband doesn't listen the way I want, which is typical for someone like him, however, he makes up for that in what he can do which means things are more task oriented that he knows I like to see done or even bring me flowers or candy checking the air in my tires or some kind of task he knows I like having done. You can keep her as a friend, however, know where her short comings are and set some boundaries because it sounds like she is one that will expect you to service her at her whim.
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Default Jan 15, 2021 at 03:17 AM
  #15
Just don't answer the phone when you don't feel like talking. Just say you were busy & the phone was charging in the other room.

Sooner or later she will get conditioned to not call so often if you don't pick up every time she calls. You don't even have to tell her to call less often.....just train her through your not responding to the calls except when you really want to talk

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Default Jan 15, 2021 at 04:00 AM
  #16
This is what I plan to do - just not pick up when she calls at odd hours and when it's just been too many phone calls.
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Default Jan 15, 2021 at 09:24 AM
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Rose, if you do that and she asks you where you were that you did not answer? Just tell her that you often drift off to sleep and you turn your ringer off at night so you don't hear the phone if it rings. That way she will get it in her mind that you turn your wringer off and you are not just ignoring her. And, you could actually turn your ringer off too so you don't get bothered.

Also, you can tell her that you turn your ringer off when you want quiet or to nap or want to sit and watch a movie undisturbed. This way when she calls and you don't want to talk to her you can choose to not answer and you won't feel guilty about it. Also, it's actually therapeutic for you in that you are not on call for anyone because it can take a while to regain your own sense of space again after all the caregiving where your time was dictated by another's needs.

I don't think it's necessary to discard an aquaintance you have enjoyed spending time with as you have described. I think that where you are right now in your healing is that you are slowly rediscovering yourself again and you like to have control over that and feel you have your own space for a change and that your time is your own now to do what you please.

Believe it or not Rose, when you corrected me? That is also progress because you were able to define something about yourself that's very important, that's a gain.

Last edited by Open Eyes; Jan 15, 2021 at 12:14 PM..
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Default Jan 15, 2021 at 12:04 PM
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You could also put phone on airplane mode when you don't want to be bothered so it won't ring. I know not everyone can in case of emergencies, but that's what I do at about 10 PM. I just keep the Wifi connected and only have sound notifications for WhatsApp where close friends and my immediate family can contact me if there were something urgent.


As far as going over to a neighbor's, I haven't been to anyone's house since COVID started. I've had to talk to neighbors about a few things, and we always do that outside. My husband and I are being careful, but the country where I live has been through the wringer with the virus since last March. Not as bad as the US, but we seem to be heading into a second wave and possible new lockdown. You just never know how careful others are being.
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Default Jan 15, 2021 at 12:21 PM
  #19
No reason to ever feel guilty when you are doing self-care. You are entitled to your space & your time whether they like it or not.

I have a friend I have kinda distanced from with all the care for my animals that is needed now. She constantly needed outside validation that others weren't mad at her when we weren't the one calling her. Not my job to take care of those needs. I haven't had time to call for a few months because when I am done taking care of my fur baby family including my horse I am exhausted & really don't feel like talking on the phone. Absolutely NO guilty feeling cause I am doing what I need to to to take care of me first so I can function in my own life. We have to do what we have to do for our own well being & that has to be our priority. Just like oxygen on the plane. If we don't use it first we are no good to be there for anyone else needing us

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Default Jan 15, 2021 at 03:21 PM
  #20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Open Eyes View Post
Rose, if you do that and she asks you where you were that you did not answer? Just tell her that you often drift off to sleep and you turn your ringer off at night so you don't hear the phone if it rings. That way she will get it in her mind that you turn your wringer off and you are not just ignoring her. And, you could actually turn your ringer off too so you don't get bothered.

Also, you can tell her that you turn your ringer off when you want quiet or to nap or want to sit and watch a movie undisturbed. This way when she calls and you don't want to talk to her you can choose to not answer and you won't feel guilty about it. Also, it's actually therapeutic for you in that you are not on call for anyone because it can take a while to regain your own sense of space again after all the caregiving where your time was dictated by another's needs.

I don't think it's necessary to discard an aquaintance you have enjoyed spending time with as you have described. I think that where you are right now in your healing is that you are slowly rediscovering yourself again and you like to have control over that and feel you have your own space for a change and that your time is your own now to do what you please.

Believe it or not Rose, when you corrected me? That is also progress because you were able to define something about yourself that's very important, that's a gain.
I don't think I'm going to try to convince her that I don't just ignore any of her calls by making up some detailed rationale in hopes she'll believe it. That would be me acting out of fear of offending her. If she wants to take offence at me ignoring her phone calls at impolite hours, she can go right ahead and be just as offended as she likes. This is not some naive, childlike person who doesn't quite understand the conventions of polite society. When she calls after 10 p.m., she is being kind of pushy, which is one of her personality traits.

Katherine Hepburn said she lived by a rule that I find appealing: "Don't complain and don't explain." I think part of me claiming what's mine (my own space and time) is for me to know when I don't have to justify myself. If she asks why I didn't answer, I'll just say "I forget." I kind of want her to figure out that I will sometimes choose to not take her call. She tests people's boundaries. This is a person who can be quite nervy. She is very effective and efficient at enforcing her own boundaries, and she is not all that highly concerned about the feelings of others when she wants to curb someone else's behavior. This gal used to earn a 6 figure salary and was quite involved in politics. She's far from dumb and far from being in the dark about social norms.

I don't want my resentment to cause me to discard a relationship that I've enjoyed, at times. I just need to not let this person "play" me, which is what I believe she tries to do.
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