Degenerating relationship with my mother

Having not visited for about 4 weeks, we have spoken on the phone. The calls are usually tense.

The latest, to advise medication had arrived, was short. Was going to ask if I could visit over weekend but one comment was "just reminding you I still live here". Very welcoming!

It may be an awful thing to say but I don't want to feel forced to visit. My response was "okay". That's all I said. Am not about to relinquish control of my life again.

Phone call earlier from mother. Forty-five minutes duration, forty all about her.

In under five, she'd brought up subject of why I hadn't been in touch or visited. Of course, it's all my fault. When I walked out on her four weeks ago, I should have specified that I wouldn't be in touch again. Although she denied bringing up the main topic of our estrangement, it was obvious it would rear its head at some stage.

Reading another forum topic, I may be guilty of stonewalling. However, there's always two sides to any disagreement. As mentioned before, she cannot accept she's wrong in any way. When I explained at my age I shouldn't have to endure this hassle, she then turned the conversation round to all about her and her health. I then reminded her about what she'd said about not using her health as a reason for the unacceptable request. Then she blamed me for bringing up the subject again; reminded her that this is the cause of the problem. She said that despite how she's treated me, she's still my mother and I'm still her daughter. Yes, true, but that doesn't give her carte blanche to behave in this way. We all know the reasons for that.

Not really bothered about issues I've had (possibly lockdown related). Instead, she hardly drew breath in all of the above then proceeded to wish me well in everything I was doing now or in the future, as she didn't know if she'd ever see me again. As I've probably mentioned before, emotions have been suppressed for a number of years, as a coping mechanism. She doesn't understand that releasing them again has brought some welcome and some unwanted results.

Bottom line is damned if I do and damned if I don't!

“Bottom line is damned if I do and damned if I don't!”

^That’s right!

I also have a difficult relationship with my mother. I’ve come to the same conclusion. I now do for her what I want. Honestly, it’s working just fine. She acts like nothing happened every time once I call her again a few days after the latest friction, and I am learning to avoid the triggering conversations better. From what you describe, I think your mother does not let it go and guilts you. My advice is to not take the bait when she does.

I think at the root of it is the longing for our mothers’ love. There’s an uncomfortable emotion that lingers where we know we are not getting it no matter how much we do for them. It’s a no win with them. The love only lasts as long as your last favor done for them.

I’m learning to just let that emotion sit and accept the way it is, then let it pass. I’m literally giving myself hugs! Here’s a virtual one for you.

Thanks TishaBuv

Sorry to hear you're experiencing similar problems and thanks for your support.

Can't blame everything on lockdown, as her behaviour has gone on for years. My brother is her favourite, as I've alluded to before. Think I'm disappointed that after all the support I've given to her over the years, the list of everything I've ever done wrong is growing. Conveniently, she doesn't remember a lot of them and it's not due to age or dementia. Devious is a more appropriate description; just like her own mother.

It's felt strange not having any contact but I wanted to take a time out to see if she grasped why. Been a waste of time. You deserve the hugs, here's one from me

It’s a lesson in futility to expect other people to change who they are. What they say and how they behave will tell you who they are and they will react often negatively if someone wants them to change.

Open Eyes

Thanks. That sums it up perfectly!

What I forgot to include was because I didn't give a definitive reply to the question about when I would visit again, she decided she wouldn't see me again. Her "farewell speech" wished me well in everything I am doing or going to do.

Have now recalled the many times over the past 12-18 months that I've been accused of various things and been threatened that she was going to tell my brother. On one occasion I did call her bluff, saying fine. That wasn't the answer she expected. Of course, she dismisses all of these incidents as "not relevant".

I think the comment "damned if you do and damned if you don't" describes this very well!

It took me a while to figure out my older sister. I had to make some very hard decisions to maintain my mental health. My older sister is a very disordered person. And she is VERY addicted to DRAMA. To the point where it’s been embarrassing because of how out of control she got/gets.

Some individuals genuinely get addicted to the adrenaline that drama creates. It’s not unusual for this kind of person to also have other addictions as well. To them life is boring without that drama high and they don’t even realize they have this addiction.

So anytime my sister was around she always found some way of creating Drama. It did not even matter how unhealthy it was. Instead what mattered was this fix she got off of it.

All that began to matter to her was HER truth and she even claimed to have special powers. And she imagined things about others that were not true. Only HER reality mattered.

I can’t be around that kind of person as I find it much too draining and unpredictable. Honestly I think she was constantly living in constant drama addicted to the adrenaline it creates.

Thanks Open Eyes

You could be describing my mother. Always been a drama queen but of course, it's everyone else but her. This trait has manifested itself in many ways. Another thing that's been used against me when I've passed just a simple comment about something. A way of restoring the attention back to her. Maybe my mother is getting a fix from this behaviour too.

Many times I've had to listen to the story of my traumatic birth because yes, it was dramatic. Apparently, the police visited my grandmother but not sure of reason, as I was born in hospital. Unless my father was at work. I've never really wanted to know all gory details and that's been subject of criticism too. Other issues since then have been compartmentalised and any attempt to merge with other subjects has generated the comment about relevance. So the more drama, the better. Of course, the one used the most is crying, or pretending to.

I agree, this behaviour is too draining and unpredictable, although if experienced enough, the signs become more obvious. I know she wants me to have the same low self-esteem and because I won't succumb, she's made it a lifelong quest to belittle me. I've recently updated the document where I've written down this behaviour. Need to do again, although it makes very sad reading.

I am sorry that you are dealing with this. Unfortunately your mother is practicing unhealthy ways of getting attention. She is failing to recognize how she says things to guilt trip others for not supplying the attention she wants.

This behavior at this point given her age isn’t going to change.

Have you had other significant adult relationships, like a spouse/partner? Has your mother dominated your whole life?

After reading all I can about toxic, dysfunctional, disorders and such… all these behaviors we all describe are in all that literature. It’s textbook stuff.

Thanks TishBuv

Had one long-term relationship. We split about ten years ago. Even as a parent, he disliked how my mother behaved. Have to be careful here not to offend. He always referred to her as that person who tried twice to take over the world and failed. Think you know who I mean. What we call a nickname. Suppose he became more like a father figure (nothing sleazy) as there was same age difference as between my mother and father. There's been no-one serious since, as the saying goes "the world is full of married men". I do get on better with men than women. I like sport, have a traditionally male hobby so on that level at least there can be a meeting of minds.

Yes, she has. It's never been subtle. Wanting a certain degree of freedom aged 16, I lost friends because I wasn't allowed to do things they were allowed to do. For example, having to be home by 9.30pm, when movie didn't finish until say 1015pm. As I got older, she imagined all sorts of things going on, especially related to men. Just the same way her mother had behaved. Also once told me, when I was in 20s, that I'd let her down because I hadn't produced a grandchild. Wasn't even with someone then! Even work colleagues who never met her came to same conclusion. One wise man commented "don't give in, she'll take more and more". I was around 50 then. Another suggested I would never have complete freedom until contact was severed. He'd done it with his parents; dominating mother and passive father.

This forum has certainly aided my understanding of human behaviour. Nothing surprises/shocks me anymore. The initial hurt comes from realising someone so close to you can behave this way.

So, today's phone call followed same course as last week.

I was awaiting result of home Covid test, so called her. After talking briefly about that and what it entailed, she then turned conversation round to how hurt she felt that I was not contacting her. Usual fifteen or so minutes of diatribe about how cruel I am being and that she didn't expect her daughter to behave that way. Then proceeded to tell me how kind everyone was being. She hopes to get supermarket slot next week, so contrary to what she's said, there's no help from my brother. Then made a big show of how my aunt is going to pick her up tomorrow. Her grandson's girlfriend is a hairdresser so will do her hair. To quote "that's the act of kindness that I like". Another guilt trip!

Then she said she didn't know the cause of the problem. When I got a word in, reminded her of the emotional blackmail regarding sister-in-law's actions. Was then accused of bringing up the subject yet again. Seems to take great delight in not recognising the cause and accusing me of going over old ground. Ended with tears again and her ringing off without a goodbye. Needless to say, not visiting this afternoon.

Test was negative. May try and get doctor's appointment, if only on telephone. Perhaps I need a therapist. Like the contributors here, a neutral may offer a solution I've missed.

Well, things have quietened down.

Yesterday was family BBQ (my aunt turned 80 on Friday). My cousin hosted; it was a lovely afternoon. I took mother; no point in brother doing round trip of over 10 miles to pick her up.

When we arrived, sister-in-law, glass in hand, was bossing everyone around. As usual my brother was on grill duty. No reaction to me when we walked in. I didn't expect it. At one point sister-on-law was standing behind me, only realised when offered to help mother to her seat. She soon got bored with showing everyone how good/kind she was. Wearing sunglasses, I was able to watch the "dynamics". She spent most of remaining time talking to my cousin, watching me or topping up her glass. One thing I noticed was how quiet she was compared to usual.

Mother hasn't mentioned anything yet but did criticise my older niece's partner for not saying thank you for his birthday present. She also acknowledged that niece doesn't either. I don't think the help network is working as well as she wanted. My aunt isn't doing shopping, so assume it's my brother and sister-in-law. Mother has mentioned she's run out of things.

I know she wants to give me some petrol money for yesterday's journey, but I don't want to take it. Don't want her to think I'm changing my stance. Tuesday will be interesting, it's her birthday.

Well it didn't last long!

Mother's birthday was nice, we went to local garden centre which has a great cafe. My aunt joined us. Problem arose when aunt announced she had to leave around 4pm to get to my brother's to watch England match. I left mother's house about an hour later. Brother had already visited previous day "to leave actual day open for us". Real reason was he wanted to watch the match.

Mother has told my aunt how hurt she is that she chose to watch soccer match elsewhere rather than continue to celebrate her birthday. Phone call today was usual diatribe about my attitude. The final straw was "I'm not seeking revenge as I would have done when I was younger". What a totally unacceptable thing to say to your daughter. Had quick chat with my aunt, who doesn't understand the attitude.

We may now have to address the dementia question, although I still believe this behaviour isn't anything new.

An update.

Yesterday was my birthday. Until two days ago, I hadn't heard from my mother for around six weeks. My aunt invited us over to see her new house. When I picked up mother she wasn't ready, didn't wish me happy birthday until about ten minutes later, hadn't written my card (because "she'd been doing other things"). Dressed scruffily, complaining she'd got nothing to wear. True, because she's got rid of lots of clothes that she could still be wearing. Also, not bothering with nails, make-up etc.

Of course, it wasn't long before she started singing the praises of my brother and sister-in-law who'd "been fantastic" in cleaning her house after walk-in shower installed. I didn't bite, instead admired the work.

Had a nice pub lunch, my cousin joined us. Attempts by my mother to take over the event were deftly avoided. My aunt even advised me to try and take no notice (out of mother's earshot of course!). On the journey home, we talked about my aunt's house. Obvious from mother's attitude that she liked it but wasn't going to admit.

We didn't arrange to meet up again. She has hospital appointment on Monday. Was going to offer then thought her refusal would be a long, drawn out affair. Assume my brother is taking her.

It isn't over. She won't be able to understand why I'm not subjecting myself to her vitriol. It's called self-preservation, retaining self-esteem and not allowing myself to be manipulated.

Happy birthday poshgirl! It sounds like you really handled things well with your mum today

Nothing has changed!

Called her earlier. We talked about different things that had happened in the past week. Offered to take her clothes shopping tomorrow, but she declined as it was too short notice. Fair enough!

Then she started on the usual subject. I knew what was coming because it was again everything my brother is doing for her. She wants to know reason why I hardly contact her, calling me cruel. We've gone over this so many times but still she won't grasp the reason why I've distanced myself. As I said to my aunt earlier, this won't be consigned to history, Sad to say I was right.

I've been talked over when trying to explain that her behaviour is unacceptable. She called me a liar when I said that she wanted me to apologise for sister-in-law's actions. Still cannot give me an adequate explanation to her standard comment "you're not showing me any compassion in this instance". Then the avoidance of substantiating that statement, instead saying I should know what she means. I may have been taught many things at school/college but clairvoyancy wasn't on the curriculum!

Back to square one. My aunt's view is to try, which I have done. My mother will not face up to the reality that she has a closed mind where I am concerned and thinks that by constantly repeating herself, she will eventually grind me down

I think these unrealistic mums spend a LOT of time hoping that what worked in the past - the stick, withholding - will continue to work on us as adults. Maybe this is the tactic their mothers used on them. I think my grandmother did. But i cant fix my mothers long ago guilt this way.

Good point, unaluna. Sometimes those patterns get so entrenched, that they have a hard time taking a step back and trying another approach. I know my mother repeated the patterns she had with my grandmother with me.

I am sorry you are dealing with this poshgirl. I have to maintain a very low contact relationship with my mother because it is otherwise too stressful and anxiety-provoking, so I know how it is. Hugs!

Hoping for better night's sleep tonight. It's approaching 11pm here so will give it a go. Went to sleep crying last night, woke up in early hours still crying. Felt c**p when I got up so went for some retail therapy.

I would like to know what's been said to my brother, although he's gone off on a week's holiday (not far away, still in UK).

Thank you all for your support and hope you'll understand that what I crave now is a 6ft guy to take me (a mere 5ft) in his arms and give me the best man hug ever.

This is rough, tough or both. It's left me wondering whether this would have still happened if Covid hadn't. Perhaps it's my inquisitive mind looking for another cause to excuse her behaviour.