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Default Jun 24, 2022 at 06:59 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by RDMercer View Post
I like this. It's like self validation.

I think I will add the things I know she's done to extend herself to all of us and cope.

My fear is, just SELF affirmation will polarize my thinking.

She's vulnerable.

I was able to progress in my career along the way too. Things like that were never celebrated because, as she said, it's a reminder she's been dead weight for a long time by comparison. My career progression in part off set our lost income.

The energy for others is infuriating, but she is finally able to leave the house regularly.

I helped her find health answers along the way, but she went through a large surgery in May that finally propelled things forward.

Thank you
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Originally Posted by RDMercer View Post
I carried a lot of the responsibility for a long time.

I'm in therapy to just vent. After 2 years, I don't know if it helped. Maybe focused on the negative too much.

Our oldest is in HS. A few months ago he said, I think you think you aren't much of a man because mom gets so angry at you. But I've seen you take her anger for long stretches, maybe hours, say little back, then be fully there for her when she needed you if she got really sick an hour later. You have more emotional control and you're more of a man than anyone I know. And you spent time with us, did homework with us, made meals, whatever, since years.

LAST NIGHT, youngest kid voiced how cranky mom is with us lately, and how much time she spends with her new friends. I said, well, mom was stuck home for a long time. She needs friends. I also said, "Mom is cranky at me, not you. I haven't been very emotionally supportive lately."

Kid said, "I've been alone a lot since kindergarten, and now she's feeling better, I'm still alone." Kid also said, "Maybe mom is like this because you aren't there for her enough, butDad, you do a lot. You work. You fix the house and the cars. You take us to sports or just to get out of the house, you drove me to school everyday. You cook. Maybe mom gets to have friends, but she could help you some too. You can't do everything and still, like, be there for her all the time too. I don't think she should be cranky at you."

I've never said a word to them about this stuff.

I'm floored today. Just floored. The kid that said that is yooooung.
You are a real sport. I am not sure what I would be doing if my wife told me that she was done. I don't think I would be thinking we could make it. You be strong and it sounds like you are doing the right stuff. A better man than I.

God speed!

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Default Sep 22, 2022 at 12:54 PM
  #62
Well.... A lot has happened.

Out oldest was away for much of the summer attending training at a college campus.

Me and the youngest spent quite a bit of time together. On one weekend trip, youngest cried for hours in the car about feeling pushed aside by mom/wife, and about al the stuff they were left to navigate on their own during times I wasn't around. There was a lot of pain and anger directed at mom/wife.

Oldest came home a couple of weekends and was barely around. When he came back home at the end of the summer, he'd be gone all day. When he was around he was sick to his stomach a lot. He finally broke down and said that he couldn't be home around mom/wife. In his words, he felt "gaslit as f**k" and like he was going out of his mind with some of the memory gaps and odd interactions he was having with his mom.

Something we never talk about is that she drinks. Rarely ever drunk, but drinks wine throughout the day. 7-10 bottles a week, and keeping strange sleep hours, and not eating much.

Someone raised a flag to me that there could be symptoms of vitamin B1, B6, and/or B12 dementia with the things we were seeing; stomach issues, sleep disruption, memory gaps filled in with confabulated stories, feelings of isolation and victimization are all symptoms.

My wife has surrounded herself in a narrative that she is isolated, that I don't support her in any meaningful way, that I am insulting and hateful, etc. and that her new friends are perfect, beautiful, empowered, and she can rely on them for anything. She's said this stuff to the kids. My youngest questioned her in several one on one conversations and said, "Like what" What does Dad say? What does Dad do?" and mom didn't have an answer. Kid, on our driving trip, spilled all this stuff out to me and said it didn't match with what they'd seen and mom couldn't give an example. Not one. Kid said they didn't believe it.

Twice my wife became very angry and spun out within minutes to divorcing and separating. Once in front of the kids. That happened after blaming me for something that clearly had not occurred, after she'd had a significant memory gap in something we'd talked and made plans for.

The second time, I blatantly drew the kids into it. The kids.... verbally tore her apart. She was stunned and had to listen. She couldn't deny that they were saying EXACTLY the same things I'd seen for years now. She couldn't deny the multiple examples they gave of her prioritizing herself over them, of her choosing to isolate herself, of her getting angry for no reason, of her memory gaps, etc.

She was convinced after all that, that we needed to divorce ASAP. She was clear.... Split finances, separate lives immediately. That was three weeks ago. We're still in the same house.

She did make changes though. She immediately stopped drinking. She began taking vitamin supplements. She started sleeping through the night. She began working more hours at work (increased from 5 hours a week to 35), she began eating more and gaining weight, and she began sleeping through the night. All within a month.

She remains convinced though that I have lied, twisted, manipulated her, mistreated her, failed to support her, etc. for years. The kids have gone OFF on her for saying these things to me. She is listening to them about their experiences to a significant degree, but she remains convinced all feelings things towards me are accurate and that I'm just horrible.

I'm very, very nearly done.

This will be a huge financial hardship, but I'm ready to at least go see a lawyer. I hate this. I love her. I don't know what the heck happened.

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Default Sep 22, 2022 at 01:36 PM
  #63
It’s very possible your wife is suffering from alcohol abuse disorder. Individuals like this are often delusional and exhibit confusing behavior patterns. Yes, they are in a loop is dysfunctional behavior patterns that is unhealthy for family and children.

Their life revolves around the alcohol, be it active in the disease or in recovery.

I am sorry you and your children are dealing with this.

Last edited by Open Eyes; Sep 22, 2022 at 03:50 PM..
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Default Sep 22, 2022 at 02:04 PM
  #64
If she has been drinking more than a bottle of wine a day for an extended period of time....well that would explain a lot. Whether or not she is "drunk", that amount of alcohol will definitely and seriously affect her health and well-being, and how she interacts with others.

You might consider looking into Al-Anon. Al-Anon is for people who are dealing with someone who has an alcohol use disorder.
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Default Sep 22, 2022 at 03:26 PM
  #65
Also, look up Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome.
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Default Sep 23, 2022 at 07:21 AM
  #66
With regard to Wernicke....

I have a family member who lives about a day's drive away. She used to be a social worker, then took an office administration job in her city.

I called her to talk about my family situation, knowing she understood confidentiality, and that she was removed from the situation.

There have always been issues, and mental health issues in our home. But the last two years have just been mind blowing.

I can honestly say it was at the start of COVID things really began to change. Two things happened. 1. I was home for a month, and saw just how "off" things were, and how absolutely little she did during the day. 2.After years of counselling, I began to think, "This isn't all my fault" and I began to hold her accountable for actions. And by accountable I mean, saying things like, "I know I should have shown more interest when you talked about your day. But in the time we talked, you never asked about me and my day at all." THAT would cause a three day fight. Saying, "When you take your take-out cup in from the car, can you throw it out instead of leaving it on the counter," caused a 5 day backlash. No lie - 5 days of anger because how dare I find fault with her.

Anyway, I called this family member. She listened. Then asked for specific examples. Then asked for examples of the memory gaps. These were often filled in with stories like, "you're saying those things to confuse me and manipulate me". Then the kids began having the same experiences. Our oldest got so frustrated one day he asked her to stop the car and he walked home. His mom hasn't even acknowledged it happened since.

My cousin went through this list of symptoms, to which I said "yes" to all of them, except the shuffling gait. Finally cousin asked, "RDM, does she drink? And, does she drink regularly and not eat much."

Cousin was familiar with Wernicke's and had seen it. I was floored.

I met with a lawyer yesterday. Because I have a history of supporting her and providing for her, the expectation in divorce would be that she could continue to receive a high level of support for the next 10-20 years.

What's that saying???? "Why is divorce expensive? Because it's worth it."

Anyway. big things happening.

She is angry as h*ll these days, just under the surface. LOTS of tension, but she is being a parent for the first time in a long time. Driving kids to school, going to work, keeping a regular schedule.

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Default Sep 23, 2022 at 01:19 PM
  #67
I’m sorry, dealing with someone that is an alcoholic is hard. It’s a very selfish narcissistic disorder. The person is typically behind when it comes to maturity and especially when it comes to dealing with their emotions. They drink to numb emotions as well as to pursue dopamine to feel better. However, as they do this they slowly destroy their brain’s natural ability to produce dopamine on its own. It’s not unusual for the result being these angry out bursts. A month of not drinking after years of abusing alcohol is not very long. Also the individual has to learn how to finally mature and work through their emotions and insecurities. That is why participating in AA along with therapy is important so the person doesn’t end up drinking again. It’s not easy to learn how to live life sober.

There is a lot of gaslighting when it comes to dealing with an alcoholic. The person can gaslight long after they stop drinking. They gaslight themselves and being involved with AA can help as others can see it and call it out.

The alcoholic has to learn who they are, never mind be much of a consistent identity in a relationship.
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Default Sep 23, 2022 at 01:41 PM
  #68
I think that you would benefit from attending an al anon meeting and even seeing a therapist that understand the hurt YOU suffer being in a relationship with someone that is a long time alcohol abuser. Your children deserve to get help for this too because it most definitely has negatively affected them.

What I learned was that most marriages end up in divorce once the person gets sober and the partner is helped to understand the damage it has caused them.

Some stay together if they both abuse alcohol or drugs. They tend to live in a disfunctional loop. The loop you describe is very real and it HURTS spouse and children. It’s important you all get counseling so you don’t end up in yet another dysfunctional loop unknowingly.

These melt downs are awful and are probably imprinted in all of you physically. I believe you when you describe her anger and rage that can get triggered and last for days. Sounds like you learned to walk on eggshells. Me too and I am very sorry.

When I see the red flags in someone, I distance.
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Default Sep 23, 2022 at 03:49 PM
  #69
Well if she drinks, then it explains a lot. Her not being drunk doesn’t mean she is not an alcoholic. Plus more they drink more they need to get drunk. In fact the fact that’s if she’s not drunk after a bottle of wine might indicate that she had drinking problem. People who don’t drink would be wasted drinking a bottle. Her body got used to it. How’s she affording to buy alcohol if she doesn’t work. I’d cut her access to money immediately. There’s zero reason she should buy 7-10 bottles a week.

Alcoholics have memory gaps. And her rages likely caused by her having to increase alcohol dependency. She is getting more addicted and more tolerant to the amount of alcohol

You didn’t cause it and you can’t fix it. Very sad. I
Knew there’s more to the story with her
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Default Sep 23, 2022 at 05:32 PM
  #70
Just so you know, if she stopped drinking and is not getting help her behavior patterns won’t really change much. This is known as “dry drunk”. So that toxic loop with jobs and other relationships will all be in the same loop.

Can’t stress enough on how important it is to get education and help/support for yourself and your children. And for your children that are now young adults there is ALCOA support groups. (Adult Children of Alcoholics).
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Default Sep 23, 2022 at 05:41 PM
  #71
I'm sorry that your wife is treating you this way. I hope you will get help for yourself and your children.
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Default Sep 23, 2022 at 06:25 PM
  #72
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Just so you know, if she stopped drinking and is not getting help her behavior patterns won’t really change much. This is known as “dry drunk”. So that toxic loop with jobs and other relationships will all be in the same loop.

Can’t stress enough on how important it is to get education and help/support for yourself and your children. And for your children that are now young adults there is ALCOA support groups. (Adult Children of Alcoholics).
And if she already has brain damage from the alcohol (likely), she will not be able to participate in any kind of therapy that will help. It will be lost on her.

I would definitely look into Al-Anon for yourself and the other programs for the kids so you can try to cope with this. Your wife probably also needs a neuropsychological evaluation to see how much cognitive damage she has.
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Default Sep 23, 2022 at 06:57 PM
  #73
You can’t fix your wife. But your children need help. Living with alcoholic parent damages them for life. They need therapy and Al Anon. Now.

Stop focusing on your wife and her well being. Focus on well being of your children by getting them out of this situation ASAP. If it means you will live in one bedroom apartment, sleep on a mattress on a floor and drive a junk car then be it.

Your responsibility right now is to save your children not to worry about your grown up wife while she chugs bottles of alcohol. Now it explains why she can’t hold a job and why she is depressed. No kidding!I’d chug a bottle of wine I’d vomit my brains out and surely wouldn’t be able to work next day and I’d be depressed in bed. Heck I feel depressed just thinking about it. She is in pain? Has bad memory? Anyone would be in pain pickling their brain every day. Geez.

Save your children and yourself. There’s help for people like her. She doesn’t want to? Not your problem. Your problem is your children. Not a grown woman who treats everyone like trash.
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Default Sep 23, 2022 at 07:04 PM
  #74
Also you need to stop asking her for empathy and loving behaviors. You aren’t going to ask for milk in a produce shop. . They don’t sell it. Don’t have it. Asking alcoholics to behave in a certain way is pointless. They don’t have it. Cant give it to you UNLESS they seek help. Which she’s not interested in
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Default Sep 23, 2022 at 08:21 PM
  #75
There is also Alateen, which is peer-support for teens who are dealing with someone who has an alcohol use disorder. This would be a good potential source of help for your children.
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Default Sep 24, 2022 at 06:14 AM
  #76
I am right now separating from my husband and divorcing. We can commiserate. My husband has been abusive, and I am leaving him now for the second time.

I have followed your story all this time - it's news that she drinks so much alcohol all day every day. That explains a LOT.

I agree with divine here. Take care of the kids and yourself. Your wife is no longer your concern. Your greatest concern is your children's well being - she has caused damage to them, and if there's no intervention, it could be very damaging to them for years to come. Do what you need to do, but remove yourself and distance yourself from your soon to be ex wife.

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Default Oct 06, 2022 at 09:11 AM
  #77
Have been away from this site for a while. Very concerned at what I've been reading.

Agree with other posters, you and your children need support. The only person who can make your wife get help is herself.

The comments about alcoholics have been interesting. I have a family member who cannot hold her drink. Every time I visited their house, she had a glass in her hand. One time, when bragging about her weight loss, she said "I'm going to WW so I can drink more". She never appears drunk, just aggressive and rude. Yet she holds down a full-time job.

I cannot add anything new to the comments already made. All I can do is hope you and your children can move on positively
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