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Clover1009
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Default Oct 18, 2021 at 09:26 AM
  #1
Hi there
I am seeking feedback regarding financial issues between spouses/partners. My partner of 11 years and I live in constant disagreement over accountability with money, and he has challenged me to survey other couples as a way of supporting his views. I will try to be objective.

Disclosure: I have enjoyed financial stability my entire life, and have been taught to live within my means. I do not carry credit card balances, and by the very good fortune of inheritance, I was able to pay cash for my home. I have more than I need or even want, and financial responsibility and prudence are important to me. I was single until I was 46, when I met and fell in love with my partner. We have lived together since 2010 with his three children, two of which have been with us full-time since February 2019 (only one still at home now). Additionally, I have been in counseling for over two years to seek support and gain perspective on most of these issues.

My partner grew up in poverty and instability caused by his father's alcoholism. Still, he and his siblings overcame adversity, and each earned advanced professional degrees (his in Law). Although he works really hard, he tends to spend more than he makes, and believes that living on credit is how most people survive. He has relied on my good credit and my assets in the wake of a financially devastating divorce, but we are in constant disagreement on money management. He has a history of carrying high balances, as well as missing payments, or making late payments on credit accounts in my name, which is a huge source of conflict. Because of our chronic disagreements, he has told me that he will only talk about money with me if a 3rd party mediator is present.

Current financial arrangement:

I have $3000 a month in income, and cover all expenses/repair/maintenance, taxes, and insurance for our home. I also cover shoes/clothing for myself and our 13-year-old, almost all birthday and Christmas gifts for our kids, all expenses related to our dog (vet, food, meds, dog-sitter), and anything for out home outside of groceries. I pay for my own car insurance, as well as solo travel and recreation.

Honestly, I do not know what my partner's monthly income is because he refuses to talk about money at this point. I will say that he covers our family health insurance (including me), family cell phone plan, utilities, including internet bill, and satellite bill. Additionally, he contributes $1000 a month to our "house account" which mainly covers groceries and family dining in restaurants.

There are two sources of high conflict that have brought us to our breaking point:

1. Before we cohabitated, he asked me to take out an equity line of credit (ELoC) on my house to cover forclosure costs when his ex-wife abandoned their marital home. I thought this was a bold request so early in our relationship, but because I loved him, I agreed. He used the ELoC to pay these costs, and we also used it to renovate my home to make room for him and his children. At some point, I became frustrated with the lack of movement on the balance and decided unilaterally to pay it off. A year or two later, he decided to start his own law practice, and he relied on the ELoC to fund the renovation of office space, as well as start-up costs (with my permission). Ultimately, the practice did not work out because of conflict among the partners, and he walked away from the office space and moved to a new one... but the balance on the equity line remained and he continued to make just over minimum payments and so the balance never really moved. Two years before the balance was due, I began to remind him that the full balance would be due in 2019, and inquired how his practice would pay it off. About 6 months before the note ($66,000) was due, he advised me via email that he would not be able to pay off the ELoC, and stated that he would need me to do it. Additionally, he asked me to pay off the $30,000 American Express card debt. I agreed to pay off the ELoC because it had to be paid, but stated that he would be responsible for the American Express bill because he had accrued and mismanaged the debt. He did pay off the Amex bill over time, but the ELoC balance is still lingering in the ether and causing a wedge between us. I also advised him at that time that I could no longer function as his creditor because of the conflict it created between us. Since then, we have continued to live together, but maintain pretty separate financial lives.

2. Practice relocation: In addition to the debt on the ELoC related to the office renovation and practice expenses, when he started his new law practice, he asked if I would LOAN him $60,000 to cover the first six months of operating expenses. He stated that he would sign a promissory note, and detailed the terms of repayment, which would be $2000 a month starting in January the following year. With trepidation, I agreed. I was committed to giving him another chance and felt that with the assurance of the promissory note, and the hope that he would work to rebuild trust, that he would keep his promise. January came and went, with no mention of repayment. In mid-February, I inquired about his plans to initiate repayment, and his response was to angrily claim that there should be no expectation between couples for such repayment because there is no "my money" or "your money" - it is "our money." I was really flabbergasted and hurt because he specifically approached me for a business LOAN, and he signed a promissory note detailing the terms. We argued about this for a few months, and one day out of the blue, I received a computerized check for $1000 in the mail from his practice. Although I was grateful that he started making a payment, I was hurt that he never initiated a conversation about the plan. I thanked him anyway, and he gave me a curt response and walked away. Since that time I have received a total of $30,000 in repayment, which goes directly to the support of our household, and not back into my investment portfolio.

Current Situation: My partner's law practice has ultimately become very successful, and because our oldest has graduated college and our middle child has dropped out of college, he is enjoying a lot of expendable income. A few months ago, he told me he was planning to trade in his Ford Edge for a really "nice" car. Ultimately, he purchased an $80,000 BMW without ever initiating a conversation with me. Although I agreed that he was a grown man who worked hard and had the freedom to buy anything he wanted, I expressed my hurt and frustration that instead of sitting together to flesh out income, debt and expenses, he made a unilateral decision to buy this expensive car without consulting me at all. In this conversation, I brought up the ELoC debt that had never been addressed, and he became enraged. He accused me of only caring about money, and continued to insist that "no other couple functions like this," and that because we are a couple, he shouldn't have to repay these business expenses (ELoC plus loan totals $96,000).

Last night we had an argument that leads me to believe our relationship is beyond repair. During that argument, he challenged me to ask other couples for input regarding such situations.

His position is that all money is "our" money and so I should never expect to be repaid for these business loans. He also asserts that because he pays for my cell phone, health insurance, and groceries, that he is repaying me. From his perspective, all I care about is money.

My position is that when one partner asks another for a business loan, whether via an ELoC or from personal assets, and goes so far as to sign a promissory note, that the loan should be repaid as promised. I also continue to point out that such arrangements are actually a "win-win" for all concerned, because the loan payments are taken pre-tax out of his gross receipts, and go directly into our household instead of back into my investment portfolio. From my perspective, this is not about money, but about trust.

What do you think? If a partner spouse asks for a business loan, defines the terms, and signs a promissory note, should they be accountable?

Sorry this is so long. There is much more that can be said, and the entire situation is actually way more complicated than these two issues. My counselor has suggested that this behavior qualifies as financial infidelity, but my partner rejects her opinion because he claims that I "pay for her support." He seems to be more interested in the opinions of neutral parties, and so I am honestly open to all feedback regarding these issues.

Thank you for your time and feedback.
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Default Oct 18, 2021 at 04:18 PM
  #2
Welcome Clover,

I am truly sorry you find the need to come here.

I am a 66 year old man with three failed marriages, so take my feedback with a grain of salt. I am still legally married to my 3d wife, but we haven't lived together for 5 years, had separate bedrooms for 5 years before that. I work a full time job and four part time jobs. Though she and I can't live together (I'm terrible at relationships), she is a good person, I respect her and I fully support her, 100% financially. I'm even paying for her to go back to school for a Master degree right now.

No, I'm NOT a saint. Trust me, I have my issues.

Now, having said all that, I'm going to give you some blunt feedback from a man's point of view.

Your so called partner is a USER. He is using you and in the process emotionally and financially abusing you.

He has no intention of changing and won't, no matter what.

See what other's say, but that is my two cents worth.

You will be much better off to tell him to leave, file whatever legal paperwork you can to recoup your $ and NEVER loan another man a single dime, no matter what the circumstances.

Sorry, but I don't like to sugar coat things.

BOM
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Default Oct 18, 2021 at 05:00 PM
  #3
Quote:
What do you think? If a partner spouse asks for a business loan, defines the terms, and signs a promissory note, should they be accountable?
Yes.

Quote:
He also asserts that because he pays for my cell phone, health insurance, and groceries, that he is repaying me.
What is your perspective on this claim?

Quote:
His position is that all money is "our" money and so I should never expect to be repaid for these business loans.
If he actually believed this, as opposed to saying it only when convenient for him to say it, he would have consulted you about the $80,000 car.

Quote:
He seems to be more interested in the opinions of neutral parties
Okay.

Good partners do not take money from their significant other in the guise of a loan, and then ultimately use the money to support their own private, expensive interests and tastes.

Also, good partners don't rage at their significant other. Good partners discuss in good faith.

[I expect him to find flaws in any neutral opinion that doesn't line up with his.]
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Default Oct 18, 2021 at 05:50 PM
  #4
He is not responsible in his mind for following through on promises. He makes empty promises of repayment in order to seduce you into each of these financial arrangements and has no intentions of paying you back for them. He is highly manipulative, he is using you for his own gains and for financial reasons, and I would honestly dump him ASAP.

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Default Oct 18, 2021 at 07:20 PM
  #5
Are you not married? How can he claim hat it’s “ours” money. Legally speaking it is NOT. Dude asked for huge amount of money before you two even lived together. Wow. He has no shame. He is using you so blatantly; it’s astonishing how he wouldn’t even hide his intentions to keep using you.

We can’t control other people or understand why they do do what they do. But we should try to understand why we do what we do and control our action. I’d focus on understanding why you were willing to support an able bodied man for so many years and why are you ok with him treating you as a free wallet for years!

I’d count my loses and move on before you reach retirement and have nothing to live on as you gave everything to this guy!
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Default Oct 19, 2021 at 06:16 AM
  #6
I agree - his behavior is appalling and blatant. And yes, he definitely can be held accountable to a promissory note. After all he's done, perhaps it's time to reconsider the relationship and finally break ties.

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Default Oct 19, 2021 at 06:22 AM
  #7
No, he is not interested in "the opinion of neutral parties." He couldn't care less about any opinion from anyone. He is a compulsive spender. You are in pretty much the same situation as a person in love with, and living with, a compulsive gambler or an alcoholic. He is going to avoid paying you back what you loaned him. Plus, he'll be looking to borrow more money from you within 2 years time. Just say "No."

Insulate yourself from him financially as much as you can. No joint bank accounts. No shared credit card accounts. Understand that his behavior is compulsive. He may be incapable of changing it. You are the one who needs to change her behavior. That is all you have any control over.

If you take the approach I suggest, expect that he will be angered and resentful. Do not try to reason him out of those feelings. You'll get nowhere. Do not engage in argument with him over money matters. Don't try to defend your decisions to him. He'll reject every defence and rationale you offer. In your heart, you know that he has exploited you financially, and that what he's done is dishonorable and shameful. You, however, have started early on to enable him. Then you doubled down on the enabling. Then you tripled down. Stop it. You are addicted to "helping him." It's like you've been baking sugary cakes for a severe, insulin dependent diabetic. You do it because you're afraid he won't love you, if you don't. That may be true . . . in which case he mainly values you as a meal ticket. No one needs that kind of love.

I'm glad his legal practice has been lucrative lately. That won't last. This man is so profoundly immature and irresponsible and bereft of integrity that nothing he undertakes will succeed for long. His spending will always outstrip his earnings. He'll get bored with the BMW and decide he needs a Lamborgini. He is very much repeating the example his father set - inability to commit to living responsibly. He may lack the character to ever change.

You don't need a 3rd party to referee your discussions with him about financial matters. You need to stop having those discussions. You're hoping he'll give you permission to be fair to yourself. He never, ever will. You don't need your therapist to tell you what's fair, or to come up with clever ways of describing how he is "cheating" on you. You have cheated you by giving him ridiculous amounts of financial support. Stop doing that. It's your money - hold on to it. Or - alternatively - recognize that he wants a "sugar mama," and that you are willing to be that, in order to keep him happily hanging around you.
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Default Oct 19, 2021 at 07:34 AM
  #8
Thank you everyone for your candor and advocacy. Please know that I have protected myself financially and that I have made it clear that I will no longer function as his creditor. I am coming to terms with his mental health issues and addictive behaviors, and understand that our relationship will likely not survive. I find power in knowing that I am financially independent and in no need of support from him - I completely have the upper hand.

The honest truth is that I choose to stay because we have an amazing 13-year-old at home and I am his bonded parent and true source of stability. His birth mother has extreme mental health issues and basically abandoned him about three years ago. He rarely sees her and she is not a parenting option for him. In coming to terms with his father's mental health and addiction issues, for now, I am just living day-to-day trying to keep a stable household for our 13-year-old. I do understand that he perceives the stress, and I do my best with the tools I have gained in counseling to focus my love and energy in ways that support his continued development in a secure environment.

I realize that I will receive plenty of strong feedback here for this choice, but it is the best choice for now. I work actively with my counselor on ways to nurture my own spirit and interests. I have recently come to understand that this relationship has rewired my nervous system so that I respond to conflict by "fawning," and I am now strong enough to consciously make the necessary changes and stand up for myself.

I appreciate the opportunity to hear from others who have either traveled this road or know someone who has. Your words truly assist in fortifying my spirit and my resolve.
Thank you so much!
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Default Oct 19, 2021 at 09:02 AM
  #9
I am far from a qualified person to discuss financial matters or relationships but I'm going to share this with you because it happened recently and gave me perspective on what I want in a romantic partnership.

I confronted the person I had feelings for, and supposedly had feelings for me, with her lies and gaslighting. During this conversation where I was pointing things out, especially about not keeping her word, she said, "So, so what? Everyone breaks promises! It's not a big deal!" This was probably the most honest thing she ever told me about herself.

Um. Yeah, it kind of is a big deal if someone doesn't believe in honesty and integrity. I am a person who values honesty and integrity and I need a partner who feels the same way. How can you trust and rely on someone that isn't open, honest, or keeps their promises? Consistency is important. And to me, if someone is consistently going back on their word, making apologies but not changing behavior. To me that is manipulation.

These are just my thoughts. I don't like to tell anyone what to do because it's not my life, but what I did was consider what my values are, how important they are to me, and whether I can accept being in a relationship with someone who doesn't have them.

I've been taken advantage of financially, not by a spouse but by friends/roommates. And it's not a good, or fun, situation to be in. I chose to leave the situation even though it made me lose almost everything.

I am deeply empathic and sorry for your situation and I pray there will be a sound resolution and healing for you.
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Default Oct 19, 2021 at 03:34 PM
  #10
Unless you legally adopt this 13 year child, you are not a parent to that child. You may be emotionally "bonded" to him, but that makes you a loving adult friend . . . not a parent. Your therapist has been remiss in not pointing that out to you. But then she's been busy working with you "on ways to nurture your spirit" and developing the thesis that your nervous system has been "rewired." She knows how to keep you coming back. She's clever, and I bet she's expensive. But, then, it's only money, of which you have plenty . . . or so you think . . . enough that you are "empowered" with "completely having the upper hand." Clover, you are telling yourself a whole lot of stuff, which your counselor fails to appropriately challenge you on. But, then, she's busy furnishing you with all those "tools."

As you may be guessing, I take a dim view of a lot of what passes for "counseling." Actually, that's neither here nor there, and I apologize for going off on a tangent. Let me be much more to the point: I am not saying that you should end your relationship with this man or eject his 13 year old son from your caring support. You may need them to be there. Acknowledge your own neediness, which doesn't come from a mis-wired nervous system. It comes from the need to love and be loved and from the fear of loneliness and emptiness. For centuries, women of means have sometimes opted to financially underwrite men in exchange for companionship. That isn't necessarily wrong.

Don't confuse lack of character with "mental health issues." Your boyfriend's lack of integrity cannot be "treated" by mental health professionals. He likes living as he does. It's been working for him: he's got you, and he's got the BMW, and his son is nicely provided for. It is not wrong for you to love a man with a severe character deficit. It is very foolish to give him boatloads of money. You may think you've "made it clear" that you are not going to do that anymore. We'll see. This guy is a lawyer. He can come up with complex schemes faster than you can see through them. You might be wise to quietly hire a lawyer of your own to advise you on how to best protect your assets and income . . . and to have someone to run things by when your boyfriend comes up with his next scheme.

Here's one last caution: when your boyfriend fails to get you to open your purse on his behalf, he'll come up with a scheme whereby he needs you to subsidize something for the child's sake. He knows you love his kid. He'll use that against you. You'll use that against yourself. You'll rationalize that anything you do that may seem to be in the boy's interests will be the noble thing for you to do. That child is like a hostage held against you. BTW, having that hostage to use gives your boyfriend the upper hand.
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Default Oct 19, 2021 at 04:15 PM
  #11
Clover, no negative feedback here. I'm going to address your staying with this man because of your bond with the 13 year old. Doing quick math you've been in this child's life since he was a baby (toddler). You may not be biologically or legally his parent, but your emotional attachment is real. It might be stronger than some bio parents and children.

Reading your posts this guy is financially abusive. There are plenty of people who stay with an abuser in order to keep their kids. It's not a healthy situation, but some times we have to chose between the lesser of evils.

Before anyone jumps all over me, I realize Clover staying with this guy exposes her to future financial abuse. HOWEVER it sounds like she is taking steps to protect herself financially. I, for one, am not going to criticize someone who loves a child and wants to remain in his life.
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Default Oct 19, 2021 at 04:26 PM
  #12
Clover,
When I first replied, you hadn't mentioned the 13 yr old or the situation with this child.

LizardLady is right in this regard. I agree that you are to be commended for wanting to be there for and help this child.

You seem to know your relationship with the Child's Father is dysfunctional at best. That is a start.

My recommendation at this point would be to seek some family counseling involving all three of you. I'm guessing the child's father will resist.

Maybe you and the child an go. The child certainly needs some counseling in my opinion...even if he has to go alone.

BOM
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Default Oct 19, 2021 at 04:51 PM
  #13
Quote:
Originally Posted by lizardlady View Post
Clover, no negative feedback here. I'm going to address your staying with this man because of your bond with the 13 year old. Doing quick math you've been in this child's life since he was a baby (toddler). You may not be biologically or legally his parent, but your emotional attachment is real. It might be stronger than some bio parents and children.

Reading your posts this guy is financially abusive. There are plenty of people who stay with an abuser in order to keep their kids. It's not a healthy situation, but some times we have to chose between the lesser of evils.

Before anyone jumps all over me, I realize Clover staying with this guy exposes her to future financial abuse. HOWEVER it sounds like she is taking steps to protect herself financially. I, for one, am not going to criticize someone who loves a child and wants to remain in his life.
May I just say that I can find nothing in this post that I disagree with.

Thank you, liz, for that bit of math. You've made a very pertinent observation.

Here's something that confuses me. In your more recent post, Clover, you state that you expect your relationship with this man "will not survive." Does that mean you are prepared to suspend your relationship with his 13 year old son? Or do you envision continuing to support the boy, even after breaking up with his father?

Mind you, I'm not telling you to break up with this man. I would never tell you that. I'm just trying to grasp what you, yourself, see as your options. Do you see your relationship with his children as independent of you being in a relationship with him? If so, how would that be arranged in concrete terms? (As in: who would live where?) Maybe I'm missing something.

Also: did this 13 year old live for an interval of some years with his biological mother?
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Default Oct 19, 2021 at 07:13 PM
  #14
I am a stepparent of two and my daughter has stepparents, both stepfather and stepmother. I am also a step grandparent. So I have full understanding of what that entails. At no point I am clueless about that.

My stepkids have no mother and when she was still alive, they were estranged. So I understand emotional bond and situation with troubled parents but you also need to be realistic.

People go as far as suggesting you take this child with you. You have no custodial or even visitation rights. If he leaves you today, you’ll only see the child if he allows it. Going by how selfish your boyfriend is and how he is using you, you’d likely never see that child.

I do understand how honorable all this is but let’s not be too gullible and idealistic. There is no “WE have the child”. He and his ex had him. Yes the mother has mental illness, it doesn’t make her not his mother. You said she abandoned him. But then you said she rarely sees him. Seeing a parent rarely versus being abandoned by a parent, I am not sure that’s the same thing. It is not. Did she lose parental rights? Sometimes kids reconnect with the problem parent later. Heck people reconnect with parents who gave them up for adoption!

Also whenever people stay for the sake of the children, they teach their children what’s acceptable and how to conduct relationships. It might seem that kid doesn’t know. But kids always do. If he is a boy, he is learning how to use women and. treat women as sugar mamas. If she is a girl, she is learning what treatment is ok to accept. Kids learn what they live. Then they repeat the cycle

Of course you could stay with this man. But be mindful of true reasons behind allowing people to use you. Good luck
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Default Oct 19, 2021 at 09:08 PM
  #15
ouch... there is some tough love here.

Please know that my counselor is amazing. I have been with her for over 2 years and she has nurtured a lot of self-discovery while at the same time challenging me to better advocate for myself. She is an absolute professional with a stellar reputation in our community.

With regard to my stepson's mother, I believe I stated that she "basically abandoned" him. She moved to an adjacent state to pursue a new relationship almost 2 years ago and did not tell her son that she was leaving the home he grew up in. When she moved, my stepson had been living with us full time because of his mother's mental and physical health issues, compounded by a DUI and an inability to maintain employment. He does see her occasionally, maybe once a month for an overnight, as she has returned to our state and lives about 30 minutes away. Legally, she still shares custody with his father. I realize that I have no actual rights to this child, despite having raised him. I do believe that no matter what, my partner will honor the bond we share and that I will always have a place in his life. My stepson is a very old soul and has wisdom beyond his years. He has more emotional intelligence and integrity than either of his biological parents and is a highly intuitive, intelligent, and thoughtful young man. It has been a tremendous privilege to raise him and watch him grow. Honestly, there is not a person in this world who has spent more time with him than me, as even when he went back and forth between his mother's home and ours, his mother was too busy with her own nonsense to truly be present with him. I know that he loves her and cares about her, but he is so much more mature than she is, and honestly, she knows very little about him at this point in his development.

All this being said, I do have concerns about what will happen with my stepson if we choose to end our relationship. I have reasonable confidence that I will still be a constant in his life if, for no other reason than his father is always at work, his mother can't handle the responsibility, and I am able and willing to continue in my role whether we live together or not. Will it break my heart to lose what we have? absolutely - but he is 13, and he would have a say in what happens. My partner is not a terrible person - he clearly has some issues, but when it comes to his children, he tends to make sure their wants and needs come first (often to a fault).

Relationships are challenging. Parenting is challenging. I can only control my own choices and be mindful of my own intentions. It is an unsettling time, but I am not frightened. My parents and my sister have been wonderfully supportive, and honestly, I can say the same about my partner's family. I do pray that he will seek support for his issues. I have been clear with him that I cannot overcome his childhood and his current anger for him - the work has to be his work.

Thank you again for your support and advocacy.
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Default Oct 20, 2021 at 10:08 AM
  #16
If all money is "our" money why would he be so secretive about his income? Why would he need a third party when money is being discussed? Etc.

Not only does he seems to be financially irresponsible but it seems he is using you to fund his lifestyle, knowing you would also bail him out if/when he got in too deep.

As for
Quote:
If a partner spouse asks for a business loan, defines the terms, and signs a promissory note, should they be accountable?
Yes, absolutely. I would have very clear boundaries with money with him as you are clearly not on the same page..

It feels like *your* money is his money too... but *his* money remains his and only his.
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Default Oct 21, 2021 at 09:13 PM
  #17
I think your partner lives by the old maxim: "What's thine is mine; what's mine is my own."

So the boy lived in the home occupied by his bio mom until he was 11 y.o. (She moved from "the home he grew up in.") So he grew up in that home, but he wasn't really raised there. Your narrative gets a bit tortuous. In any case, he's a real good kid, with whom you have a close and warm relationship.

Your partner owes you $96,000. Maybe, if his law practice continues to do great, you'll get some more large checks from his business. As you say, those disbursements should reduce the tax liability of his practice, which increases the total of your combined incomes. He, however, doesn't seem to think in terms of your joint financial situation . . . except when it suits him to do that because he wants to press a claim on your assets. With an income of $3000/mon, you're not exactly rolling in dough. You have considerable assets, which you may need in later years. He seems to not think very much about the retirement years. That makes me suspect that those years are further ahead for him than they are for you. By any chance is he 5 or 10 years younger than you?

Of the money he owes you, $30,000 is covered by a promissory note. That can be enforced legally, as I'm sure you know. Taking a romantic partner to court, however, tends to torpedo the romance. I think he doubts that you'll want to do that. Still, he might pay up. Then, again, when the novelty of the new car wears off, he'll likely yearn for some other new, shiney ego booster - maybe a boat. I doubt you'll ever get that older $66,000 back. I think that was the price you paid for setting up a scenario where you got to feel like a spouse and mother. He wants the best for his kids, as long as he can get someone else to provide it - right down to their birthday gifts and Christmas presents. That 13 year old has a nice bedroom because you provided it. Does Dad have anything put aside for this boy's education? You buy the boy's expensive sneakers and keep him smartly dressed. But Dad puts his kids first? Hmmm. He sure gets a lot for his thousand bucks a month. I know a divorced mother of a teen whose blue collar father has to send her $700/mon in child support. This guy of yours sure knows how to cut a deal for himself. Then he's got the kid who dropped out of school. That young person will probably need a helping hand soon enough. How will Dad help out that child, when he can't manage to pay credit cards on time. If he does respond to the needs of an older child, that will be his excuse for why he can't pay you. He'll self-righteously say, "How can you pressure me when I'm trying to think of our children?" You'll be the bad one the way he'll tell it.

Clover, you're educated and financially sophisticated. For over a decade, you've declined marrying this guy. I think that was wise of you. I believe you are enough of a survivor to know better than to ever put his name on the deed to your house. You structured this relationship so that you could keep one foot in, but have one foot out. (Been there and done that, myself.) With an irresponsible partner, there may not be a better alternative. But everything in life exacts a price. I hope you will always keep secure your title to your home. No more ELoCs. No more loans, period. The man is not creditworthy. Let him do his future borrowing from banks. They can afford a loss better than you can. If they won't lend to him, neither should you.

He's an attorney, past the age of 45, who needs to borrow his girlfriend's credit card? The man has character deficits that he will not live long enough to evolve beyond, even with the help of a team of steller therapists meeting with him daily. It's sad that he had a drunken father. It's sad that he's so damaged. He may truly be doing the best he can make himself do. But what you see is what you get. Avoid buying into the delusion that he can "work through" his "issues," if you just give him more time and another $60,000 in exchange for some heartfelt sounding promise. When he signed that promissory note, he intended to pay you back. He only breaks promises when he discovers they're hard to keep. He'll go to his grave doing that. Character is durable. Lack of character is durable.

I'm not saying dump him. Keep him, if you want him. Just recognize who he is. Don't ask him to be who he is not. It's not wrong to love a deeply flawed person. Just don't lend him money.
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Default Oct 22, 2021 at 04:10 AM
  #18
Excellent post Rose.
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Default Oct 25, 2021 at 03:15 AM
  #19
Hi,

Sorry your husband is like that.

It’s “our” money when it’s for things for both of us and we both consent to the expenditure.

Its totally out of order for him to not repay the money he borrowed, especially before buying a BMW! And totally unreasonable to refuse discussion. He’s not taking responsibility for himself and freeloading on you.

It’s not “our” money if it was your money and then he spent it on things for him, including failed business ventures.

I’m annoyed for you.
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