Grieving my marriahe

Don't give me too much credit.

I'm not strong. I'm durable. I can outlast almost anything.

Strong means adhering to a direction and being firm in your convictions. I've been SLOW to develop strength.

My wife has threatened divorce for years. Two days after she announced to the kids, in a big blowout, that she was divorcing me, she sat on the couch and put her feet on my lap and asked if we could watch something together

That history has done two things:
- make me think I over reacted or misread big situations
- made it hard to believe big things someone tells me

My kids were practically screaming at me to get them into a new home before I heard them because of the above.

A lot of posters here were doing the same.

I actually quit listening to myself, and just began acting "as if"...

As if I could move forward

As if what the kids were saying was accurate

As if people would support me

As if it wasn't all my fault.

And I'm still doing that. Emotionally I still want her.

Something that hit me was, I read about a personality disorder where people only feel value for what they can physically do for another person. They may end up in a relationship that isn't well reciprocated. That creates intense feelings of longing.

A person like that can mistake wanting love, longing for love, for beingn in love.

In my case my home I grew up in was awesome... then there was alcohol.... then it was awesome... oops, alcohol is back..... now it's awesome.

So, this is familiar to me. I'm used to insecurity snd longing.

RDM

Lol, “ I’m durable”. Like the washing machine that can get out of wack from lop sided loads, but a good strong kick and it’s good to go for the next load. Not being mean here but reading your description of being durable is a way of being that I have not heard before.

When alcoholism is present in a relationship that becomes something everyone including the alcoholic lives around.

RD, your wife knows you are durable and she also knows that her threats of divorce gets her control too. You are just part of what she has lived off of but she can’t give you what you want.

Yes, often there is some kind of childhood trauma or injury that contributed to the development of what you experience with your wife. You can’t fix it and you could not fix your alcoholic parent either.

@sadmanagain and @RDMercer it’s good that you were both able to relate. This is something that alanon groups do. It is meant to be a support group where people with spouses that are alcoholics can meet others that also struggle.

You sound loyal. Loyalty is a good trait in the right situation, but it can be misused by others.

You sound like you’re describing codependency. I’m not sure it’s a personality disorder but it’s certainly a kind of behaviour pattern. Have you read up on codependency?

I've read about codependency. Someone on here introduced me to the term.

Having a hard time being positive today. I always wanted to be married with a family. I get so much enjoyment out of being home. My most loved people are there!

I wanted someone that would just ... be... with me.

Let's watch a movie, a documentary, cook a meal, complain about work, cuddle, go on road trips, try new restaurants together, hold hands while we sleep, look out for each other, trust each other with money, work towards something together, tell each other how hot we are...

I never believed in a dad's role or a mom's role, just parented. I wiped butts, gave bottles, did sex talks, made meals... whatever. I never believed in a man's work or a woman's work, there was JUST work. Mowing, painting, welding, ironing, laundry, roofing, walking to the bus stop.

I don't like the idea of being unpartnered.

But, I'm thankful for; good kids, help with my house, help packing, the promise of a decent new home, that a friend and a couple of family stepped in and gave me money to get this behind me ASAP, leave with pay from my workplace, coworkers who took my client load for a month.

And I'm thankful for all of you.

I'm really lucky.

RDMercer

Those around you see you as a far better and worthier person than your wife says you are.

I'm so happy to read your report. Thank you so much for letting us know!

Good, positive day yesterday.

Hard one today.

Having a hard time not pandering and begging her to come back.

She continues to mishandle things with the kids and the distance between her and them continues to increase.

She blames me for it, meanwhile the kids are saying things like, "I understand why you get so frustrated because she doesn't listen or apologize or anything."

Oldest said, "You were always the buffer to keep things smooth."

I still very much miss my wife, meaning I miss the person she used to be and the glimpses I get on occasion.

Hard day.

The glimpses you are experiencing can be breadcrumbing. It is meant to get you confused and keep you in the loop in a relationship. You are lucky that your kids know you are the good parent here.Sometimes the other parent successfully paints the good parent as being the bad one .In those scenarios kids can't get any help from good parent as they believe the smear campaign and stay away from the good one.Here your kids will be better off with you. Hang in there.

I'm going back through my texts, emails, and my diary entries.

I just really hit a point where I refused to accept more blame from her. And she was having real memory gaps, blaming me for gaslighting her for things she didn't remember, and was hiding away in our room for hours at a time on the phone.

And I am STILL wondering what I could have done different, done better, etc.

Our oldest took a lot of anger from his mom. A lot more than I knew. He was at a point that if he wasn't supported he was ready to enlist into the regular forces just to not live at home anymore.

I hate this all so much.

Try not to beat yourself up for not seeing the gravity of the dysfunction sooner. All you can do is move forward from where you are now and assure both your sons you are there for them and listening.

As I mentioned before, your wife has become an alcoholic and part of that disease is denial along with defending by pretending not to remember and also playing the victim. It’s a very narcissistic disorder and some get mean when they drink. Also part of the failure to remember can be due to drinking so much that she blacks out. People can function in a blackout and have no memory to very little memory of this blackout period.

Open Eyes, I still struggle with seeing her as an alcoholic.

I think because, in my prior experience, heavy drinkers drank to get drunk.... Oftentimes falling down blackout drunk.

I've never seen that with my wife. She has a regular intake of wine spread across hours. If a wine bottle is 5 drinks, she would have 5-6 drinks, sometimes more, spread across 8 hours or more. She said it took the edge off chronic nerve pain.

The amount of alcohol per hour meant she was never drunk.... Less than one drink per hour. But it's all day.

I never viewed it for what it was, I guess.

Did I alert her it was a lot? Yes
Did she say numerous times she would quit? Yes
Did she? No
Did she become defensive if that was pointed out? Yes
Did I raise concerns that the steady mix of depressant and antidepressants was a concern? Yes.
Did I raise a concern it could be causing other health problems she had? Yes.
Did she drink more than I was aware? Probably.
Did she understate how much she drank? Yes
Did she have other options for pain control? Yes

Do I have a concern that the alcohol and medication, or the cumulative effect of the alcohol contributed to memory gaps? Oh yes

Do I think she got blackout falling down drunk? No, I
Know she didn't.

RDM

I too had to learn more about alcoholism and how the body gets addicted to where a person has to consume or begins to experience withdrawals. Yet also the mood swings and the behavioral loops. Being in a good mood and then how the personality would change. Both my husband and my father were binge alcoholics.

It’s not just physical numbing, instead it’s emotional numbing and as a self medicating antidepressant and to reduce anxiety. The thing about wine is that it’s faster acting where it’s absorbed in the esophagus and gets to the brain faster while other alcohol like vodka and whiskey are slower as hard liquor needs to get absorbed by the blood stream before reaching the brain.

Over time it takes a toll on the body and brain and can cause liver damage. The fact that your oldest got help and learned about it is very telling. He should not have to live with the instability that made him reach out for help. It’s traumatizing to live with a parent that can become so unstable due to alcohol abuse. A person doesn’t have to be a falling down drunk. Most actually function while consuming.

Over 15 million Americans suffer from daily alcoholism RD, you are not alone in your confusion and broken heartedness and your sons need your support as they are too young to know how to emotionally understand it.

I met my wife in college. She was way beyond my level of dating. She was way more attractive and way more academically accomplished than me and belonged to a different level in society, so to speak. And she was humble. I remember the first time I told her she was beautiful. She blushed and became this endearingly awkward goofy creature. There was nothing pretentious in her. She made money babysitting and she'd be tanned and dirty from playing in the park with two little boys all day. I remember the first time I made her laugh hard and she snorted then HOWLED with laughter because she had been trying to hide it from me that she snorted when she laughed. And she was this really good kid who would walk across town with either of her parents in baggy jeans and a tshirt and be completely unaware of how unbelievably gorgeous she was. The college would have days where they introduced elementary kids to the campus, and it was like she was oblivious to other people, she'd just be with the kids, sitting on the floor with them at their level.

Guys didn't ask her out because they all thought she was out of range.

And I went for it. I was a farm boy working my way through college building houses and driving dump trucks. And she liked that I was strong and that I looked out for her and that I was respectful to her. I remember driving in my old truck, and Johnny Cash, "If I was a Carpenter" came on the radio in a McDonald's drive thru and she looked at me and said, "I would, you know. I'd marry you and have your children."

She had so many academic options and big money job options after graduation, she was recruited for work for years after graduation, but she knew she didn't want to work for too long. She wanted a family and wanted time at home. But first, she financially supported me through a 2nd degree.

20+ years later and she's still effortlessly gorgeous. Needs 20 min to get ready and leave. People who meet her often assume she's in her mid 30s though she's over 45. I've never been able to stop myself from just staring at her. She hit the genetic lottery. There's a reason my kids are so freakishly strong and tall.

And tonight, my oldest said he hopes we end up in family court, because he wants everyone to know how abusive she was with him during her low periods. He had example, after example, of horrible things she said to him, belittling and berating things, isolating things she did when he was a little boy. He collapsed to the floor crying yelling at me not to touch him.

What happened?

She's screamed at me for years that I'm toxic and destroying her. But with her not here the place is lighter. The kids are happier. My relationships with them are wonderful, and I'm thankful for lots of other good friendships and relationships too.

I'm still wondering, did I make her into what she is now? I believe my kids more than my own memories, but it's still so hard to reconcile how this deeply beautiful person became this.

My heart aches reading what you posted.Hugs.

You idolized her and put her on a pedestal. Sometimes people have side to them that can be cruel and selfish.

The fact that your sons are telling you about how abusive she was means there was a toxic side to her. Children don’t make abuse stories up. It’s your responsibility as a parent to listen to them and take steps to protect them.

It can be devastating to learn someone we loved so much has an abusive side to them.

Hey, thanks for sharing those personal memories with us, it’s very understandable you’ve got the mixed feelings you have.

I (or anyone on here) can’t tell you what happened when or why within your family life, it’s likely extremely complex, it’s possibly something that was already there (but not apparent) when you met your wife, but you can only deal with things as they come one step at a time. Try not to reproach yourself, keep your energy for the day you face today, you can’t change the past only the present.

Yes, doing a post-mortem.... I guess now isn't the time.

I have a few people around me who are jumping to my defense but I actually don't want them to. I don't hate her. This would be easier if I was angry, I think.

I loved her so much for so many years.

Hugs to you, RD.

I am also one who remembers my husband so much differently than he is now- and the confusion that goes with it. Looking back I see hints of less good qualities, but everyone has flaws, right? It's as though all the terrible parts of him grew and drowned out the better parts. It's so hard to say what has happened.
Most days I wonder if he was always a jerk and I compensated for him, or if something else is going on.

I'm curious when you first started seeing changes in your wife. For my husband, it was when DD first started showing signs of autonomy (around 3 yo, but that was 18 years into our marriage) but not off the rails til she finished elementary school. Don't know if that's coincidence to another illness, or something in him got triggered. (Childhood trauma?)

Codependency work helps. In some ways I feel like I'm falling in love with myself for the first time ever. It's sad at my age, but hey...

I often say I feel like a salt shaker who's incomplete without a pepper shaker. I want to be part of a pair, but then that makes me feel codependent in some ways. It's great to be part of a pair, but important to be okay as an individual unit.

Hurting for you. Good days and bad days... At least you have your kids.

Thanks ArmorPlate180. I'll dwell on the salt shaker analogy.

I like being partnered. Increasingly though I did have to give away more of myself to remain partnered.

My wife's physical illness progressed from 2013 to 2017, then she had a respite, then progressed again from 2018 to late 2021.

Along the way she lost work and education opportunities. I can look back and see the progression of profound depression in her. I remember really, really extending myself with Gottman style counselling for two years and almost breaking from it. The more I tried to "feel" her the lower I became in my own thinking. At some point I had to put up boundaries to keep us all afloat. I swear, by immersing my self in her feelings and trying to connect with her I almost broke. Her depression lows came out as bitter anger at me too.

I also know she didn't commit to counselling, medication, and lifestyle changes that she had to for her health and mental health. Pain and state of mind was self medicated with a steady trickle of wine. Steadily consuming a depressant and antidepressants and anti anxiety meds couldn't be good.

The point where things really began to change was during the first covid shutdown, which was when I became aware of how little she was doing. At the same time, the kids began to speak up against her for her constant anger at me and for just not being around. I ultimately said, you can deny these things happened when speaking to me, but you can't deny it to the kids. Please go to counselling with them, or us all in family counselling.

That set this all in motion. Having expectations of her. She needs unconditional love and acceptance. Having expectations or simply saying, That's not ok, the kids hear that language from you; that's not ok, that much wine will hurt you, started the downfall.

Yes, I'm codependent.

RDMercer