Trying to get out

Hey everybody. Needed to check in with you again.

Here's my backstory if you don't know it already and are interested: https://forums.psychcentral.com/roma...k-you-all.html

My situation has not improved. I have been sharing my sexual fantasies with my therapist and now I think I'm more hooked than ever. I told my second therapist about the situation and he talked to my first therapist about it and agrees that the situation is not healthy and that T1's behavior is not good. I've written T1 multiple letters now expressing my anger towards him about saying that we could "be together mentally, emotionally and spiritually" and how he read me love poems and held my hands when I told him how my body got set off the first time he brushed my hand.

I continue to share my sexual fantasies about him in sessions. He says that this is appropriate because therapy is a place where people go to talk about their sexual fantasies. I confronted him about how he keeps telling me that he's not really "rejecting" me because he would be together with me sexually if he could, it's just against the boundaries of psychotherapy. I asked him to please just have the decency to not tell me that it's not a rejection. He finally said "OK, I'm rejecting you." It was humiliating, but I continue to go back and tell him more fantasies because it has made me more sexual in the rest of my life and I'm having much better sex with my husband now, but I know that the situation is a mess.

A couple weeks ago I was suicidal over the situation and told him how hard it was that I had no one else to talk about it with except him. He suggested I tell my second therapist and some trusted friends and even my husband. This made me think there really must be nothing he's done wrong or else he wouldn't be encouraging me to tell people. I did tell three friends all of whom say I need to leave immediately and that I am in an addiction cycle with him and that he could lose his license just over what's happened already. I am SO confused. Why would he be telling me to tell people about this if it's something that could lose him his license?

I told him on Tuesday that three friends have now told me they're concerned I'm in an addiction cycle with him. His response was "Are you saying you think all addictions are bad?" And I said "Yes, addictions are not a good thing," to which he responded "You can be addicted to being kind, and that's not bad."

I also asked him once again to please explain to me what he meant when he said that we could be together "mentally, emotionally and spiritually." I asked him what he was thinking and how I can do that with him--like does that mean just thinking about him or trying to connect with him on some higher level spiritually? He just stared at me blankly and finally said "I can't tell you how to live your life."

I know that I have to leave but I'm SO afraid. He's turned on positive sexual feelings in me that I've never had in my whole life and I don't want to lose him, and I'm also terrified by the idea of never seeing him again. I live for the the next session in the hopes of getting some crumb from him, like a couple sessions back when I told him my sexual fantasy and he said that it "of course sounded very appealing." I didn't get a crumb on Tuesday and now I'm dying--flooded with compulsive sexual thoughts about him and having to take care of them on my own by m---ing because my husband is ill and can't have sex right now. It's really hard. I know I need to leave but also can't bring myself to do it because I don't want accept that I'll never see him again.

There were so many times before I told him about my sexual attraction that he was so kind and supportive of me. Even right after I told him things were still OK. But when I started sharing my fantasies and he said that he desired me too, everything started to go down the tubes.

I'm in a really hard place and not sure how I'll let go of him.

Oh Ramona

I'm pretty new around here but I've read all of your posts. It's good to see an update from you, but it's really not good to hear that things aren't getting any better. I really feel for you.

I know my input here is a bit of a drop in the ocean - you already know you need to break it off with him, and you say that your therapist and your friends agree. Given that my opinion is probably worth a lot less than theirs, it seems rather pointless to say it, but... You need to get away from him.

I feel so worried for you.

Thank you for responding. I think I need to hear "get away from him" a couple thousand times in a row because I'm having such a hard time letting go.

The thing I TRULY don't understand is if it's so clear that he's done something wrong, why has he been encouraging me to tell other people about the situation? That's the part that really doesn't make sense and makes me think that I'm the one that's misinterpreted or mischaracterized the situation.

I don't know why he isn't afraid of you telling other people. He really should be - the way he's been behaving is 100% not appropriate and incredibly damaging to you. Therapists are human too - they can be arrogant, or stupid, or deluded. But they have a great responsibility to be self-aware. He obviously isn't.

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

get away from him

ad infinitum.

What if what he is doing is right?

Is there another way you can react, something else you can say or do?

Honestly, when I started telling my three friends about it, I presented it to each of them by saying that I'd been rejected by someone I desperately wanted to be with and thought that they were going to offer me support about being rejected. I really didn't think they'd all tell me I was a victim of therapy abuse. I REALLY don't want this to have happened to me. I don't WANT to be a victim of therapy abuse. I don't know how to handle taking on that label in addition to everything else I've been through in my life. I guess that's the real reason I'm so reluctant to admit this happened. He was kind to me and totally appropriate with me for years, even for the first few months after I brought up the transference I felt like things were OK. I don't know how it all fell apart so miserably and I feel desperate to find a way to make it all OK.

Therapy IS a place to talk about your fantasies. But i dont think theyve established that a t is like a bartender who is obligated to cut you off if you overindulge. I think thats on you. They give you the space in which to change.

It sounds like you are starting to think of yourself as a professional victim. First as a victim of your job situation a few years ago, now as a victim of your t. You are burning daylight.

Ya know, the sexual feelings are just natures way of preserving the species. One more try before you hit menopause. A lot of us have gone thru it. Do you really want to live your life ruled by that?

I don't understand this response at all. I literally just said I don't want to think of myself as a victim.

One more try of what before I hit menopause???

i have found this article to be incredibly helpful at providing me with the insight and courage to finally leave my T of many years, who, although was not sexually abusive to me, i feel was quite emotionally abusive throughout much of our therapy together. please try to have a look at this: Why We Stay: How Childhood Loss, Abandonment and Neglect Can Make It Hard to Leave an Abusive Therapist ? Surviving Therapist Abuse

I might interpret it wrong but I believe unaluna is just trying to motivate you to think for yourself, not view yourself as a passive sufferer of others' wrongdoings, and get out of a situation that's no longer serving you constructively. You have been in this same place for quite long now.

Maybe the T is telling you to talk with others because he knows he won't do anything to change the situation. Not sure, but even such a statement sounds like denying his own responsibility in it. And the things he tells you are... disturbing, at least. That suggestion about "addictions" sounds like gaslighting to me. He wants you to be addicted to being kind to him?! What the....?!

Yes, please get away, ramona. Yes sexual feelings can be very pleasant and tempting, but it does not sound like this is a good trigger if you feel enslaved and not liberated.

The last session was just BIZARRE. The addiction thing was him just trying to say that not all addictions are bad,....like "kindness can be an addiction." It's one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. He's TERRIBLE at his job. And of course he's training director at one of the most revered clinics in the city. It sucks. He sucks. I have a physical, chemical, psychological, and behavioral ADDICTION to him because of the sexual feelings that get set off. It BLOWS. I know I gotta get out and I'm stalling because the addiction part of me keeps telling me there's a way to make it all OK. I don't want to admit that I've let this happen to me so I'm continuing to let it happen to me!

I'm new around here. Just wanted to add that this is not right. You're T is totally playing with your emotions. I know it's going to be super hard to move on and you're going to think you can't do this, but please consider going to another T. After awhile you will look back and realize what a creep that guy is. What he is doing isn't ethical. I'm sorry you're going through this.

I left almost two months ago. I've been working with a second and third therapist--referred to as T2 and T3 in this thread.

Tomorrow I see my psychiatrist. I've only been seeing him for about 5 months. I switched to him because he is in network and a friend of a friend got me a referral for him which was difficult because he's university affiliated at a very prestigious clinic. I have decided that I'm going to tell him tomorrow what's happened. I'm also going to ask him if he can possibly get me a referral to a therapist at the university hospital. It was extremely difficult to get in with him as a client, and I believe the only way to get to see a psychotherapist through this hospital is to be a patient of the med clinic that I'm currently in as well.

I'm hoping that if I'm honest with him about what's happened, and the fact that it's been financially devastating to my family along with the emotional destruction, that he will refer me to a psychotherapist there. It's far from where I live but is IN NETWORK and would be $20/session as opposed to the hundreds per session T2 and T3 charge. My insurance covers half of those sessions but I'm still out about $125/week...$500/month.

I'm so over spending all of my family's money on therapy. I researched the list of "in network" therapists on my insurance site today and they look TERRIBLE. I have an MSW myself and worked in the mental health field for 8 years before becoming a writer and I'm quite sure I have more experience than everyone I looked up today. The only Ts on the list that I think could handle the complexity of my case are the ones who work at the university hospitals--but it's very hard to get in there.

I will see how it goes tomorrow.

Strangely (or not strangely?) I have been feeling better the past couple of days. I think looking at T1's Facebook photos has actually turned into a GOOD thing for me. I find him SO UNATTRACTIVE in so many of these photos--so DIFFERENT from the person he presented himself to be in our sessions. In sessions he was this handsome guy in a sharp suit reading me Rumi poems. On Facebook, he is a skinny, sweaty guy who wears flowy pants and shirts and is, honestly, a bit gross to me.

I'm hoping I've turned a corner.

I talked to one of my oldest friends this weekend whom I hadn't told about this. She is a lawyer and said I should sue the **** out of him. I told her that it likely wouldn't result in much of a windfall for me, based on the experiences of others on this page, but she still strongly encouraged me to consider it.

I am very tired, but hopefully starting to wake up.

Yes, yes, yes!

You're only being a victim by letting this continue. If you can kick the addiction and get out of this, you won't have 'another label', you'll be a strong and capable person who managed to do something very difficult in the name of looking after herself.

Unfortunately, addictions tend to become harder and harder to get out of the longer we stay in them. If you can find a way to resolve it now, most likely won't regret it later. Maybe try to find some kind of local peer support group rather than just another therapist and your family/friends, if you think it helps pull you out of it.

Actually, being 'addicted to' kindness can have a really bad fate. A person could give away all their money and belongings and be destitute. That old saying "too much of a good thing...." is wise.

From what you write here, your therapist sounded really professional and safe when you first disclosed your feelings for him.

But the line from the quote above really creeped me out the first time you posted it here. It still creeps me out. That combined with his telling you he wants to be with you but can't be.

As a side note, clinical people who become directors of centers or programs etc seem to be those who can't work with patients due to patient harm or liability- incompetency, malpractice, ethics, etc. None of us could possibly know if this is the case with your therapist, but I'd consider it when trying to make a decision.

I don't know what else to say, except keep talking with your therapist about it. Interesting he says what your therapist is doing is wrong. Could you record a session and play it for your therapist?

Other than that, the thoughts that popped into my mind are about his possibly indulging you then shutting you off--that throws you off balance and promotes addictive behavior. It could be a coincidence or only your reaction, but it is something that could also be done intentionally and easily.

Wish I could be more helpful. Sorry you are struggling so much.

Really appreciate the feedback. He WAS totally appropriate when I first told him about this. Totally. I looked back through my email--the first time I actually admitted my attracted to him was the end of April last year. I couldn't get the words out in session so eventually I just emailed him. His response was kind and appropriate and just like "It's OK. It's normal and you're brave to share this and you and I are OK and it's all OK."

I don't know what the f--- happened!

Hugs...I get the sense that your T feels he is almost above the rules of ethics, which is why he's OK with you telling friends and T2 about it. He's deluded himself into thinking he's doing nothing wrong. Or, worse, he knows he's doing something wrong, but doesn't care and doesn't think he'll get caught because he hasn't physically crossed a line, even though he has emotionally.

The line about how some addictions can be good is disturbing to me, too...because it sounds like he's talking about your addiction to him.

I know it's painful, but I really think you need to walk away. You're still seeing T2, right? (I know you were concerned about being able to afford to keep seeing him.) Talk to him more. Take a few weeks off from T1, which I know will be painful, but you need to step away to get out from under the spell. Talk to T2, talk to your friends, talk on here. Maybe talk to that group, TELL, that's mentioned in the pinned postings on this subforum, just to get their perspective. It just seems that, even though he hasn't crossed any physical/sexual boundaries, your T has definitely crossed some emotional ones. And it's having a negative effect on you...

That didn't cross my mind so glad you pointed this out. I understand that this actually very common in cases of abuse by an 'authority figure' type of person.