[rodza_sky]

Hi guys, i think i'll create a separate thread instead of bumping my old one, but you can find it here https://forums.psychcentral.com/schi...d-dub-qna.html

Long story short
Basically i am an anxious person with current health anixiety that dramatically increased with the death of my mother, i have gone through multiple fears of different diseases and at some point i started thinking "what if what i have is a schiz and my hypochondriac fears are delusions"? Ever since then i was super scared of Schiz. It took me a lot of googling to figure it out, but i had a basic understanding of what i have and why my condition is at least questionable to call schiz
I've read a lot of articles and posted on a lot of fourms until i found one where i consulted with a supposed certified specialist (it was online, so who knows how professional he is) who told me that i definitely just have anixiety. So whatever, right i kinda calmed down

Later on, few weeks ago i learned that my biological father with whom i don't live was diagnosed with F20 Schiz. He was diagnosed around the age of 43, plus minus. So now i am super afraid of inheriting the disease

And talking to that doctor guy, i've figured that what i've had were definitely not delusions, since in the condition the believes are so severe that people are given the medicine to get rid of them, which i definitely dont need. There are other ways to convince me i was wrong.
After i told that doc guy "yeah, thanks, i feel better about delusions now" he said that i am in the hypochondrical cycle and that i will soon find something else to worry about, and there it goes.

Literally the next day i first started thinking of unusual believes and then started suspecting i was hearing voices. 4 days ago i was 100% sure that i've had no voices Over the last 3 days i've had 2 incidences, both of which could be explained by something else, since i was not completely alone.
I work retail and the day before yesterday when closing and looking if everyone left, in the supposedly empty of customers store for a second i thought i've heard voices somewhere far away, like some sort of murmur and it felt like "ah, what was that?",like when you though you heard something for a sec, but unsure what was that. But i was super tired (after an 8 hour shift) and there was lots of noise in the building, such as conditioner, radio, animals screaming (i work at petco) and it later turned out that there were janitors in the building who maybe were talking to each other. And later on i tested and it turned out that i could recreate the exact same sound in my head and stop it whenever i want by another thought or by starting doing something else and thinking about it, so maybe it even was myself thinking of what to look, imagining it and getting scared of my own imagination for a second since i was super tired and not thinking straight

The second case was yesterday, and it would be also possible to explained by something else. I was ringing the person up and i've heard someone say "s**t!" right by my ear, like not addressing me, but like if someone said it to themselves/ the sound was coming from outside and was not inside of my head and it was coming from the direction of a person standing by me and there were 2 more people within my hand reach who could've said it. I did ask my coworker about it later on (and looked very stupid btw) but he said he heard nothing, but also he maybe didnt even get what i was talking about or he maybe wasnt paying attention, whatever. So that could be explained by assuming that some of the people that stood close to me had said it and from what i understood, its more common for schizophrenics to hear voices inside their head.

So what i wanted to know is, if there is no clear evidence that there is a voice in my head and what i hear could be explained by something else, i shouldn't yet be bothered by it right or at least not assume that what i have are the voices? Meaning if i was sitting alone and had a voice is one thing, but another is when there is at least semi-reasonable explanation right? How do you feel your voices

Also there is a thing of me now expecting a voice to pop up at some point and i am super afraid.

Thanks, i've been trying to look for a specialist, but received no responses yet

You would know if you were hearing voices, at least that's been my experience and those I've spoken to. It is clear as a bell, as if a real person just spoke to you.

Now, even if you actually *did* have an auditory hallucination, which it sounds like deep down, irrational anxiety aside, you know that you didn't, that does NOT mean that you have or will develop schizophrenia!

MANY people without any trace of mental illness regularly hear voices. It is COMMON to hallucinate when going to sleep and waking up (hypnagogic and hypnopompic hallucinations respectively), and when sleep deprived. It is also COMMON to experience pareidolia, which is actually an illusion and not a hallucination, where your brain makes out voices in ambiguous noises like white noise etc - our brains are designed to spot patterns, but that means that we frequently find patterns when there aren't actually any.

The energy that you are expending googling schizophrenia symptoms and freaking yourself out really needs to be better channelled into finding a therapist to help you with your anxiety. You said before that you were going to speak to your college's psychologist - what happened with that?? Googling/posting will only reassure you in the short term, as you yourself admit in your post, a therapist will help you learn to reassure yourself ALL OF THE TIME. It is *imperative* that you find a good therapist to work through this. There is little we can do to help you online. We've already told you that you don't display symptoms of sz, that you need a therapist, and that, even if your dad was diagnosed with sz (and assuming that's a correct diagnosis), your chances of developing psychosis are still low. You need real life help that words on a screen can't provide.

I hope that you can get some proper help with your anxiety. I imagine that it must be very distressing to keep freaking yourself out like this all of the time. You deserve proper help

*Willow*

[rodza_sky]

Originally Posted by WeepingWillow23

You would know if you were hearing voices, at least that's been my experience and those I've spoken to. It is clear as a bell, as if a real person just spoke to you.

Now, even if you actually *did* have an auditory hallucination, which it sounds like deep down, irrational anxiety aside, you know that you didn't, that does NOT mean that you have or will develop schizophrenia!

MANY people without any trace of mental illness regularly hear voices. It is COMMON to hallucinate when going to sleep and waking up (hypnagogic and hypnopompic hallucinations respectively), and when sleep deprived. It is also COMMON to experience pareidolia, which is actually an illusion and not a hallucination, where your brain makes out voices in ambiguous noises like white noise etc - our brains are designed to spot patterns, but that means that we frequently find patterns when there aren't actually any.

The energy that you are expending googling schizophrenia symptoms and freaking yourself out really needs to be better channelled into finding a therapist to help you with your anxiety. You said before that you were going to speak to your college's psychologist - what happened with that?? Googling/posting will only reassure you in the short term, as you yourself admit in your post, a therapist will help you learn to reassure yourself ALL OF THE TIME. It is *imperative* that you find a good therapist to work through this. There is little we can do to help you online. We've already told you that you don't display symptoms of sz, that you need a therapist, and that, even if your dad was diagnosed with sz (and assuming that's a correct diagnosis), your chances of developing psychosis are still low. You need real life help that words on a screen can't provide.

I hope that you can get some proper help with your anxiety. I imagine that it must be very distressing to keep freaking yourself out like this all of the time. You deserve proper help

*Willow*

I guess you are right, I am trying to find a doctor to work with right now, but no success yet.

It does seem to be nonsensical for supposed hallucinations and psychosis to start the next day after i figured delusions out for myself, especially considering the fact that i until then i was 100% sure that i am good on voices
At times i do get an understanding that my fears are probably unreasonable.
But now that i've been hung up on hallucinations, everything i hear; i think of as "Is that it? Is that what they are?"
And this feeling has been with me less than a week... So yeah.. And reading does seem to make it worse, because whatever i've read i begin to think of.
Such as, i've read that young people often get false smells of marijuana, and whenever i am out in public (i live in the bay, where the smell is common) and i smell it, i get scared. Same thing now applies to any weird smell really, i am afraid that what i smell is actually not real and is in my head only..
What's funny is that real schizophrenics are not really bothered by their symptoms in the way that i am.

Like my diagnosed dad, doesn't seem to care that much about what he has and although he doesn't believe his diagnosis, it does seem to be true from what i observed. On the same board where i consulted with a doctor there as a person who had voices in their head and only got concerned with them when they were told that this is not normal. Schizophrenics themselves probably don't know they are sick unless they are told, just like normal person without health anxiety wouldn't get freaked about a bump on their skin, schizophrenic wouldn't be concerned with what they have until a certain point.

Like when i am actively looking for something in myself, i am probably finding it. At this point i am afraid that when i misspeak or say a phrase that is not super common for myself although in the right context, such as "god bless" as a wish of good luck, that it may be a symptom of a disease, because "i never been a religious person. is that not normal..." although with every fear like that, there is a voice of reason in myself that tells me that i am probably wrong

I guess this is just a form of the same fear that i've had before with cancer, heart disease and als, i am afraid that i will die or be majorly disabled for the rest of my life..

I have a phone consultation scheduled with one doctor this monday, i hope to get something out of it

Anyway, thank you a lot for your support, i really appreciate you taking your time to respond to my freak outs.
I hope that i will either not come back here ever again or come back to report that i am alright from now on..
Thanks

How did your phone consultation go today? I hope that it went well.

As a FYI, person-centred language is generally preferred; so people with schizophrenia, rather than schizophrenics. I know that some people aren't bothered by it, they'll identify themselves 'as' bipolar or diabetic etc, but that's their personal choice for themselves. I certainly don't identify myself with some random sz diagnosis and so don't like being referred to as 'schizophrenic'.

Wrt how bothered people are by hallucinations and delusions, it varies. I think it depends on the messages we tell ourselves about them, like with any experience really. I get a headache and tell myself that it's just a headache and I'm ok, and I can get on with my day. But if I had a headache and told myself that I had a brain tumour, then I would likely be very upset and distressed and unable to focus on what I had to do that day. Same with the distressing thoughts and images that demons put in my head: at first they really upset me. But instead of focusing on the awful things They are threatening to do to me, I tell myself that They are just trying to upset me, and that the thoughts and images, whilst unpleasant, aren't actually hurting me unless I allow myself to become upset by them. And honestly, you do get used to it after a while...

So the next time you hear or smell something, instead of torturing yourself about whether it's 'real' or not, take a deep breath, tell yourself that you're ok, and go back to what you were doing. I don't know if you have ever done mindfulness but it's a good way to learn to observe your thoughts and feelings without getting entangled within them. So you can observe the thought that you are hallucinating, for example, without actually having to believe them and dive into the feeling of fear. Remind yourself that thoughts and feelings aren't facts. Hopefully you will get a therapist soon and they will help you practise these sorts of techniques until they are second nature.

All the best

*Willow*

[rodza_sky]

Originally Posted by WeepingWillow23

How did your phone consultation go today? I hope that it went well.

As a FYI, person-centred language is generally preferred; so people with schizophrenia, rather than schizophrenics. I know that some people aren't bothered by it, they'll identify themselves 'as' bipolar or diabetic etc, but that's their personal choice for themselves. I certainly don't identify myself with some random sz diagnosis and so don't like being referred to as 'schizophrenic'.

Wrt how bothered people are by hallucinations and delusions, it varies. I think it depends on the messages we tell ourselves about them, like with any experience really. I get a headache and tell myself that it's just a headache and I'm ok, and I can get on with my day. But if I had a headache and told myself that I had a brain tumour, then I would likely be very upset and distressed and unable to focus on what I had to do that day. Same with the distressing thoughts and images that demons put in my head: at first they really upset me. But instead of focusing on the awful things They are threatening to do to me, I tell myself that They are just trying to upset me, and that the thoughts and images, whilst unpleasant, aren't actually hurting me unless I allow myself to become upset by them. And honestly, you do get used to it after a while...

So the next time you hear or smell something, instead of torturing yourself about whether it's 'real' or not, take a deep breath, tell yourself that you're ok, and go back to what you were doing. I don't know if you have ever done mindfulness but it's a good way to learn to observe your thoughts and feelings without getting entangled within them. So you can observe the thought that you are hallucinating, for example, without actually having to believe them and dive into the feeling of fear. Remind yourself that thoughts and feelings aren't facts. Hopefully you will get a therapist soon and they will help you practise these sorts of techniques until they are second nature.

All the best

*Willow*

Thanks, yeah, im seeing that lady on Tuesday. We were able to even set up a decent price. I hope she isn't a scammer (my friend warned me about shrinks that "just tell you what you wanna hear for money)

Basically the deal is still that i keep thinking of everything as "is that it?" i keep going back to my past believes (which i wasn't 100% sure of anyway) as "were those things delusions". When something happens i think of it as "what if it was a hallucination?" There are times when i feel fine and NOT worried about X disease, but they don't last long and i keep ending up in the same place with looking for symptoms and thinking of what i else i could have. If i stayed in that condition of "not caring" that would be perfect.

Like at work today, i needed a manager to get me something, but i had no beeper thingy to call for him to come over, the intercom went on announcing one of the "codes" for some reason although i didn't call for it and neither did my manager. There were a few other people in who might have done it purposely or accidentally. After the message was broadcasted my manager came up and asked "whats up?" i told him what i needed and he brought it for me. And although there is a clear evidence that this thing wasn't a hallucination such as other person being involved, them actually bringing what i asked and they were able to recall to this event later on, sorta (what i asked if the intercom goes on by itself sometimes, to which he said "rarely, but it does") i still think of stuff like "what if i hallucinated this whole thing up" and get stressed out.

I notice certain things such as patterns (like i see 4, and i was born on the 4th) or whatever and think "ppl with schizophrenia believe in special meaning stuff, am i too? why did i notice the number 4? is that it?" and get freaked. Basically i think of it as a possible symptom even before i make some connection to anything.

Even when i feel fine and more talkative i think of "oh, why am i so talkative and joyful... Is THAT IT?" when im not concerned i think "what, you accepted it now?"

I think that if i voice those things to people,they will think that i am crazy. And i begin to suspect that people already do. But again i realize that "why would they, i didn't even say anything that weird, that's just anxiety... is it?"

I also think "what if doctor does diagnose me.. I may be not be able to believe it or accept it... Will that mean that i am sick?"

I also figured out one of the things i suspected to be voices. When i was falling asleep i was hearing certain things in my head, not addressing me, just babbling, it would be songs, stuff from tv and movies and whatever random sayings. Like i would feel them as thoughts, not real voices of real people, but they would feel semi-unusual. I was able to stop them when i "jump out of bed" or focus on finding them, but i wasn't sure if i can initiate them. That also freaked me a bit, but it turned out that i am just sometimes starting to "hear" dreams before i see them. As one time when i was falling asleep i could hear the same kind of nonsense but i was also able to see it visually and i was in even deeper sleep, yet still a bit awoken. (like 85% asleep and a tiny bit conscious. So that is out of the way, i think...

I kinda found the description of what i have https://robertlindsay.wordpress.com/...-is-schiz-ocd/
but yeah. The more symptoms and signs i find, the more of them i start feeling/looking or thinking of

Also another good thing is that my friends don't seem to think that i'm psychotic. I shared my fears with one of my friends who didn't even think that i need to see a doctor for anything because "you are normal.. What do you need to see a shrink for"? But later agreed that i do have anxiety and this is the only thing in their opinion that i need to work on.
At least from an outsider perspective i seem alright, its myself who keeps freaking out that i'm sick. Which is probably even the opposite of schizophrenia, with which from what i understood it would be the other way- i wouldn't think or believe there is anything wrong with me, and others would see it from their perspective.

I hope i will be fine. Anyway, again i appreciate your support and the time you are taking to help me.

The vast majority of psychiatrists and therapists will not just "tell you what you want to hear for the money". That would be unethical. I'm not sure that it is helpful for your friend to tell you this when you are so anxious already. I hope that your appt goes well. It may take a few appts to figure out if they're going to be a good fit for you.

In the meantime, could you try using self-help techniques like I mentioned above, or maybe a positive affirmation; something like "I'm ok" over and over whilst focusing on my breathing helps me when I'm freaking out. Another thing that people with anxiety sometimes find helpful is setting aside a scheduled 'worry time'. So you would set aside a period of, say, half hour once a day to think/write about whatever it is you are worrying about. Then, the rest of the time, whenever a worry pops into your head, you tell yourself 'not now, I will worry about this at X o'clock' and you bring your focus back to the task at hand. If you really need to google symptoms, which I would really try to discourage because I think that just further triggers your health anxiety, save it for your worry time.

I hope that you get some relief from your anxiety soon

*Willow*

[rodza_sky]

Originally Posted by WeepingWillow23

The vast majority of psychiatrists and therapists will not just "tell you what you want to hear for the money". That would be unethical. I'm not sure that it is helpful for your friend to tell you this when you are so anxious already. I hope that your appt goes well. It may take a few appts to figure out if they're going to be a good fit for you.

In the meantime, could you try using self-help techniques like I mentioned above, or maybe a positive affirmation; something like "I'm ok" over and over whilst focusing on my breathing helps me when I'm freaking out. Another thing that people with anxiety sometimes find helpful is setting aside a scheduled 'worry time'. So you would set aside a period of, say, half hour once a day to think/write about whatever it is you are worrying about. Then, the rest of the time, whenever a worry pops into your head, you tell yourself 'not now, I will worry about this at X o'clock' and you bring your focus back to the task at hand. If you really need to google symptoms, which I would really try to discourage because I think that just further triggers your health anxiety, save it for your worry time.

I hope that you get some relief from your anxiety soon

*Willow*

Little update
So I went to the doctor and she basically confirmed what I was thinking. Anxiety due to the loss of a close family member.
I still feel anxious and doubtful though. I still very often think of every sound and smell I feel as a possible hallucination. I am still afraid that I may have delusions and I very often get scared if any kind of suspicious thught, just the fact that it's there scares me. I am aware that whatever i thought is unlikely, but as it crosses my head, I get scared. Like I cross my eyes with my coworker a few times per day and I get scared that I noticed it before I even get a thought of "does she X" in my head
I am also afraid that since I'm at the genetic risk, I may develop it in the future or already have it at the early stage with the early signs and first symptoms. I have been having some cognitive issues for a few years and have been very snappy at ppl for quitr a while, but that and tiredness are probably related to my work
I am afraid that since my shrink doesn't specialize on schiz, they may miss those signs or misinterpret them
I think that she may be wrong with not diagnosing me with schiz. But at the same time if she did diagnose me, I would possibly have troubles accepting the diagnosis and this also scares me.

[Sometimes psychotic]

Originally Posted by rodza_sky

Little update
So I went to the doctor and she basically confirmed what I was thinking. Anxiety due to the loss of a close family member.
I still feel anxious and doubtful though. I still very often think of every sound and smell I feel as a possible hallucination. I am still afraid that I may have delusions and I very often get scared if any kind of suspicious thught, just the fact that it's there scares me. I am aware that whatever i thought is unlikely, but as it crosses my head, I get scared. Like I cross my eyes with my coworker a few times per day and I get scared that I noticed it before I even get a thought of "does she X" in my head
I am also afraid that since I'm at the genetic risk, I may develop it in the future or already have it at the early stage with the early signs and first symptoms. I have been having some cognitive issues for a few years and have been very snappy at ppl for quitr a while, but that and tiredness are probably related to my work
I am afraid that since my shrink doesn't specialize on schiz, they may miss those signs or misinterpret them
I think that she may be wrong with not diagnosing me with schiz. But at the same time if she did diagnose me, I would possibly have troubles accepting the diagnosis and this also scares me.

Are you being treated for the anxiety? that should help.......

[rodza_sky]

Originally Posted by Sometimes psychotic

Are you being treated for the anxiety? that should help.......

We just started and only had a few sessions
But technically yes

[Sometimes psychotic]

Originally Posted by rodza_sky

We just started and only had a few sessions
But technically yes

Are you seeing a psychiatrist or psychologist? I will say medication is often faster, sometimes it takes the edge off and lets you feel better sooner. Something to consider.....

[rodza_sky]

Originally Posted by Sometimes psychotic

Are you seeing a psychiatrist or psychologist? I will say medication is often faster, sometimes it takes the edge off and lets you feel better sooner. Something to consider.....

Therapist, one that talks to you
I really don't want to get on any meds and that lady's prices are very reasonable
I've been talking glycine as my friend from med school adviced me

[Sometimes psychotic]

Originally Posted by rodza_sky

Therapist, one that talks to you
I really don't want to get on any meds and that lady's prices are very reasonable
I've been talking glycine as my friend from med school adviced me

Does she do cbt...that is one of the faster, more effective therapies, you can start seeing results in around 6 months.....

You have to keep reminding yourself that, no matter what anyone says, no matter how many people tell you that you don't have schizophrenia, the nature of your anxiety condition is going to make you doubt it. As you yourself said, even if she said that you do have sz, you wouldn't believe that either!

And genetics really aren't a done deal. One parent with it is roughly a 10% chance, which means a 90% chance that you will NEVER develop sz. I know somebody who had both of his parents with sz, giving him a 40% chance of developing it, and he doesn't have sz or any other kind of MI.

Just keep reminding yourself that you're ok (the mantra that I talked about before), keep developing your coping strategies, and keep working with your therapist. If you don't want meds, and I can fully respect that decision, that's what you need to keep doing until things start getting better for you.

I hope things improve for you soon

*Willow*

[rodza_sky]

Thank you for your support and advices
As i mentioned i am still worried and i still freak out over every single thought, sound and every single time i get even remotely suspicious. Like today i was sleeping and dreaming of my work, first seconds i woke up, i still had my boss's voice saying something to me in my head. Didn't feel real, just like a thought, but i've had it and i freaked. I do realize that it was part of a dream, but you know, still freaks me.
I began thinking of switching my doctor, since she doesn't specialize on schiz, i am afraid that she will miss it in me, although i've been told that it is really hard to miss.

I also wanted to know something. I've been told that if i do develop schizophrenia, i wouldn't be able to tell it by myself anyway. Like from what i understand i wouldn't even question the voices if i really had them, they would be real to me and i wouldn't feel like "is that it?" i would just start believing that god is talking to me or whatever.
So what i wanted to know is: having a risk, how should i treat it? Should i just forget about it and let people close to me to be more attentive to me acting unusual or should i be checking with psychiatrist occasionally like once a year even after i am done working on anxiety?

Also, what age were you diagnosed? My therapist was surprised to hear that my dad was diagnosed after 40 and said that it is really unusual

[Sometimes psychotic]

Depends.....I didn’t know but some people do.

36

[Loose Screw x 2]

If you aren't seeing a doctor and/or therapist about this, I would say that it would be a good idea to start. I would say more but, I'm distracted tonight. I'm sorry for that. I really am.

Originally Posted by rodza_sky

Thank you for your support and advices
As i mentioned i am still worried and i still freak out over every single thought, sound and every single time i get even remotely suspicious. Like today i was sleeping and dreaming of my work, first seconds i woke up, i still had my boss's voice saying something to me in my head. Didn't feel real, just like a thought, but i've had it and i freaked. I do realize that it was part of a dream, but you know, still freaks me.

Hypnopompic hallucinations are entirely normal. As you said, it was part of your dream state.

I'm sorry that you are still struggling It will take some time for therapy to start to help.

Originally Posted by rodza_sky

I began thinking of switching my doctor, since she doesn't specialize on schiz, i am afraid that she will miss it in me, although i've been told that it is really hard to miss.

I honestly don't think that would help you. Realistically, you could see the world's leading expert on schizophrenia and you wouldn't believe them, would you? You need to trust her expertise and build a relationship and work on your anxiety. That's what will ultimately help, not second opinion after second opinion after second opinion. I know that it's hard, but you need to give the therapy time to work

Originally Posted by rodza_sky

I also wanted to know something. I've been told that if i do develop schizophrenia, i wouldn't be able to tell it by myself anyway. Like from what i understand i wouldn't even question the voices if i really had them, they would be real to me and i wouldn't feel like "is that it?" i would just start believing that god is talking to me or whatever.

Not necessarily. Some people do indeed become psychotic very acutely. But other people have it happen over a long period of time. For example, the first time I heard voices, it completely startled me, but I logically realised within seconds that they must have been auditory hallucinations.

Originally Posted by rodza_sky

So what i wanted to know is: having a risk, how should i treat it? Should i just forget about it and let people close to me to be more attentive to me acting unusual or should i be checking with psychiatrist occasionally like once a year even after i am done working on anxiety?

There is absolutely no need for this. As I said before, if one parent has sz, you have a 90% chance of never developing schizophrenia. The people around you will notice if you ever became unwell, whether psychosis or something else. If it will help reassure you, explain the early warning signs for them to look out for, and then try to let it go

Originally Posted by rodza_sky

Also, what age were you diagnosed? My therapist was surprised to hear that my dad was diagnosed after 40 and said that it is really unusual

I was diagnosed nearly 2 years ago, at 29yo. But I first started hearing voices 9 years ago, and I first noticed something was wrong 10 years ago.

Typically sz is diagnosed in late teens to early twenties in males, and late twenties for females, so, yes, a sz diagnosis in your 40s is unusual. Perhaps he never sought medical attention before? Perhaps it appeared insidiously? Or perhaps he was misdiagnosed? As you don't have contact with him and therefore don't know his experiences, it's hard to know for sure.

Please keep going with the therapist. Give it time to start working, and keep using your self-help techniques in the meantime. You will get through this

All the best,

*Willow*