[Irine]

would you agree, after giving it a second thought, that sympathy may lead to self pity?

[(JD)]

Do you mean receiving sympathy might cause them to fall into self pity? As opposed to receiving empathy?

[Irine]

well..let`s say it may ENCOURAGE self pity, not really CAUSE it.

for instace:

i call you on the phone and say:
"you don`t know my life is such a mess..i am depressed...etc."

and you say:
"ho dear i am sorry. i also some times feel like that."

and then i keep talking...and talking about how bad my life is...and especially when you agree and say "yes i see"
noding to everything..it`s like..i may repeat and go ON INTO my suffering, recreating everyhting in my mind even stronger (and beliveing the situations IS that bad). and thus the negative words flow and repeat in different phrasing....and i call you all the time to complain and get used to it and think everyhting is so bad....
and get addicted to getting attention by complaining...

that is what i mean more or less.
i don`t say there is NO place for sympathy!
i just think that we need it maybe only in the very first steps of healing...."let it all out" but not much more, because it makes add more drama to it.

you know like you are angry and overwhelmd and say everything in Too Bing words.... and then bause the listener agrees with you pities you and says he understand you, or maybe get frustated himself (if there is a person who did somehting bad to you) thus you go into a lot of negative thinking...and it makes you feel that the situation is worse...

and then you may ACT as if it really is and thus you are actually MAKING it worse.

now, I DON`T SAY that sympathy is always causing all this.
but i think that this is the direciton where it`s going. sort of sitting and crying instead of simply solving the problem.

[Irine]

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_Sky said:
Do you mean receiving sympathy might cause them to fall into self pity? As opposed to receiving empathy?

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

sympathy empathy?

yes you know i didn`t think of it..what is the difference between the 2?

[(JD)]

sym·pa·thy
Pronunciation: 'sim-p&-thE
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -thies
Etymology: Latin sympathia, from Greek sympatheia, from sympathEs having common feelings, sympathetic, from syn- + pathos feelings, emotion, experience -- more at PATHOS
1 a : an affinity, association, or relationship between persons or things wherein whatever affects one similarly affects the other b : mutual or parallel susceptibility or a condition brought about by it c : unity or harmony in action or effect <every part is in complete sympathy with the scheme as a whole -- Edwin Benson>
2 a : inclination to think or feel alike : emotional or intellectual accord <in sympathy with their goals> b : feeling of loyalty : tendency to favor or support <republican sympathies>
3 a : the act or capacity of entering into or sharing the feelings or interests of another b : the feeling or mental state brought about by such sensitivity <have sympathy for the poor>
4 : the correlation existing between bodies capable of communicating their vibrational energy to one another through some medium
synonym see ATTRACTION, PITY

em·pa·thy
Pronunciation: 'em-p&-thE
Function: noun
Etymology: Greek empatheia, literally, passion, from empathEs emotional, from em- + pathos feelings, emotion -- more at PATHOS
1 : the imaginative projection of a subjective state into an object so that the object appears to be infused with it
2 : the action of understanding, being aware of, being sensitive to, and vicariously experiencing the feelings, thoughts, and experience of another of either the past or present without having the feelings, thoughts, and experience fully communicated in an objectively explicit manner; also : the capacity for this

Sympathy does imply some "pity" whereas empathy suggests supportive understanding. I agree that sympathy may feed self pity.

[drclay]

_Sky:

Where did you get all this information? Looked pretty authoritative to me. I went to my empathy section to see if I had it right (according to you) at http://www.psychologicalselfhelp.org.../chap13_8.html

They are two good words. A helper would not continue sympathizing on and on and neither would a good empathizer. Wouldn't they both want to change the focus? The sympathizer would eventually want to get off of the sad, upsetting topic by changing the topic. The empathizer would shift to "it must seem that your thoughts about this are endless, don't you want to think about other things or about how you can get off this topic?

Back to my writing.

drclay

[(JD)]

Sorry, forgot the link: Merriam-Webster online

i agree with you, Dr. Clay. well put........... i believe in "re-direct" even with my grandchildren, as well as my patients. i can only listen so long to the "woe is me" stories and then i always move in with "have you thought of such and such and such, etc. etc.?"........xoxoxo pat

[SeptemberMorn]

Some years ago, I had a very wise psychologist explain the difference between sympathy and empathy, especially amongst people with mental illnesses.

Sympathy = the observer jumps into the hole with the person having a bad time.

Empathy = the observer putting down a ladder or a rope to the person having a bad time.

With both, the observer understand and can feel the bad/sad feelings. There is compassion in both. But if you jump into the hole (sympathy) then both the sufferer and the observer are stuck IN the hole. When you give empathy, you don't jump into the hole with the sufferer but you promote ways to get them out of the hole.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that's what Dr Clay said in different words.

Did I make myself clear? LOL

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drclay said:
_Sky:

Where did you get all this information? Looked pretty authoritative to me. I went to my empathy section to see if I had it right (according to you) at http://www.psychologicalselfhelp.org.../chap13_8.html

They are two good words. A helper would not continue sympathizing on and on and neither would a good empathizer. Wouldn't they both want to change the focus? The sympathizer would eventually want to get off of the sad, upsetting topic by changing the topic. The empathizer would shift to "it must seem that your thoughts about this are endless, don't you want to think about other things or about how you can get off this topic?
Back to my writing.

drclay

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[Irine]

what i meant about sympathy was the same as Emerson wrote:

"Another form of misguided prayer is regretting the past. If there is some action you can take that will help the situation, then take it. Regret comes from a lack of self-discipline.

And sympathy falls into the same category. We sit down and pat the hands of those who bring trouble on themselves instead of speaking the truth boldly "in rough electric shocks" that might jar them out of their fog and self-created illusions and put them in touch with their own powerful soul."