How to bring back passion

I'm not sure if this belongs here or in the relationship section. It seems to me better here? but if not feel free to move it.

Anyway, I have been in a relationship for 4.5 years. For the past 3.5 years, it has been an utterly passionless relationship. She has completely lost all passion for 3.5 years. During that time, sex has happened maybe 3 times? maybe only 2? I honestly don't even remember. There is no passionate kissing, no sensual caressing of bodies, nothing like that. Hugs, hand-holding, pecks on the lips and such are very frequent, however. Just no sex, nothing sexual, nothing that has even the most remote possibility to lead to anything sexual. She has no passion.

Lately that has been resolved by me having sex with other people with her knowledge. She would prefer I not have sex with other people, but I don't hide it from her, and she has accepted it as part of our relationship.

But I'm tired of that arrangement. As strange as it may seem to some guys who might dream about such a situation, I want it to stop and have a sexually monogamous relationship with my girlfriend. Having an endless string of loveless sexual encounters with random women I don't even know while maintaining a sexless love in my relationship has become a situation I can no longer deal with. I need passion, but she is unable to give it.

Then I left her and moved out. I couldn't take it and felt I needed to move on. But she kept calling me and begging me to come back, and the fact is I do love her tremendously, so I did after only a couple days living in a motel. I came back tonight. We talked and she promised to try to work on her lack of passion. but how?

That's my question in this post? How does one attempt to regain passion when they have lost it? She once had it. We were very passionate in the early stages of the relationship. She is clearly capable of passion. neither of us know what steps we should take to try to help her regain the passion even now that she has promised that she is willing to try. A person obviously can't just decide to feel something they don't feel.

and before anyone brings it up, therapy is not an option. She completely refuses to go first of all. But even if that were solved, we live in Korea where mental health is not taken seriously. There are therapists but they are way out of our price range and the health care system covers none of it.

Thanks for any help. I know this was a pretty long post but wanted to give all the background.

HT, I commend you for trying. I have never been in your situation, so I have no "credentials" and am just offering an exercise that, intuitively, seems fitting, and, at any rate, cannot hurt either of you guys.

The exercise is: let her STOP all of that. No friendly hugs, no pecks on the lips (those must be irritating to you if you want normal open mouth kissing but instead get what you aptly called "pecks on the lips"), no hand-holding, no nothing. In other words, either she touches you in the way you want and in the way adults (not children) usually relate when they are a couple, or, she does not touch you at all. Hopefully (no good rationale, it just seems to be worth trying), she will be able to re-focus, re-direct, and re-channel the energy that she puts into "hand-holding" into the kind of passionate self-expression that you are so interested in receiving from her.

I can offer some rationale if you feel like you could try this approach, but won't waste time writing it out until I hear from you, since you might think that it is utterly ridiculous.

I've got a very similar problem with my boyfriend.. If you find a solution - let me know..

Hi. Here is the perspective of a lesbian who has had a similar problem with my girlfriend: We were just not "happening" and we decided that we both needed more distance in order to keep the spark alive. Frankly, at the time we decided to make these changes we had not had sex at all during the prior 3 months. We moved into separate bedrooms, started putting more energy into ourselves as individuals, going out at night and doing different things [taking a class, seeing friends, just hanging out alone in our rooms] and ta-da: We have us some fire now. I think in general you need to replicate your life when you first met and were passionate. Things are going well for my girlfriend and i now.

I hope your woman can find herself again. I think she will find her passion sitting next to her self.
best to you both,
Hopeful Camel

Thanks for the replies.

@hamster - Yes, I have thought the same thing. It's difficult to pull away from physical contact with her without giving her a reason. She just thinks I'm mad at her or something. Should I tell her that is why I am not interested in physical contact? It seems like that would make it seem like manipulation or put pressure on her if she knows why. In general, I have been too submissive to her, I think. I eventually give in to what she wants too easily. It's hard to feel an intense desire for something (someone) you know you already have. Should I sleep on the couch to avoid the inevitable cuddling at night as well?

@Camel - We live together in a studio apartment so we are right next to each other any time we are both home. It's hard to get much separation between us. I go out with my friends sometimes and also have hobbies and interests outside the apartment. She doesn't. I agree some separation might be good, but we occupy a very close space. I'm trying the physical separation, not touching her, but eventually I'm going to have to tell her why. Today she kept trying to hold my hand and I wouldn't do it, so she asks me why and what's wrong but I don't know how to answer that.

High Treason, what if you explain why you want sexually infused physical contact and not hand-holding beforehand, and not whilst she is trying to give you a non-sexual kiss? I think that if you wait for her to try to have a non-sexual, "sanitized" physical contact with you, and you, quite literally, "pull away", then is bound to feel that you are "mad at her or something". So that would be bad, but if you explain the rules of this exercise to her when she is not trying to touch you in a "friendly, brotherly-sisterly way", but in advance, then, maybe, she will understand.

If you sleep on a couch, would she interpret it as your being mad at her?

Props to you, High Treason. I'm a guy and I found out through trial and error that I'm very much the same way when it comes to physical intimacy... i.e. Sex with someone I am close with, care about, involved with, or love: Awesome.
Sex with someone who's little more than a warm body: Not so awesome.
Sigh.

I do like Hamster's recommendation, though.

Has your girlfriend specifically explained why she no longer feels passion in that way?

I am the same way. My H and I have similar but different issues. Zero need for touch on my part, loving and craving touch on my H's part. It causes great issues. I would like to know what some others opinions are to your thread.

There could be a lot of reasons someone loses interest in intimacy. Some of the more obvious are depression or a lot of stress. Depression can make people lose interest in a lot of things they enjoy or even to the point of self care. Some of the signs of that are a person withdrawing from people, even loved ones. Them losing interest in things they used to enjoy. Them having a negative outlook. When it gets really bad, they may stop working, barely eat, lose all motivation for simple things such as personal hygine, sleep excessively or sleep very little. Possible self medicating with drugs or alcohol.

Outside of depression it could be a lack of caring for a partner. Sometimes we get in an unfilling relationship and aren't happy, but we don't want to be alone so we stay even though we now we aren't going to be happy. Maybe this is for monitary reasons, or self esteem, like thinking I can't do any better. The relationship is fulfilling if you and your partner have the same goal, can be open and honest and treat eachother with respect. All of this while moving foward in life and accomplishing personal goals and mutual goals. Such as work, school, having children, mariage. Can you answer the question, "Where does you significant other want to be in 5 years, 10 years, or even next year." Being stuck in a job, or feeling trapped can lead to feeling of boredom and monotony. That can take the joy out of a relationship.

There could also be some type of sexual abuse or trauma. Maybe something you do or do not know about. If she was abused or something like that, then she may have some issues that make her not want to be intimate. For people that struggle with that, sex can make them remember what happened to them or they may even feel digusted by sex, or feel dirty or shameful about it.

I don't think anyone on this forum can tell you why the passion is gone. You are going to have to have a heart to heart with your significant other and figure out what is wrong. Do you give her suprises, unexpected flowers or gifts. Do you have mutual activities or go out on dates? Do you get along, or is there a lot of hostility and anger? You having sex with other women may be giving her feelings of resentment. There could also be the issue of diseases. She may not trust you to be clean and is fearful of picking up something.

My best advice is to try and start talking and digging down deep to find the issues that are causing distress in your relationship.

me too, w hub

prob just be open and honest about what you are attempting to do, maybe?? give a try!

very important question to ask and one she might need to even examine herself!

suggestion: work on yourself, using whatever techniques might work for you. Sorta fake it to make it, it could get better, and I hope it does! Def can relate!

very good idea to attempt that heart to heart, and it may be something you need to do more than once. Can be helpful!

my H was abusive for many years and he says he really didn't know. I kinda believe him. he did things that affected me that he had no idea about. After talking w/ T and him, we are learning to get past that.

Ya never know unless you ask

I have considered depression and even brought it up with her on numerous occasions. She doesn't seem unhappy or mopey or anything. However, she has definitely lost interest in everything except online shopping and playing an online racing game for hours on end. She quit her job and now she never leaves the apartment. She hasn't met any of her friends in years. She will go to visit her father very occasionally because he bugs her about it until she does it. But she doesn't seem unhappy. In fact, she seems very content to just sit at the computer all day and night.

As far as I can tell, her plan for the next ten years is sitting at the computer playing Kartrider.

It would certainly be news to me, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen, I guess. Keep in mind that she was not like this before. Before she met me and for the first year we were together, she went out often with friends, and definitely enjoyed sex.

I would if this is something she wanted, but she just complains that it's a waste of money if I give her anything.

No. She never leaves the apartment.

We get along exceedingly well as long as I don't leave the house. She hates for me to go out, and sometimes that causes some tension if I stay out for a long time, but it doesn't last long. Hardly ever fight or argue.

Her lack of interest in sex long predates my sex with other women. The causation is in the other direction. I would have no reason to have sex with other women if it was available at home.

Great idea if she would actually talk about it, which she won't. Every time I attempt to have any sort of conversation about the issue, she just refuses to have it, gives excuses as to why now is not a "good time" to talk about it, gives stupid reasons for her lack of sex drive ("I've been tired" "I've been sick lately" "What you only care about sex?"). I would like nothing better than to have a rational conversation about it, but I have come to realize that ain't gonna happen. In fact, I feel like an idiot, because it's pretty obvious that her promising to work on the issue was just another empty promise. Nothing has changed. I see no desire in her for anything to change.

Your thread on R&C mentioned financial struggles over and over and over again.

And here you reiterated that therapy is out of your price range. And, that she would object even to tiny gestures of attention that would involve spending money - roses, chocolate...

And yet she

1) quits her job
2) over-shops online.

It does not compute. It just seems totally irrational.

I have reread your last post and think that you, without intending to do so, basically diagnosed her correctly, even though the DX you gave her is not in DSM-IV.

She has lost passion for life.

She had friends - she does not engage with them anymore.
She had a job - she quit the job.
She liked sex - she does not want any sex.
She liked parties - she sits home all day long. She has essentially become a hermit. If she is not depressed, she will be due to lack of sunlight since she does not leave the apartment. That said, loss of interest in activities that used to bring pleasure is a symptom of depression - you do not necessarily need to be mopey. Re-read the DSM on depression and see if she qualifies. Maybe you can impress on her the significance of her dis-engagement from the world and losing all her passion for normal activities.

What does a woman who never leaves the apartment buy online? Clothes? She does not need them. Home decor? Not for a tiny studio. Books? Does she read a lot of books?

Since she seems to have lost all her passion, save for the video game and online shopping, lack of passion for sex seems to be an individual manifestation of a much bigger issue, because what you describe is REALLY unusual - her never leaving the apartment is really unusual. I am afraid that you won't be able to solve the sexual part of the problem in isolation.

Other than by trying substances that have a disinhibiting effect on some people though not all.

The financial struggles are all in her head. I haven't re-read that thread, but if it mentions financial struggles, that's the perception of financial struggles she has invented. We are not rich, but we are getting by. We'd be getting by a lot better if she could keep a damn job for more than 6 months before she has to "take a break" and quits. One of the the larger arguments we have had was this last time she quit her job. I told her I was not willing to be in a relationship with someone who just sits around and does nothing all day. I said it was fine if she wanted to quit her job to accomplish some other goal. But that's not the case. She just quit her job to not have a job. I said back then that I refuse to be in a relationship with a loser and wouldn't stick around if all she wanted to do was sit around doing nothing, but as is apparent, she quit anyway and I didn't leave...

But no we don't have a dire financial situation. It would be nice to be a little better off financially but when is it ever not?

As far as the online shopping, she usually buys things we actually need like toilet paper, groceries, that kind of thing. She sits there all day on shopping sites searching relentlessly for the absolute lowest prices and playing mini-games on the shopping sites to collect coupons.

That is indeed very stupid, considering that she does not run marathons, but gets tired from overusing the internet. She needs to commit to a sleep schedule that would not make her so tired. Plus, getting enough sleep increases immunity, so she won't complain of having been sick lately as much as she currently does.