[MisterSaunders]

Hello all.

22 Year Old male here.

A breif intro - 2 years ago I came down with Pure OCD in the space of a few months. In essence, my life fell apart in a few short weeks. I went to the doctors, and was prescribed Sertraline (brand name Zoloft). After a few months of nothingness, my dose was upped to 100mg, and it has been at that level ever since. Coinciding with this has been a serious alcohol use disorder. I'll make no bones about it, I was drinking whenever I could. Despite being at my final year at a prestigious university, I drank at every available opportunity. I went to work in Italy for the summer, and this trend continued. When I returned, I sought help for my issues, and I came across Naltrexone, and the sinclair method. My GP told me that she would not prescribe it to me, so I got it off the internet. For the past 4 months, my problem has certainly improved - I have had much more control over my drinking, but it hasn't gone away.

Anyway, fast forward to may of this year, and I was about to have a dental implant (oddly enough, for a tooth I had lost in a drunken stupor). As such, I was required to stop smoking, and preferably drinking. I thought I would use this is an experiment, and see what would happen if I gave up all of my 'addictions,' including my Zoloft...

For 2 weeks, I was able to maintain a healthy diet, absent of cravings for sugar, alcohol, or drugs. I exercised daily, and experienced no anxiety. For two weeks, I was the person I was before my OCD episode. This is massive, as I havent been me for years.

Unfortunately, as I am sure most of you know, you shouldn't stop taking SSRI's cold turkey. I knew this anyway, but I didn't care as I never thought it would be forever. The withdrawals kicked in, and I am back where I was.

The reason I am posting is threefold. Firstly, I want to know if anyone else has experienced anything like this during SSRI use? If so, I'd like to hear each and every detail if you have the time to share it with me. I am going to compile some evidence, and take it to my doctor, who will NOT deviate from her medical bible for a second.

Secondly, I need advising with my alcohol use. There is no doubt that in the last year or so, I have displayed signs of alcohol dependancy and abuse. I have read and posted in other forums, such as sober recovery, where I have been vehemently told so embrace lifelong sobriety. I am going to stop drinking for 3 months, while I taper off this drug. Frankly, I have had enough of being dependent on it, as I know I am. With regards to alcohol, I know it isn't wise for anyone who suffers from mental health issues to drink, but aside from this, I feel I have recovered from my OCD. I am 22 years old, and the thought of permanent, life long abstinence is causing me to be anxious. If there is no other way, then abstinent it is, but surely at 22, with no prior addiction issues, there must me another way?

Thirdly, I am posting to raise awareness. Regardless of whether or not I was an alcoholic before this, the damage caused by these SSRI's has been greater than I realised until now. When I walked into that doctors surgery, explaining that I had suicidal thoughts due to OCD, she should have thought 'Here is a prime candidate for substance abuse, I had better not prescribe something that alters serotonin and dopamine levels in his brain, he might just abuse and become dependant on that!'

Seriously, surely anyone with a serious mental health disorder is a prime candidate for substance abuse? Isn't it then elementary that an SSRI could indeed become the abusee, so to speak? I genuinely don't blame my GP, but the fact that I can get a prescription for sertraline, and not for Naltrexone, presents a serious imbalance, and strikes of a greater and deeper moral issue. Why are we willing to prescribe so willingly a psychoactive medication, but blatantly refuse to prescribe an opiate antagonist with NO possible addicting properties?

Answers on an effing postcard.

Yours Sincerely,

A newly awakened cynic harbouring a bitter resentment towards faceless pharmaceutical companies and their narrow minded puppet doctors.

[splitimage]

I had a drinking problem before I ever went on meds, but after I went on Effexor, a SNRI, my drinking rapidly escalated. I later learned when I looked at a detailed list of side effects that developing alcoholism was a rare but possible side effect. Would my drinking have spiraled out of control, without it? Possibly. At this time, I'm more interested in managing the fallout and trying to stay sober, rather than trying to assign blame.

As for your Dr. being unwilling to prescribe Naltrexone, I'm not really surprised. Most GP's are woefully untrained when it comes to addiction. I've even run into reluctance from my psychiatrist to prescribe it, since it wasn't a med he was familiar with. I know many people who have had good success with Naltrexone or other anti-craving meds.

Will you have to give up drinking forever? Can't answer that. For me I know that I can't safely drink I almost died in my last relapse. I do think your idea of taking a few months off from drinking is a good idea, and then see if you can safely follow the low risk drinking guidelines. If you can great. If you can't then abstinance may be the safest route for you to go. And believe me, not drinking is not the end of the world. You can have plenty of fun without alcohol.

splitimage

[MisterSaunders]

Thanks splitimage. I hear you. I'm sorry to hear that you went through Effexor! I had a 2 week interlude on Effexor, and it was awful. Much worse than Sertraline.

With regards to the drinking thing, I am sure that sobriety has its own wonders. I'm not to concerned about that. I have always found disciplined actions like sobriety quite appealing. It's just such a lot to take in at the minute. I'll be able to notch up a few months without drinking for sure, but in all honesty, can I see myself never touching alcohol again? Nope. Not a chance.

My biggest dependancy is this Zoloft. Seriously. I've halved my dose this week, and today, on a beautiful relaxing sunday, I have cried twice, punched a wall, written a 1000 word essay on how much I hate Sertraline, and my reasons for harbouring such resentment - probably to a solid university standard. This is from halving my dose.

I'm going to persevere for sure. I've been given a prescription for Mirtazapine too, which I will not be using - if the absurdity and readiness to hand out psycho-active medications needs highlighting further.

[Altered Moment]

I was a pretty hard core alcoholic and drug addict from the age of 13 until 32. About six months before I went to a drug and alcohol treatment center i went to a psychiatrist and he put me on Effexor. He agreed to treat me with both meds and therapy on the agreement that I go to treatment. He said he could not help me unless I was clean and sober. I had already decided I was going to go so no problem. For a short period of time I was taking Effexor, drinking and doing meth. I do not recommend this. I am probably lucky I didn't have a stroke with the Effexor and the Meth. Genetically I think I have an addictive personality and depression/ bi polar II. To a large degree I was self medicating for my mental illness and to just cope with life in general. For a long time it worked until it didn't work and caused many more problems that it solved. I wish the AD's worked as good. My depression actually got worse for a long time after I got sober.

Anyway for me I think Effexor played a role in helping me get sober. I can't prove it but that is how I feel. Since going to treatment I have been clean a sober for 19 years with a few experimental slips on pot trying it for depression and anxiety. I have been on just about all the SSRI's and SSNRI's in the last 19 years. They have never been that effective for me until the last med change which is currently working quite well so far.....
Overall I think they have helped me or I would not have stayed at it.

The current set of psyche meds are far from miracle drugs. They do however help many people but are only seen as a part of the solution. For many of us it is meds, therapy, and other methods of self help and coping. A good support network is a big part of it.

I do not think of the SSRI's and SSNRI's as addictive at all even though they have bad withdrawals for some people. I have never gotten high off of and AD. I have never felt and urge to take more than prescribed. Withdrawal due to a rebalancing of receptors with SSRI's is different than addiction in my view. I could easily become addicted to pain killers or benzo's if not very careful because those I can get high off of. I have never felt that urge with AD's.

I totally understand that you don't want to take psyche meds. Many people don't. No one should have too. I would point out that alcohol is a psychoactive drug as well, a powerful one.

As far as SSRI withdrawal causing alcoholism I don't think I buy it. I can understand that if someone is having horrible withdrawal effects that they may turn to alcohol for relief but that would not be induced alcoholism.

I would suggest a slower taper if you are having trouble coming off the zoloft.

As far as drinking I think that only you can determine whether you are able to drink in moderation or if total abstinence is right for you. I can say that one of the scariest prospects I ever faced was thinking of a life without alcohol. I couldn't conceive of it for a long time.

I do agree with you that meds are handed out like candy and often as the first line of defense when a much more thorough evaluation is needed and other approaches should be explored. Alcohol and drug use should be one of the first questions asked along with many others. I guess I have been lucky because they have always made me go through a one to two hour evaluation before letting me see a pdoc. I have been through the evals probably six times in my life due to changing insurance or circumstances. I don't agree with someone with problems just going to a pdoc for a half hour and getting on meds. that does not seem responsible to me on the part of the mental health profession. Unfortunately there seems to be a big shortage of professionals.

[MisterSaunders]

Zinco, Love it!

Great response. Genuine experience in the matter. I hope you're doing much better now. I really appreciate you sharing your story with me, and hopefully I can learn plenty from it.

I think for me, I never used my medication as a medication, I abused it. I'd take 2 pills a day, then three, then none for a week, then three again.

As for the alcoholism, I too have my reservations, but since being on Zoloft, I certainly experienced a euphoria that just wasnt there when I drank before. I'm prone to addictive behaviours. I have a propensity to overdo just about everything, including alcohol, but it never used to give me the sky high to come down rollercoaster like half a gram of MDMA did!

I'm glad we agree on the meds being handed out like candy. I've never even seen a psychiatrist. I haven't managed to get referred. I've asked my GP on numerous occasions, and she doesn't think it's necessary - seriously. She just hands me another signed piece of paper and tells me to keep her updated... I have switched GP's since then, though.

[trying2survive]

Originally Posted by MisterSaunders

Hello all.

22 Year Old male here.

A breif intro - 2 years ago I came down with Pure OCD in the space of a few months. In essence, my life fell apart in a few short weeks. I went to the doctors, and was prescribed Sertraline (brand name Zoloft). After a few months of nothingness, my dose was upped to 100mg, and it has been at that level ever since. Coinciding with this has been a serious alcohol use disorder. I'll make no bones about it, I was drinking whenever I could. Despite being at my final year at a prestigious university, I drank at every available opportunity. I went to work in Italy for the summer, and this trend continued. When I returned, I sought help for my issues, and I came across Naltrexone, and the sinclair method. My GP told me that she would not prescribe it to me, so I got it off the internet. For the past 4 months, my problem has certainly improved - I have had much more control over my drinking, but it hasn't gone away.

Anyway, fast forward to may of this year, and I was about to have a dental implant (oddly enough, for a tooth I had lost in a drunken stupor). As such, I was required to stop smoking, and preferably drinking. I thought I would use this is an experiment, and see what would happen if I gave up all of my 'addictions,' including my Zoloft...

For 2 weeks, I was able to maintain a healthy diet, absent of cravings for sugar, alcohol, or drugs. I exercised daily, and experienced no anxiety. For two weeks, I was the person I was before my OCD episode. This is massive, as I havent been me for years.

Unfortunately, as I am sure most of you know, you shouldn't stop taking SSRI's cold turkey. I knew this anyway, but I didn't care as I never thought it would be forever. The withdrawals kicked in, and I am back where I was.

The reason I am posting is threefold. Firstly, I want to know if anyone else has experienced anything like this during SSRI use? If so, I'd like to hear each and every detail if you have the time to share it with me. I am going to compile some evidence, and take it to my doctor, who will NOT deviate from her medical bible for a second.

Secondly, I need advising with my alcohol use. There is no doubt that in the last year or so, I have displayed signs of alcohol dependancy and abuse. I have read and posted in other forums, such as sober recovery, where I have been vehemently told so embrace lifelong sobriety. I am going to stop drinking for 3 months, while I taper off this drug. Frankly, I have had enough of being dependent on it, as I know I am. With regards to alcohol, I know it isn't wise for anyone who suffers from mental health issues to drink, but aside from this, I feel I have recovered from my OCD. I am 22 years old, and the thought of permanent, life long abstinence is causing me to be anxious. If there is no other way, then abstinent it is, but surely at 22, with no prior addiction issues, there must me another way?

Thirdly, I am posting to raise awareness. Regardless of whether or not I was an alcoholic before this, the damage caused by these SSRI's has been greater than I realised until now. When I walked into that doctors surgery, explaining that I had suicidal thoughts due to OCD, she should have thought 'Here is a prime candidate for substance abuse, I had better not prescribe something that alters serotonin and dopamine levels in his brain, he might just abuse and become dependant on that!'

Seriously, surely anyone with a serious mental health disorder is a prime candidate for substance abuse? Isn't it then elementary that an SSRI could indeed become the abusee, so to speak? I genuinely don't blame my GP, but the fact that I can get a prescription for sertraline, and not for Naltrexone, presents a serious imbalance, and strikes of a greater and deeper moral issue. Why are we willing to prescribe so willingly a psychoactive medication, but blatantly refuse to prescribe an opiate antagonist with NO possible addicting properties?

Answers on an effing postcard.

Yours Sincerely,

A newly awakened cynic harbouring a bitter resentment towards faceless pharmaceutical companies and their narrow minded puppet doctors.

i would say be careful with alcohol, it is indeed a slippery slope..some can handle it, others cannot. if you can go long periods of abstinence, you may be okay.

in the end, only you will know the truth. i once went a year and a half without drinking with no ill effects & i used to drink pretty darn hard. now i drink occasionally here and there and every so often i will get drunk( when i do, i stop for a while again) but that's just me..everyone is different, i always enjoyed drinking, but it's not like it used to be now..many of the dangers and consequences outweigh the "fun" for me.

i heard a judge once say "alcohol is cunning,clever and baffling" and he was right, he was saying this to a young girl who had just turned 21 and was receiving her second DUI, "sobering moment" i would think, but i will say it starts with heavy drinking and it can easily spiral out of control.

you have to ask yourself can you stop whenever you want to? how long can you go without it? are you experiencing cravings and such? if so these could be warning signs i would advise you not to take lightly.

what are your reasons/desire to drink..do you feel like you "need" to have a drink? does it "calm your nerves" or "help you cope?" could be trouble, i say be careful, very careful..if not things could end badly & good luck

[MisterSaunders]

Originally Posted by trying2survive

i would say be careful with alcohol, it is indeed a slippery slope..some can handle it, others cannot. if you can go long periods of abstinence, you may be okay.

in the end, only you will know the truth. i once went a year and a half without drinking with no ill effects & i used to drink pretty darn hard. now i drink occasionally here and there and every so often i will get drunk( when i do, i stop for a while again) but that's just me..everyone is different, i always enjoyed drinking, but it's not like it used to be now..many of the dangers and consequences outweigh the "fun" for me.

i heard a judge once say "alcohol is cunning,clever and baffling" and he was right, he was saying this to a young girl who had just turned 21 and was receiving her second DUI, "sobering moment" i would think, but i will say it starts with heavy drinking and it can easily spiral out of control.

you have to ask yourself can you stop whenever you want to? how long can you go without it? are you experiencing cravings and such? if so these could be warning signs i would advise you not to take lightly.

what are your reasons/desire to drink..do you feel like you "need" to have a drink? does it "calm your nerves" or "help you cope?" could be trouble, i say be careful, very careful..if not things could end badly & good luck

Hi there, thanks for that! I really appreciate you sharing your experiences with me.

In all honestly, I don't think I am an alcoholic - many people would say that is denial, but I don't think I am. I have had issues with drinking recently which have coincided with my anti-depressant use, high anxiety and personal problems. I am certainly not going to touch a drop for the foreseeable future - I've committed to 100 days of sobriety, so I am going to follow through with it.

After that, I will see where I'm at - It may be that I wish to continue not drinking!

As for cravings and such, I don't crave alcohol per say, I crave an escape. That's why I am here... I think that I have been self medicating for a long time - alcohol, food, cigarettes, weed etc. My biggest issue now is dealing with this depression that I have fallen into over the course of the past 2 weeks. I guess I won't feel like this forever!