[sabby]

I would like to gently remind everyone that this is a support forum for members who suffer from ASPD, not a forum for members to post in who are ranting against those who are dx'ed with ASPD either on this site, any other site or in real life.

If you are not someone who suffers with ASPD and wish to discuss the relationships with someone in your life who is, please use the Relationships & Communication Forum.

Please remember our posting guidelines for Psych Central that state:

This is, first and foremost, a self-help support community. That means if your message (post or PM) isn't about offering support to another person or asking for it, it's potentially not appropriate for our community.

Thank you for understanding and working within our guidelines to make PC a safer and more supportive site.

With Care,
_sabby_
co-administrator

[racee]

so very true

[Gus1234U]

for me, it can be difficult to define "Support",, is it only the saccarine stroking of the ego? or the positive affirmations of acknowledgement and well wishing ? or can it include the hard questions, of self awareness and social responsibility? do let me know what you think,, Gus

Verb~support:encourage,help,provide,assist,strengthen
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Synonym~reinforcement,hold up,affirm,encourage
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Antonym~negate,make ineffective TY Sabby

[johnf]

I'm not sure any of us are actually looking for support or help but to see what the other aspd people are like.

I disagree...I know of one who is...Nice to meet you

Originally Posted by Gus1234U

for me, it can be difficult to define "Support",, is it only the saccarine stroking of the ego? or the positive affirmations of acknowledgement and well wishing ? or can it include the hard questions, of self awareness and social responsibility? do let me know what you think,, Gus

I believe I addressed this in the "Strange question" thread. Having to wear this mask of sanity day in and day out is a very tedious task, as many of you know. It's a heavy burden to bear and leaves the wearer quite alone. But I must maintain it. Should this mask falter, I'm not met with the kindness of practitioners and neighbors who'd like to treat me and help me cope, but with exile and, in extreme cases, prison. To me, "support" means allowing me to take down this mask from time to time without fear of persecution.

Well done...Thank you Mr. Myers

[FooZe]

Originally Posted by Myers

Having to wear this mask of sanity day in and day out is a very tedious task, as many of you know. It's a heavy burden to bear and leaves the wearer quite alone.

On the other hand, as R.D. Laing put it:

'A man without a mask' is indeed very rare. One even doubts the possibility of such a man. Everyone in some measure wears a mask, and there are many things we do not put ourselves into fully. In 'ordinary' life it seems hardly possible for it to be otherwise.

(The Divided Self, p. 101)

I see it as more like choosing to talk to people in a language they seem likely to understand, and not telling them stuff that's likely to freak them out unless they indicate they're willing to hear it.

It also occurs to me that when you wear a mask, the side of the mask that I see isn't going to be the same as the side that you see. Even though it's your mask, I'm going to perceive it (and whoever's behind it) however I do.

---------- Entering Fool Zero's fantasy ----------
Please watch your step.

Myers (aside): If Fool Zero knew what I'm really thinking behind this facade of normalcy, he'd freak so far out he'd never come down.

FZ (aside): There goes Myers with his scary old psychopath mask on. He doesn't sound all that different from anyone else I know.

---------- Leaving Fool Zero's fantasy ----------
Please watch your step.

[Gus1234U]

lolol Fool Zero, good one,, and Myers,, you know I know,,,,,,,

[pegasus]

Originally Posted by _sabby_

I would like to gently remind everyone that this is a support forum for members who suffer from ASPD, not a forum for members to post in who are ranting against those who are dx'ed with ASPD either on this site, any other site or in real life.

If you are not someone who suffers with ASPD and wish to discuss the relationships with someone in your life who is, please use the Relationships & Communication Forum.

Please remember our posting guidelines for Psych Central that state:


Thank you for understanding and working within our guidelines to make PC a safer and more supportive site.

With Care,
_sabby_
co-administrator

Well, yes I totally understand what you are saying, this is a support forum. I have come in this support forum from time to time to offer advice, I'm not ASPD nor do I have any relative with this diagnosis but I have helped many in real life and previously on PC. I offer help and assistance through out the forum. Does that mean I am not welcome in this forum? Support comes in many forms.

[Omers]

Thanks Pegasus. I have had the same question. Now I am all confused!

Originally Posted by pegasus

Well, yes I totally understand what you are saying, this is a support forum. I have come in this support forum from time to time to offer advice, I'm not ASPD nor do I have any relative with this diagnosis but I have helped many in real life and previously on PC. I offer help and assistance through out the forum. Does that mean I am not welcome in this forum? Support comes in many forms.

Oh, you have helped those with ASPD and psychopathy? Where, when, how? Was it helpful? Are you trained in dealing with antisocials and psychopaths? Say, doctor, what do you recommend? I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place, at the moment, what with how hard it is for a diagnosed psychopath to get a therapist willing to lend a helping hand. I'd really appreciate some advice from someone so knowledgeable in the area.

Originally Posted by Omers

Thanks Pegasus. I have had the same question. And... I admit I reported one of the threads that was closed but it was because of a post from a non-ASPD... Now I am all confused!

Honestly, I enjoy prosocials coming on the forums and engaging in conversation; that is, if said prosocials aren't so easily offended. The discussions held by psychopaths and antisocials, whether that's general conversation or supportive, is typically very triggering (especially considering the lack of emotional understanding antisocials and psychopaths have of the content they're discussing) and often involves situations where they've hurt someone or would like to hurt someone. Some people may have a problem with that. But no antisocial or psychopath is going to be able to get the support they need if they feel like they're walking on eggshells every time they speak.

Fool Zero...

True, everyone has a public persona. They try their hardest to show the best aspects of themselves and to stow away the darker secrets. They try to control how others perceive them.

I take this to another level. I do it in public and in private. I hide everything even from those closest to me.

[FooZe]

Originally Posted by Myers

True, everyone has a public persona. They try their hardest to show the best aspects of themselves and to stow away the darker secrets. They try to control how others perceive them.

I take this to another level. I do it in public and in private. I hide everything even from those closest to me.

Oh, your "other level" was the one I meant all along. I wasn't even thinking so much in terms of selectively emphasizing "best" aspects. I have only so much time to tell about whatever might be going on for me; everyone else has only so much time to listen; whatever I choose to talk about, it's going to take me at least a little time to organize it so that it's comprehensible; and only a little bit of whatever is on my mind is going to be relevant to whatever else we're doing together. For me it's not so much about "good or bad?" as "worth talking about or not?"

By the way, I don't really think of myself as "prosocial"; I just don't seem to have an agenda that calls for going out of my way to do anything particularly "antisocial".

Originally Posted by Fool Zero

Oh, your "other level" was the one I meant all along. I wasn't even thinking so much in terms of selectively emphasizing "best" aspects. I have only so much time to tell about whatever might be going on for me; everyone else has only so much time to listen; whatever I choose to talk about, it's going to take me at least a little time to organize it so that it's comprehensible; and only a little bit of whatever is on my mind is going to be relevant to whatever else we're doing together. For me it's not so much about "good or bad?" as "worth talking about or not?"

By the way, I don't really think of myself as "prosocial"; I just don't seem to have an agenda that calls for going out of my way to do anything particularly "antisocial".

I think we have different types of masks...

[pegasus]

Originally Posted by Myers

Oh, you have helped those with ASPD and psychopathy? Where, when, how? Was it helpful? Are you trained in dealing with antisocials and psychopaths? Say, doctor, what do you recommend? I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place, at the moment, what with how hard it is for a diagnosed psychopath to get a therapist willing to lend a helping hand. I'd really appreciate some advice from someone so knowledgeable in the area.

I'm happy to help in any forum Myers and yes I have helped many people with many different diagnosis but I don't think it's appropriate to be listing my credentials here.

I will say that therapy for ASP's is NOT all hugs and kisses and change can be hard. This was my point, we don't restrict any other forum to diagnosed people only and I don't think it would truly be helpful to restrict to only ASP's here. Obviously it is not helpful to have people in here only to be abusive, that's not the point of these forums at all.

How will it be inappropriate in any form whatsoever to list credentials?I'm sorry I don't understand.If one is qualified and experienced in a subject,what harm is there in saying,,,well....my info comes from this teaching,schooling,or experience.I'd like to hear too?TY ~WO.olf

[pegasus]

Originally Posted by wolfsong

How will it be inappropriate in any form whatsoever to list credentials?I'm sorry I don't understand.If one is qualified and experienced in a subject,what harm is there in saying,,,well....my info comes from this teaching,schooling,or experience.I'd like to hear too?TY ~WO.olf

It's off topic and not appropriate to the thread. If you really are interested then PM me!

Please don't shout hun...just a question.....

Originally Posted by pegasus

I'm happy to help in any forum Myers and yes I have helped many people with many different diagnosis but I don't think it's appropriate to be listing my credentials here.

I will say that therapy for ASP's is NOT all hugs and kisses and change can be hard. This was my point, we don't restrict any other forum to diagnosed people only and I don't think it would truly be helpful to restrict to only ASP's here. Obviously it is not helpful to have people in here only to be abusive, that's not the point of these forums at all.

I'm well aware that the therapy for antisocials is not all "hugs and kisses" and that change can be hard, doctor. What would you recommend, specifically? And I'm not talking about the forums in that respect. I'm asking about actual therapy. You see, all of my attempts to change have proved futile, and this seems to be the case for many antisocials and psychopaths. As a matter of fact, many researchers believe that therapy only makes psychopaths worse. But, since you've helped antisocials and psychopaths, maybe you could shed some light on how you went about it. I'm sure many experts in the field would truly appreciate it. I would too. So... which tests do you prefer when assessing a potential antisocial or psychopath? How do you cope with the manipulation and lies, especially when going over the test results? Are you trained in using the PCL-R? How would you treat primary and secondary psychopaths differently? What methods of therapy do you prefer when dealing with such patients? Do/did you work in the prison, or were your patients court ordered? Etc...

Regarding the forum, no one ever said that the ASPD forum should be reserved for antisocials and psychopaths only. However, those prosocials should be wary when entering the ASPD forum, as antisocials and psychopaths tend to engage in discussions that are very triggering. Also, those prosocials should not come into the forums only to discuss how utterly horrid and vile antisocials and psychopaths are. It's not very polite.

[pegasus]

Originally Posted by Myers

Also, those prosocials should not come into the forums only to discuss how utterly horrid and vile antisocials and psychopaths are. It's not very polite.

I totally agree with your above statement because I feel every human being is a human being, not a label.

As for your questions aimed at me, I do not use the Doctor title though I have many doctoral level certificates in clinical psychology I prefer not to blow my own trumpet.

No I don't do testing or work in the prison system, I only work with people who want to change, that is those people who manage to stay out of the prison system and in society.

If you have further questions maybe we could have another thread started, provided I am allowed in this forum, and provided you would like support from me?

Best,

People who have run into the prison system are those which are most needy of council...assists and therapy.Good people go to prison if they err on the wrong side of the law..(And I guaruntee you there are "Good people"...who are as faulty and never get caught)..in fact as I stated in another portion of forum ...the prison system is the new mental health hospital.If a person is within the jails or prison system at a juncture of life ...this denotes a ping of impossibility with regard to rehab?I disagree as I have a son with paranoid schizophrenia.While he remained beneath the age of 18 I was legally able to require him to go to hospital...ect. Once he rose above the age...I no longer had that power..'so to speak' .That is a standing universal break in the chain of psychiatric care laws.As well...borderlines and schizophrenics and bipolars may not want or know they want help...yet it does not disqualify them from the basic issue that it is those who are ill which require a doctor.And further I must say...within the psychiatric/therapeutic community...there is a sense of laughing behind a patients back with the opinion...these are incurable patients.If 'mentally ill' to boot....all the more so.....they are in need of assists.Did you know that psychiatric hospitals all over the country were simply shut down...pouring the mentally ill out onto the streets to fend for selves?If the psychiatric professional community realizes that these grave illness are not due to choice...that in itself says..."They are ill"....That is the basis for the requirement of a doctor it it not?

Originally Posted by pegasus

If you have further questions maybe we could have another thread started, provided I am allowed in this forum, and provided you would like support from me?

Best,

Very well. http://forums.psychcentral.com/showt...29#post1628429

[sabby]

Thank so much for the conversation on this thread. I'm sorry I hadn't gotten back to this before now (holidays you know LOL).

To answer the main question about who should or shouldn't be posting in this forum...... Any member of PC is welcome to post in any forum as long as the posting is within guidelines.

It would not be supportive of those members dx'ed with depression for someone to post they don't believe in depression and it's something people need to just "get over it". That of course would be unsupportive of those suffering with depression. Also unsupportive would be for members to come here and rant about their family member or past experience with an ASP. That would be better suited to posting in the relationship forum. Coming here to the ASP forum should be welcoming to members dx'ed with ASP, a place like Myers said, where they can come and feel comfortable and not have to worry about stepping on someone's toes etc, as long as the posting is within our community guidelines.

Now, if someone was looking for information on ASP in regards to their own dx or in dealing with ASP and it is done respectfully, there is nothing wrong with that either.

I hope that clears up any questions ya'll have. If not, please feel free to let me know.