[AllyIsHopeful]

My pDoc suspects I am Manic Depressive, but my therapist has never thought I have any form of bipolar. She said if she did ever suspect it, she would consider it "rapid cycling" because my mental state changes very quickly. It's not like full-blown anger, mania or hysterics, or anything of the sort; but I have definite highs and lows that change quickly. I was reading that studies have shown Lamictal to be very helpful for rapid cycling bipolar. Does anyone else have experience with this diagnosis? Either individually or with a close friend or relative?

I'd appreciate any explanations, knowledge, and advice. Thanks!

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[ginaaa22]

have you looked at BPD- Borderline personality disorder. BPD patients cycle rapidly...within minutes to hours...rarely days or weeks like with bipolar. I was dx with bipolar NOS first but I dont really think I'm bipolar because I have never had true mania. my symptoms fit with BPD more. Usually meds wont help BPD. Maybe some anxiety meds...You need therapy.

[r010159]

I have rapid changes is mood, up and down and up and down. I am on Lamictal. It still can happen but it is manageable now, and does not happen as often.

Lamictal is known to be a prophylaxis that is taken to help prevent cycling. It also has antidepressant properties. The studies on rapid cycling are positive but IMO not enough to tell for certain its efficacy (reliability) with people who have this problem.

Like the other posted mentioned, rapid changes in mood is also a symptom of BPD. I think therapy can help in this situation.

[TheatreKid]

Rapid cycling is defined as 4 or more episodes in a YEAR. That's any type of episode, mania, hypomania, depression, mixed. I technically fit that description of rapid cycling, I tend to get a couple of depressions, a couple of hypo and manic episodes a year, but they last at least 3 weeks (manic) to a couple of months (depression).

There's ultradian cycling, which is when you cycle much faster. If you're not experiencing anything "full blown" it could be Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD).

[crazycatlady_83]

I'm diagnosed with rapid cycling, but my moods on their own never last more than a few days. Usually when I'm depressed, it's only for a day or two and then I'm starting to feel better.

I take Geodon and Lamictal, though I just decreased on the latter because I felt it was making me manic. My pdoc prescribed it to me to use like an antidepressant, and those tend to make me too up and manic. I've had good results on Geodon, though too much made me "flat", with no real personality. It also caused me to lose weight, which is a nice change from Seroquel which made me gain about 30lbs. I lost all of that plus extra baby weight from my first pregnancy in little time on Geodon.

[kiwehhh]

I'm also diagnosed with rapid cycling, but Geodon was terrible. It got me out of an incredibly manic episode but then sent me into one of the worst depressions of my life. I've found much more stability with a low dose of lithium and a good dose of Wellbutrin daily.

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[AllyIsHopeful]

Originally Posted by ginaaa22

have you looked at BPD- Borderline personality disorder. BPD patients cycle rapidly...within minutes to hours...rarely days or weeks like with bipolar. I was dx with bipolar NOS first but I dont really think I'm bipolar because I have never had true mania. my symptoms fit with BPD more. Usually meds wont help BPD. Maybe some anxiety meds...You need therapy.

Thanks, I've been in therapy for a year and also have seen a psychiatrist for 8 months. I was the most stable and happy when I was on Lamictal for a month or two, but stopped it because I'm young and stupid and drinking alcohol and partying was more important. I've done psychological testing and actually tested really low for BPD and have maybe 2 of the criteria for the disorder. My moods only switch between depression and feeling semi-normal and it stays that way for a week or so.

I am the furthest possible from black and white thinking and I don't attach to people easily. In the year I've seen my therapist she has not seen those traits in me, and she allows personal contact with her. Just wanted to clarify I would not be devastated if I had a BPD diagnosis, but I know I don't.

Rapid cycling bipolar really does exist and different types of meds help different types of bipolar.

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[AllyIsHopeful]

Originally Posted by TheatreKid

Rapid cycling is defined as 4 or more episodes in a YEAR. That's any type of episode, mania, hypomania, depression, mixed. I technically fit that description of rapid cycling, I tend to get a couple of depressions, a couple of hypo and manic episodes a year, but they last at least 3 weeks (manic) to a couple of months (depression).

There's ultradian cycling, which is when you cycle much faster. If you're not experiencing anything "full blown" it could be Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD).

The only thing full blown is my depression. I am mostly depressed and was diagnosed with GAD and MDD combined by previous docs. The doc I have now swears I am bipolar though.

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[AllyIsHopeful]

I had an allergic reaction to Lithium and was switched to Depakote. My family has witnessed my depression worsen slowly ever since. I'm so low now I can't even apply for work.

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[AllyIsHopeful]

I actually really wanted it to be BPD so badly for a while so I could just know what the hell it is I need to do to feel better. I've spent time reading stories and threads on the personality place forum and none of it resonates with me.

Whatever it is, this depression is debilitating.

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[Hedwig3.0]

I was hospitalized with rapid cycling. I went from laughing to crying to laughing in 5 minutes, for hours.

I have been told the prognosis for rapid cyclers is not great , but I am doing ok now.

[AllyIsHopeful]

Originally Posted by Hedwig3.0

I was hospitalized with rapid cycling. I went from laughing to crying to laughing in 5 minutes, for hours.

I have been told the prognosis for rapid cyclers is not great , but I am doing ok now.

Wow that's intense! I'm glad you are doing okay now. The only time I've had episodes like that is when I was coming off of Effexor. That stuff is insane.

[ceejae]

Originally Posted by r010159

I have rapid changes is mood, up and down and up and down. I am on Lamictal. It still can happen but it is manageable now, and does not happen as often.

This is basically what I was going to say. I feel it helps.

[robosuplex]

Originally Posted by ceejae

This is basically what I was going to say. I feel it helps.

What dose are you guys taking of Lamictal? I'm trying to get up to an effective dose but it's made the rapid cycling worse in the meantime. I also had to pause at 50 for a month and a half for various reasons.

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I'm a rapid-cycling, mixed-state bipolar and while I know Lamictal is very helpful for many people, I had a very bad experience with it. It acted like a mood enhancer, not a mood stabilizer - but not positive moods...just negative ones (anxiety/agitation/depression). I survived 7 weeks on the stuff, then got a mild rash and that was the end of the Lamictal.

[r010159]

Originally Posted by robosuplex

What dose are you guys taking of Lamictal? I'm trying to get up to an effective dose but it's made the rapid cycling worse in the meantime. I also had to pause at 50 for a month and a half for various reasons.

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I am taking 300mg per day.

[r010159]

Originally Posted by crazycatlady_83

I'm diagnosed with rapid cycling, but my moods on their own never last more than a few days. Usually when I'm depressed, it's only for a day or two and then I'm starting to feel better.

I take Geodon and Lamictal, though I just decreased on the latter because I felt it was making me manic. My pdoc prescribed it to me to use like an antidepressant, and those tend to make me too up and manic. I've had good results on Geodon, though too much made me "flat", with no real personality. It also caused me to lose weight, which is a nice change from Seroquel which made me gain about 30lbs. I lost all of that plus extra baby weight from my first pregnancy in little time on Geodon.

ADs, in particular SSRIs, are known to cause mania in BP individuals. But Lamictal is not an antidepressant. Neither is Risperdone. But both are known to have antidepressant properties. This is the type of medication that pdocs use for depression in BP people instead of ADs. IMHO FWIW

PS: I understand Abilify may be different as a third generation AP.

[AllyIsHopeful]

Originally Posted by robosuplex

What dose are you guys taking of Lamictal? I'm trying to get up to an effective dose but it's made the rapid cycling worse in the meantime. I also had to pause at 50 for a month and a half for various reasons.

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When I took it, the highest I got up to was 100mg. That's when it really started helping. 75mg worked pretty well also.


-Ally

[Flummixed]

I take 150mg of Lamictal twice a day and I really can't say either way if it helps that much or not. I can say that I never noticed any side effects from it at all so if it's not doing anything good at least it's not doing anything bad. As far as rapid cycling goes I swing from depression to mania every few weeks or so. I find my manic episodes to be exhausting from dealing with my spontaneous spending and the damage control for how I've behaved. It's better then it was when I wasn't medicated.

[outlaw sammy]

BE VERY CAREFUL! Self diagnosis is a fool's venture. Your psychiatrist or psychologist Ph.D are the ONLY ones qualified to diagnose your condition(s), and only your pdoc can prescribe the "best fit" psychotropic medications for treatment. Trying to diagnose yourselves or decide your own treatment(s) is like doing your own dental surgery.

[LoneLabRat]

Originally Posted by r010159

ADs, in particular SSRIs, are known to cause mania in BP individuals.

That must be why paxil put me in a constant manic state or I should say hypomanic.

[wilarimer]

I cycle every 3-4 weeks. I will be depressed for the entire 3 weeks. The "upswing" starts pretty high, then after about a week I feel good. You're just the first person who I've heard have a similar timeline.

[AllyIsHopeful]

Originally Posted by outlaw sammy

BE VERY CAREFUL! Self diagnosis is a fool's venture. Your psychiatrist or psychologist Ph.D are the ONLY ones qualified to diagnose your condition(s), and only your pdoc can prescribe the "best fit" psychotropic medications for treatment. Trying to diagnose yourselves or decide your own treatment(s) is like doing your own dental surgery.

Who said I was trying to diagnose myself? All I said is my current med regimen is crap and not helping, but recall feeling better when I was on Lamictal. I would be more of a fool to continue something that I am sure is not working. And I beg to differ...Psychiatrists don't always get it right. He only sees the mood I'm exhibiting when I'm with him and has no idea how I am the other 98% of the time.

It's a good thing to read psychology journals and professional articles and studies to fully understand, based on results, if a medication is really right for me. It would be inane to think I did not play a role in the decision of what I'm putting into my body. If my psychiatrist disagrees with me, he won't prescribe it, plain and simple.

-Ally

[AllyIsHopeful]

........,,.

[TheatreKid]

In your second post you say your moods switch from depression to semi-normal. That doesn't meet the criteria for bipolar disorder. Have you looked at atypical depression? It's different from major depression in that there is reactivity to events (ie you can feel better for a little while in response to an event or trigger).

I would imagine Lamictal would have a benefit on depression in general, since it has a reputation for being good with bipolar depression.

There's also cyclothymia: Cyclothymia (Cyclothymic Disorder) Symptoms, Treatments, Causes, and More