[Gareth Monkton]

Hello
I was watching s great documentary by British comedian, actor and author, Stephen Fry. It can be seen on youtube and is called Stephen Fry : The Secret Life of a Manic Depressant.

In the documentary he explains that although he was from a wealthy family in his late teens he had a loss of impulse control and stole credit cards off friends and family. Then he went on big shopping sprees.

He is just one of many examples of hiterto honest, reliable people, a good citizen, who did something criminal without needing to.

Do the symptoms of bipolar, such a loss of any sense of reality, lack of impulse control, a tital lack of judgement etc cause the person to do immoral, inappropriate and even illegal thins or is it the person's character or personalit ?

[LDB1]

IMHO Bipolar doesn't make people criminals. Criminal behavior is a separate issue from BP.

[Hexagram]

Gareth,

Thanks for letting us know that this documentary is available on YouTube.

[CANDC]

It is not cause and effect. Bipolar does not cause behavior - the person has a will and does not have to give in to the impulses. Many people react in different ways.

[Gareth Monkton]

Originally Posted by CANDC

It is not cause and effect. Bipolar does not cause behavior - the person has a will and does not have to give in to the impulses. Many people react in different ways.

But if that person is psychotic, hallucinogenic even suicidal, surely it is more difficult to overcome the impulse ?

I really think it depends on the individual and what lines they are willing to cross being led by their exaggerated instincts run a muck. I've crossd a line and did get to felonies over using drugs, led by my obsessive mind on addictions. But cold blooded murder is not my bag. I'm not that a good person because I've shoplifted to satisfy a need to own when I couldn't afford. I'm a bad person, but not an evil person.

[bluemountains]

I am not sure that bipolar can change a person into a criminal; however, I can understand that the thrill of stealing and getting away with the crime could be similar to other highs and out of control behaviors that those of us with bipolar sometimes experience.
Bluemountains

[Crazy Hitch]

Hi Gareth,

Thanks for asking.

Interesting question.

I'm sure there would be different opinions on this one.

Take care.

[fingers1]

quote=Gareth Monkton;4291727]But if that person is psychotic, hallucinogenic even suicidal, surely it is more difficult to overcome the impulse ?[/quote]

Yes I believe it does !

A friend of a friend who seems a totally nice person when psychotic and believing that aliens had landed on the planet started to try to recruit others
to join his army to stop the alien invasion. He also went into the local bank
and held them up demanding they hand over the money, he then went into the pub next door and bought everyone a drink. when the police turned up
he was arrested but was never charged because of his Bipolar condition.

This condition causes people to do some very strange things.

fingers1

[Wander]

I have had a substance abuse problem in the past but I am not sure if it is separate or related to the bipolar. I have also had episodes of road rage and reckless driving. Thankfully I have avoided being caught by the police but that is more due to luck. As I grow older things have calmed down.

[Becoming]

I guess it depends on the person. If he had an interest in stealing, because Bipolar can make you impulsive, I could understand why he did everything. However, he likely would have still had an initial interest in stealing perhaps before he was even Manic. So the impulse, the action, and even the phase/episode can all be very different.

Bipolar can certainly cause people to do things they normally wouldn't. So I'd answer a maybe to this one I suppose.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Gareth Monkton]

Irrational Behavior :: Minnesota Law & Politics

[quasicrystalline]

I think of it the same way alcohol makes people do things they normally wouldn't do. Mania also lowers your inhibitions, which is why alcohol and mania don't mix.
*trigger warning* Not sure if it needs it, but just to be on the safe side...

Some people say they would have never raped someone if they weren't under the influence, but I firmly believe that alcohol simply makes people more likely to act on things they already have the capacity to do. I think mania operates in the same way.

I guess, I could see severe, severe mania being somewhat of a wildcard, but for the most part, I think mania just lowers your inhibitions the same way substances do, which again, is why mania and substances DO NOT MIX.

[Tucson]

Situational ethics is a slippery slope that I try to avoid. BTW I like the comparison of mania to the use of alcohol.

[Fox0r]

Bipolar can make people break the law. I became obsessed with definitions of words, so much so that I tried to circumvent the law, and believed I was an Illuminati puppet above the law. I ended up in jail for 4.5 months. I have never been a criminal before my illness.

I think if you are a criminal to begin with, bipolar will turn you into more of a criminal.

[Mrs. Mania]

I believe it does. All crimes I committed were during severe manic episodes. Shoplifting and my favorite...vandalism! I vandalized last in October. I love it! I take pride on making the newspaper and tv news.

That would be the grandiosity.

Mental Illness in and of itself does not cause anyone to break the law.

Nice word ValentinaVVV

Anyway, as I personally see it:

Being we are in a BP thread, and it is something I know about, let's use BP as an example.

When we are in our "off" states, we look for ways to help us feel better. Those of us that have healthy cognitive interventions, and know how to keep an eye on our cycles, seek out healthy ways to circumvent the "poor me feelings" that seem to so often lead to unhealthy behavior.

Then some just don't know how, won't go to therapy, and feel they can justify what they were doing because "I am BP".

No, BP does not make you a criminal. It's the unhealthy thoughts and feelings that are not dealt with that lead you down a path of criminal behavior. At anytime, up until you actually commit the crime/do the unhealthy behavior, you can choose not to do so. It is your choice to follow through.

[fingers1]

Originally Posted by TopherLee

Mental Illness in and of itself does not cause anyone to break the law.

Nice word ValentinaVVV

Anyway, as I personally see it:

Being we are in a BP thread, and it is something I know about, let's use BP as an example.

When we are in our "off" states, we look for ways to help us feel better. Those of us that have healthy cognitive interventions, and know how to keep an eye on our cycles, seek out healthy ways to circumvent the "poor me feelings" that seem to so often lead to unhealthy behavior.

Then some just don't know how, won't go to therapy, and feel they can justify what they were doing because "I am BP".

No, BP does not make you a criminal. It's the unhealthy thoughts and feelings that are not dealt with that lead you down a path of criminal behavior. At anytime, up until you actually commit the crime/do the unhealthy behavior, you can choose not to do so. It is your choice to follow through.

Hi Topherlee !

Can I ask if you have ever had a bought of full blown pshycosis.
if you have then you will surely know that rational thought is not possible
at these times. Why do you think that we are often labelled as crazy ?
because Bipolar can cause us to do things we normally would not do.

sorry to disagree with you mate !

fingers1

[Fox0r]

Originally Posted by TopherLee

Mental Illness in and of itself does not cause anyone to break the law.

Nice word ValentinaVVV

Anyway, as I personally see it:

Being we are in a BP thread, and it is something I know about, let's use BP as an example.

When we are in our "off" states, we look for ways to help us feel better. Those of us that have healthy cognitive interventions, and know how to keep an eye on our cycles, seek out healthy ways to circumvent the "poor me feelings" that seem to so often lead to unhealthy behavior.

Then some just don't know how, won't go to therapy, and feel they can justify what they were doing because "I am BP".

No, BP does not make you a criminal. It's the unhealthy thoughts and feelings that are not dealt with that lead you down a path of criminal behavior. At anytime, up until you actually commit the crime/do the unhealthy behavior, you can choose not to do so. It is your choice to follow through.

When I was psychotic, I became irrational. When I became irrational, I started believing I was God and that the law didn't apply to me. When your ability to choose is impaired, there's a problem.

[Crazy Hitch]

Here's my selfie:

[Tucson]

Originally Posted by fingers1

Hi Topherlee !

Can I ask if you have ever had a bought of full blown pshycosis.
if you have then you will surely know that rational thought is not possible
at these times. Why do you think that we are often labelled as crazy ?
because Bipolar can cause us to do things we normally would not do.

sorry to disagree with you mate !

fingers1

Having BP does not mean you are psychotic. Being psychotic does not mean you are BP.. But those that are psychotic would not be in touch with reality. Agreed. So I understand what you are saying. People with psychosis *irrespective* of whether they are BP or not should be given special consideration.

But does this adequately explain all with BP who commit criminal acts? I think this is the more useful question. FWIW

[Wander]

I must admit I do get a bit of road rage when manic or mixed. Thankfully so far it hasn't caused any major incidents or traffic infringements but I would get out of my way if you are sharing the road with me

This is becoming an interesting conversation.

As this was a generalized question about a condition that has many facets, it is impossible to pinpoint a "yes or no" answer.

As what I posted is MY generalized opinion, let me expand.

I agree with one post. If you are predisposed, for whatever reason, to criminal behavior, I won't deny that dealing with bipolar will make it more difficult to keep yourself in check.

So, let's ask this:

If one feels that bipolar is contributing to criminal behavior, what led to the criminal behavior in the first place?

1. Is one in a Manic State? Is that person feeling "King of the World" with thinking "No one can stop me" despite knowing the act is criminal? Is one making a choice to ignore that warning of "this isn't right" or does that person really not understand at the time that what they are doing is wrong?

2. Is one in a Depressive State? Are they just so far down in their depression that they don't care if they get caught or not? Are they doing it looking for a way to feel better about themselves?

3. A comment was brought up about psychosis. AS I UNDERSTAND IT, Bipolar Psychosis can cause a break with reality. I am not condoning criminal activity in this state, but I can see how this break with reality can contribute as one may not even realize what they are doing is wrong.

So, I guess it depends, IMO, on the actual state. Is one performing criminal activity without regard for realizing what they are doing is wrong, but continuing anyway, or are they in full blown psychosis and just do not realize it.