[philopsychology]

My psychiatrist diagnosed me with bipolar depression and told me that it is normal for you to feel worse at first before feeling better on medicine? Idk if it is all in my head but i just started latuda 2 days ago and i feel extra crummy and was wondering if this is true and if so, why that would be the case? Also I should mention when I say I feel worse I mean I feel more anxious (I already have social anxiety so I'm pretty anxious to begin with), more easily upset, and less likely to care about others (including animals) and have the ability to empathize. Each time I had been on SSRIs back when I was diagnosed with social anxiety but no bipolar I would end up feeling this way and sometimes even suicidal. When I first got diagnosed with Bipolar I was put on Lithium and it was a nightmare! Anyways the only med that has ever made me not feel nuts so far is lexapro as far as I know (I am currently still on it). I just hate these feelings, they remind me of back when I was a kid and was out of control when I got angry and was in general just a miserable child. Idk I guess I'm just scared to go back.

Yes, meds often make me feel worse before better due to side effects. Stomach distress is horrible and almost every med I've tried has caused it. That really brings me down and close to the toilet. I've gotten increased anxiety as well. Most side effects dwindle in time but discussing them with your doctor is probably a good idea. I hope you feel better soon.

[still_crazy]

Latuda (as you know...) is a newer antipsychotic/neuroleptic/tranquilizer. --All-- of these drugs carry serious risks, the big and most obvious one being tardive dyskinesia, a movement disorder. TD rates are lower with the newer drugs, but it still happens. Sometimes TD shows up when an antipsychotic/neuroleptic/tranquilizer is tapered and discontinued. That's called "withdrawal-emergent tardive dyskinesia." This happens because drugs that cause TD can also mask the signs of TD, at least for a while.

I dunno. Antipsychotics/neuroleptic/tranquilizers tend to flatten people out. They're used by vets to make some animals more managable, they're used on out of control kids+teenagers ("conduct disorder," "Oppositional defiant disorder," etc.), and they're used in injection form for agitation. So..

If you're feeling kinda flattened out, that's not really a "side effect;" that's what tranquilizers do. Lexapro is an ssri that can also flatten people out. SSRI and SNRI drugs, more so than some other options for depression, are kind of like...emotional novacaine. They tend to cause varying degrees of numbing and apathy.

I'm not trying to question your prescriber (too much...), but neuroleptics are very serious drugs. Latuda is also very expensive, and there's not very much data on it, especially long term data. In addition to tardive dyskinesia, there's also: akathisia, tardive akathisia, and sometimes tardive dementia from these drugs. Tardive dementia is the one that scares me (I take abilify)...it results in measurable loss of IQ and other cognitive problems, and it often occurs with tardive dyskinesia and/or tardive akathisia.

Now that I've scared you...are you sure you need a neuroleptic? I take a big dose of Abilify because I've had psychotic mania and I'm prone mostly to psychotic depression. A long term tranquilizer is a good idea, and Abilify is "cleaner" than a lot of other options, so...yeah. Plus, Abilify is now generic.

I take an antidepressant (Wellbutrin), but I've been avoiding SSRI drugs. SSRI+neuroleptic (for me)=no emotions. Either one alone is bad enough...add them together, things can get rough (for me).

Sorry this is happening. I'm not trying to scare you or anything, just saying...I think you may have other options (drug and non-drug) that you might want to talk a doctor about.

[philopsychology]

Originally Posted by still_crazy

Latuda (as you know...) is a newer antipsychotic/neuroleptic/tranquilizer. --All-- of these drugs carry serious risks, the big and most obvious one being tardive dyskinesia, a movement disorder. TD rates are lower with the newer drugs, but it still happens. Sometimes TD shows up when an antipsychotic/neuroleptic/tranquilizer is tapered and discontinued. That's called "withdrawal-emergent tardive dyskinesia." This happens because drugs that cause TD can also mask the signs of TD, at least for a while.

I dunno. Antipsychotics/neuroleptic/tranquilizers tend to flatten people out. They're used by vets to make some animals more managable, they're used on out of control kids+teenagers ("conduct disorder," "Oppositional defiant disorder," etc.), and they're used in injection form for agitation. So..

If you're feeling kinda flattened out, that's not really a "side effect;" that's what tranquilizers do. Lexapro is an ssri that can also flatten people out. SSRI and SNRI drugs, more so than some other options for depression, are kind of like...emotional novacaine. They tend to cause varying degrees of numbing and apathy.

I'm not trying to question your prescriber (too much...), but neuroleptics are very serious drugs. Latuda is also very expensive, and there's not very much data on it, especially long term data. In addition to tardive dyskinesia, there's also: akathisia, tardive akathisia, and sometimes tardive dementia from these drugs. Tardive dementia is the one that scares me (I take abilify)...it results in measurable loss of IQ and other cognitive problems, and it often occurs with tardive dyskinesia and/or tardive akathisia.

Now that I've scared you...are you sure you need a neuroleptic? I take a big dose of Abilify because I've had psychotic mania and I'm prone mostly to psychotic depression. A long term tranquilizer is a good idea, and Abilify is "cleaner" than a lot of other options, so...yeah. Plus, Abilify is now generic.

I take an antidepressant (Wellbutrin), but I've been avoiding SSRI drugs. SSRI+neuroleptic (for me)=no emotions. Either one alone is bad enough...add them together, things can get rough (for me).

Sorry this is happening. I'm not trying to scare you or anything, just saying...I think you may have other options (drug and non-drug) that you might want to talk a doctor about.

Idk anything about Latuda because I haven't researched it yet other than that it is expensive but my psychiatrist gave me free samples until i see him again so i decided i would just go with it. As far as if I'm sure I need a neuroleptic, idk? I'm not a psychiatrist that's why I go to one. I know I need help though. I definitely need a medicine that will help me cope in life because i have been diagnosed with major depression, bipolar, and social anxiety disorder. It's a lot to swallow and I can't keep living this way.

[still_crazy]

Latuda is new, and psychiatrists love prescribing new drugs. I don't know what the deal is, honestly.

What do --you-- think your problems are? Forget about the labels. Just think about it for a minute...what do you think your problems are, and what do you want from the pills?

There's only so much pills can do. If you hear voices and/or get paranoid, Latuda and other antipsychotics can helps with that. If you get full blown mania, there are drugs that can treat that and either prevent it from happening again or reduce the likelihood that it will happen again.

Depression is harder to treat. Even if a given drug helps, you may still be somewhat depressed, plus you're dealing with adverse effects. Mild to moderate depression doesn't responds as well to drugs as more severe depression. My depression responds to drugs because I get severe, psychotic depression. For me and some other people, the costs of the drugs and the side effects are better than not taking the drugs. You may or may not be one of those people.

Why do you think you have social anxiety disorder? I was diagnosed with social anxiety disorder. Now, I realize: I was awkward, queer, and got picked on because I was from a working class family in the Honors and Gifted classes, surrounded by kids from upper middle and upper class families. I was easy pickins', and that--day in, day out, for years--set the stage for a lot of my problems.

Drugs always have adverse effects. Drugs are toxins. Some are more toxic than others. Antipsychotics are dangerous. They can cause NMS, which is neuroleptic malignancy syndrome. That's when you get a high fever, rigid muscles, and you might die. Its relatively rare, but it does happen, usually within the first 2 weeks of treatment.

Antidepressants aren't usually that toxic. There's some indication that taking an antidepressant long term can make depression chronic and more severe, so you'll end up needing the drugs for a longer time, maybe indefinitely. Some people who take antidepressants end up diagnosed with "Bipolar Disorder." This happens more frequently than with people who do not take the antidepressants.

I don't have any answers for you, I'm just trying to get you to ask yourself some questions. One reason I need the drugs is because I took the drugs at a young age, because I thought that was the solution and that's what the "experts" told me would solve the problems. Now, I have a diagnosis of "Bipolar I" and I require drugs daily.

Hope this helps. Just because a psychiatrist is an MD doesn't mean they'll help you. In fact, they may not even care if they help your or harm you. A lot of them don't, honestly. Trust me on that one. I don't know if its intentional or just...the way the world works...but psychiatrists create victims on a fairly regular basis.

[mindwrench]

I wouldn't take an anti-psychotic unless you really need it to treat the symptoms it is intended to treat. And even then I am on the fence. I have been on Latuda for 2 weeks, since meeting pdocs for the first time in my life. I was given it to treat schizophrenia psychosis. Though I am receiving some benefit from it, I question myself every time I put that pill in my mouth and many nights I get very angry with myself for having taken another dose. The urge to stop taking it altogether is strong, but I know how I am without it.

Like **still_crazy** has said, if you were not experiencing psychosis I would certainly tell the pdocs to go back to the drawing board and come up with safer alternatives for you. I know Latuda is also approved for Bipolar 1 depression but it is such a powerful brain changing substance, who knows what it will do to a person who is depressed and never been psychotic. Just my 2 cents, as I have been anti-drug for all my life and only out of desperation did I decide to try psychoactive drugs.

[LucyG]

The thing you need to understand and your doctor isn't going to tell you this is that antidepressants actually have anxiety as a side-effect!!! I know that doesn't sit well with most people, but it's true. My sister was told this by a neurologist, and I've googled meds I was on when I had problems and found it's true. Google your med with the term 'side-effects, anxiety' and see what you come up with. Chances are you'll find lots of forum discussion about this.

One reason for so many strange side-effects is because meds block the body's ability to utilize nutrients such as magnesium that is needed in 300 functions in the body. And the stress of detoxing meds from the liver depletes the body of magnesium so the longer a person is on meds, the more likely they are to experience a host of strange side-effects which is what happened to me.

[Moose72]

When I first started Wellbutrin a few weeks ago, I had some side effects: dry mouth, dry lips, intermittent insomnia. My doctor told me to stick it out. I did and now I'm really enjoying how I feel on this antidepressant. The insomnia was just twice and is gone now. Also, I don't have mania from it, for another. (Celexa and Zoloft had that side effect. Zoloft also had sexual side effects that are now GONE! yippee) I feel more upbeat. Refreshed. Awake. Alive. I hadn't realized how depressed I felt. The circular thoughts are gone. In fact, I think my current med. combo is the best I've ever been on. (And I've tried a lot of meds.)

[philopsychology]

Thanks for the responses guys...now I am just straight up scared to take this medicine lol. Seriously though I do appreciate all the responses. I'm not psychotic, but I do feel like I have bipolar disorder and I know for a fact I have social anxiety because I've had it since forever and it was the reason I even ended up visiting a psychiatrist from the beginning. I honestly just want to feel better. I hate the chance of all these side effects but I am so desperate to live a normal life. I am constantly alone because I am never comfortable around anyone other than my mom and I am so depressed half the time that I don't do anything that I should be doing. Then I also have moments in my life where I do extremely stupid reckless stuff and that makes me think maybe this is bipolar manifesting itself? I've always been an adrenaline junkie except when I'm really depressed. Anyways idk wut to do. I don't want to argue with my psychiatrist about Latuda and sound like I know better than him, that makes me anxious just to think about. I'm really just hoping things work out? I really hate that I am even in this situation to begin with though. I hate feeling like a lab rat and I wouldn't be surprised if the guy is endorsing a new drug for all i know...i just don't know what else to do...

[mindwrench]

Here is a few videos I think you may benefit from. The first one is a breakdown about Bipolar disorder and the diff between type 1 and type 2.

And just so you have a good understanding of psychosis.

Kati's youtube channel has a wealth of information.

I'm curious how many times you have seen your psychiatrist before he diagnosed you, and if you have therapeutic sessions with the pdoc or if they just do meds. Where I go the pdocs do meds only except for the first session where they question your history and symptoms. You could probably benefit from seeing a therapist too, and it would give you two points of view about your diagnosis.

[PenguinExMachina]

Originally Posted by still_crazy

Latuda is new, and psychiatrists love prescribing new drugs. I don't know what the deal is, honestly.

What do --you-- think your problems are? Forget about the labels. Just think about it for a minute...what do you think your problems are, and what do you want from the pills?

There's only so much pills can do. If you hear voices and/or get paranoid, Latuda and other antipsychotics can helps with that. If you get full blown mania, there are drugs that can treat that and either prevent it from happening again or reduce the likelihood that it will happen again.

Depression is harder to treat. Even if a given drug helps, you may still be somewhat depressed, plus you're dealing with adverse effects. Mild to moderate depression doesn't responds as well to drugs as more severe depression. My depression responds to drugs because I get severe, psychotic depression. For me and some other people, the costs of the drugs and the side effects are better than not taking the drugs. You may or may not be one of those people.

Why do you think you have social anxiety disorder? I was diagnosed with social anxiety disorder. Now, I realize: I was awkward, queer, and got picked on because I was from a working class family in the Honors and Gifted classes, surrounded by kids from upper middle and upper class families. I was easy pickins', and that--day in, day out, for years--set the stage for a lot of my problems.

Drugs always have adverse effects. Drugs are toxins. Some are more toxic than others. Antipsychotics are dangerous. They can cause NMS, which is neuroleptic malignancy syndrome. That's when you get a high fever, rigid muscles, and you might die. Its relatively rare, but it does happen, usually within the first 2 weeks of treatment.

Antidepressants aren't usually that toxic. There's some indication that taking an antidepressant long term can make depression chronic and more severe, so you'll end up needing the drugs for a longer time, maybe indefinitely. Some people who take antidepressants end up diagnosed with "Bipolar Disorder." This happens more frequently than with people who do not take the antidepressants.

I don't have any answers for you, I'm just trying to get you to ask yourself some questions. One reason I need the drugs is because I took the drugs at a young age, because I thought that was the solution and that's what the "experts" told me would solve the problems. Now, I have a diagnosis of "Bipolar I" and I require drugs daily.

Hope this helps. Just because a psychiatrist is an MD doesn't mean they'll help you. In fact, they may not even care if they help your or harm you. A lot of them don't, honestly. Trust me on that one. I don't know if its intentional or just...the way the world works...but psychiatrists create victims on a fairly regular basis.

I've read a lot of your comments on this board and honestly, I think they are rather harmful in regards to people seeking help from medical professionals. There are people here who are new at this, scared, and not sure what to do. Attempts to scare them from taking medication is really just a bit much. I understand that you have mistrust of the mental health field, but instilling that mistrust in others is not necessary. Let them form the opinion on their own, based on their own experiences. Please. This is a board for support, we don't need to be scaring people away from those that are trying to help them. Not all psychiatrists are out to create victims, they take the same oath as all the other medical professionals.

[philopsychology]

Originally Posted by mindwrench

Here is a few videos I think you may benefit from. The first one is a breakdown about Bipolar disorder and the diff between type 1 and type 2.

And just so you have a good understanding of psychosis.

Kati's youtube channel has a wealth of information.

I'm curious how many times you have seen your psychiatrist before he diagnosed you, and if you have therapeutic sessions with the pdoc or if they just do meds. Where I go the pdocs do meds only except for the first session where they question your history and symptoms. You could probably benefit from seeing a therapist too, and it would give you two points of view about your diagnosis.

Been going to the nurse practitioner in the office for over a year and tried nearly 30 medicines no joke. I've always been in the system so to speak but i didn't start going back to medication until about a year ago when I was suicidal. Before that i had been on Zoloft for basically all of highschool so i was constantly seeing a NP and I would occasionally see a psychiatrist. After highschool I went to a few psychiatrists before this guy for like 3 visits and then I'd drop them. Personally with this guy I've only talked to him once before, but he has a lot of history on me from my past and from the NP in the office.

[philopsychology]

Originally Posted by mindwrench

Here is a few videos I think you may benefit from. The first one is a breakdown about Bipolar disorder and the diff between type 1 and type 2.

And just so you have a good understanding of psychosis.

Kati's youtube channel has a wealth of information.

I'm curious how many times you have seen your psychiatrist before he diagnosed you, and if you have therapeutic sessions with the pdoc or if they just do meds. Where I go the pdocs do meds only except for the first session where they question your history and symptoms. You could probably benefit from seeing a therapist too, and it would give you two points of view about your diagnosis.

Yo thanks for the videos btw! I watched them plus a bunch of her other videos and she explains things so well! I think I might actually have psychosis sometimes because i do have very disorganized thinking at times but I had always thought of psychosis as just hallucinations so that is why I immediately wrote it off. I also believe I have Bipolar II disorder after watching the video which is what my psychiatrist thinks I have, so at least I am finally on the right path to treatment. I am almost 22 years old and have been in the system since I was like 13 years old. I can't believe I have even made it this far. I feel like I got lucky in a lot of respects in my life so that's why I am still here. It is so frustrating though knowing how long it has taken for me to be properly diagnosed! I can't imagine if my life was extra crummy on top of my disorder, I might not be alive today...