Kay Redfield Jamison - snooty "b"

In Kay's book, Touched with Fire, she claims that no one who has been diagnosed schizophrenic is creative. Being a schizophrenic writer, I take offense in the largest possible way to this statement. I don't care if she is bipolar, you never insult an entire group of people like that. I think that being bipolar got to her head and she suddenly feels superior to me and the 1% of the American population who are combating a psychotic disorder. I have nothing against anyone with bipolar disorder and I don't mean to offend anyone struggling with it. My own father is one. But I have a problem with manic depressive "b's" thinking that they are so much better because their illness comes in episodes.

I just needed to vent.

P.S: Does anyone have her contact info?

No one?

can understand your anger...not sure putting her in her place will accomplish much when her mind of a certain opinion...

You are right Direction. Plus, I have no way to contact her. My doc doesn't think like that and that's why I like him so much. He sees me as a person, not a label.

WHO IS SHE???? I CAN'T GIVE AN OPINION. I DO NOT READ TOO MUCH EXCEPT FOR RESEARCH ON THE WEB. I DO NOT KNOW AUTHORS IN GENERAL. IS SHE AN ACCOMPLISHED WRITER???

WHAT TYPE OF BOOKS DOES SHE WRITE???

This should give you an idea of what her work is

Kay R. Jamison, Ph.D., Gives Personal Perspective on Manic Depressive Illness

by Ellen A. Diamond

July 2001, Vol. XVIII, Issue 7

Kay R. Jamison, Ph.D., was named the sixth annual Gene Usdin Distinguished Visiting Professor and Lecturer in Psychiatry by the Ochsner Clinic and Alton Ochsner Medical Foundation in New Orleans. The lectureship was created to honor Gene Usdin, M.D., senior psychiatrist emeritus at the clinic.

Jamison, professor of psychiatry at the Johns Hopkins School of Medicine and honorary professor in the department of English studies at St. Andrews University in Scotland, has written or been co-author of five books. In her memoir, An Unquiet Mind, Jamison revealed her own experiences with manic depressive illness.

Jamison drew from this book for her lecture, "An Unquiet Mind: A Personal Perspective on Manic Depressive Illness." She said she wanted to talk about what happens if a person in the fields of psychology, psychiatry and medicine goes public about having a severe psychotic mental illness. She characterized this decision as, in some ways, "not a great thing to do, but having done it, I thought I would talk a little about what the experience was like."

Many people thought it would be easier for her, as a professional in psychiatry and medicine, to go public with her illness. Jamison responded, "Wrong! There is a lot of stigma in medical schools, in particular in any hospital situation, about people who have [hospital] privileges."

Jamison called for the medical community to start dealing with mental illnesses in staff members more effectively. Depression, especially, is extremely common, she said. After saying that she had just written remarks on the sixth house staff member or resident to commit suicide in the past five years at University of California, Los Angeles (UCLA), Jamison commented, "By the time you speak at enough funeralsýyou get a real appreciation of the tragedy of people not being able toýbe honest and seek the kind of help that they need."

Turning to her own history, Jamison said that within a month of signing her appointment papers at UCLA, she was "well on [her] way to madness." The start of her illness, however, could be traced to her childhood. Jamison described herself as "frighteningly, although occasionally wonderfully, beholden to moods: intensely emotional as a child, mercurial as a young girl, first severely depressed as an adolescent and then unrelentingly caught up in the cycles of manic depressive illness by the time I began my professional life."

Like many individuals with manic depressive illness, Jamison found herself initially entranced by the increased flow of thoughts and ceaseless energy of her early and mild manic states. However, as she wrote in a textbook on the illness, "Somewhere this changes. The fast ideas are now too fast and there are far too many. Overwhelming confusion replaces clarity."

Still, Jamison resisted medication for many years, another common trait of people with manic depressive illness. She noted that many of her colleagues find this behavior infuriating and incomprehensible. However, pointing out that physicians often do not complete a 10-day course of antibiotics, Jamison asked how an asymptomatic individual can be expected to stay on a medication with adverse side effects for a lifetime. She said that she finally realized, "The freedom from the control imposed by medication loses its meaning when the only alternatives are death and insanity."

Worse still, according to Jamison, are the many people suffering from mental illness who do not seek treatment at all, either due to a lack of information, poor medical advice, stigma, or fear of professional and personal reprisals. This leads to a continuous cycle of misinformation. People with mental illness who have responded to treatment keep their illness hidden because of the stigma surrounding it. Therefore, society's views of mental illness are formed by those they see--the mentally ill who do not receive treatment. This view leads people who respond well to treatment to remain more convinced of the need to keep their own experiences with mental illness hidden.

All these issues played a role in Jamison's decision to go public with her own mental illness. In the end, she said, "I was tired of hiding, tired of misspent and knotted energies, tired of the hypocrisy. And tired of acting as if I had something to hide."

Describing her life as "unpredictable, often terrifying, [with] occasionally glorious storms of moods, thoughts and behaviors" that she had managed to keep hidden from all but a few friends and colleagues, Jamison decided to not only write a book about her experiences, but to reveal her illness in an interview with the Washington Post. Jamison said she was "frightened beyond measure" upon returning to work after the Post article appeared. What she found, however, was that once the normal routine had reasserted itself, any initial discomfort was replaced by a reassuring collegial support. Some colleagues were not so supportive, and Jamison said she is "resigned to the fact that no one really knows what anybody else actually thinks." She added, "Those who disapprove are unlikely to say so to one's face."

Jamison claimed that speaking about her illness has allowed her to speak her mind more freely on other topics as well. She quipped, "Everybody thinks I'm crazy anywayýI am much more able to say what I really feel now."

Writing about her illness brought Jamison's family closer together. She said they have begun talking about the prevalence of manic depression among themselves--a topic they had ignored before. She described her family tree as "very loaded--as they say in genetics."

Since the publication of An Unquiet Mind, Jamison has received over 5,000 letters. While she described some as vicious, the majority came from others struggling with mental illness--either their own or that of a family member. Jamison said, "The level of despair and frustration was palpable."

Jamison is committed to using her own experiences to inform clinical research and practice. She continues to try and illuminate for her colleagues what she calls "the paradoxical core of this quicksilver illness that can both kill and create." And always, she works to eradicate the stigma attached to mental illness, a stigma that keeps many talented, intelligent individuals from seeking and receiving the medical care that can enable them to succeed as Jamison has.

Thanks Dreamrunner for the information...it has been helpful...

Here's her contact info:

http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/Psych...J/jamison.html

just reading this line in your post Phil, "In Kay's book, Touched with Fire, she claims that no one who has been diagnosed schizophrenic is creative" I agree with you that is one rude opinion about people with schizophenia isnt creative, that is load of bull crap Kay Redfield thinks. I think every single person has their own creative talents, no matter what DSM-IV diagnosis label a person has.

This reminds me of a book, in which I cannot remember the author's name, but she titled it, "Toxic People".
I was furious when glancing over it at the book store, when I came upon her statement, "bipolar people are toxic", I wanted to write to her, even started to but then through out my letter, realizing it wouldn't matter to her what my opinion was on her statement.
Unfortunately, statements that people make about people's mental illness come from their ignorance, their opinions they feel are right, or even lack of education on mental illness.
I have a nephew who is schizophrenic, and he is extremely creative.
It's been years since I read her books, so forgive me for forgetting this statement she made, I can understand your annoyance with her, on the other hand, she has written some informative stuff.
It's ashame when famous writers lose touch, and start stereotyping the very thing(s) they claim they want to help people stop doing, such as stereotyping and stigmatizing.
If it's any consolation, I feel many of us believe and know her statement was wrong.
I don't know what writing her about this will do, other than allow you to vent to her, for she seemed she already made her statement and she believes in it.
I'm sure she must have recieved more complaints about this from others, it would be interesting to know what her replies were and if she ever did personally reply,eh?
I'm sorry to hear she has upset you and others, dealing with this disorder, I guess she has become a legend in her own mind. (sarcasm,of course)
Phil, take care and know that her statement was flawed and that creativity is a gift, and shouldn't be determined by a disorder(s).

Thank you very much Perna!

SFJane

I have not finished "Touched with Fire" yet-- I am about 1/3 of the way through. What I have found so far is that Jamison has stated that the relationship between schizophrenia and creativity is not as expected or prevalent as the relationship between manic depressive illness/depression and creativity because of the severe disorganization and disorder of thought that often accompanies schizophrenia. This does not mean people will schizophrenia cannot be, or are not, creative. There are exceptions to every single general finding or statement.

Psychotic Phil, if you are 13 years old and you are interested and able to understand writing from Jamison and others, then you are way ahead of a lot of people your age. If you have a diagnosis of schizophrenia on top of that, that's even more awesome. You are proof that there are major exceptions to generalizations.

I understand that you have your opinions about Jamison-- I respect and admire her so much. She has done so much not only for the research of bipolar disorder, but she has given inspiration to people like me who have a mental illness and are in the field of psychology. I think she's an incredibly talented writer and I thank her for teaching me the value in being open and honest about having an experience with an illness when you are the same field that treats that illness.

With respect to all of the talk in other forums about locked threads/deleted threads, while I'm glad that this thread remains open (and do not think that it should be locked or deleted) I am surprised that calling her a '*****' in the title and the body of the thread would be permitted. Just an observation.

Good posting.

I agree that is not necessary to call someone a "*****" if you disagree with something she wrote.

I heard her speak at a local college here & she was humorous, compassionate, & very humble so maybe that doesn't come through in her writing. She answered questions for a lengthy time.

i myself have bipolar & think that the meds I take to stabalize me have taken away a lot of my creativity, but that is a trade-off that I have to take to not become so depressed that I am suicidal or so manic that I "overdo" life to such an extent that I cause problems later.

So if you are creative, go to it & don't be bummed out by someone's (questionable) opinion. I'm bipolar & these days not creative at all. I miss it, but can't risk the consequences of getting off meds so I'm jealous of all of you who still have the creativitiy within.--Suzy

I agree, I guess it slipped by.
I have read a lot of her stuff (though I don't remember it all) and found her quite interesting, even enjoyed her books.
I understand that she may have said something(s) to annoy people, but we all have choices, to read or not to read.
All in all I still think she has contributed quite a bit towards educating people about Bipolar disorder.
Now, I should check out trying to "soften" that "B" word.
Good post, Suzy.

Genius.
I've been wanting her contact details for ages re: a documentary idea. Excellent.

I've been reading Touched With Fire too, but I haven't gotten that far. its a bit... stodgy. difficult to read somehow.

SHE WORKS AT THE UNIVERSITY OF PENN
I'M BIPOLAR ALSO, TRY READING HER BOOK AN UNQUIET MIND. MY MOTHER READ IT AND IT EXPLAINS BIPOLAR IN LAYMANS TERMS, MY MOTHER THOUGHT I WAS ON DRUGS ON THOSE YEARS AND AFTER READING THAT BOOK SHE REALIZED IT WAS THE DISEASE AND NOT DRUGS. MY AUNT WORKS AT THE CHAPELS OFFICE AT THE UNIVERSITY OF PENN AND TOLD ME SHE WORK THERE. IF I CAN GET MORE INFO FOR YOU I WILL. KEEP UR HEAD HELD HIGH AND DON'T LET ANYONE OR ANYTHING BRING IT DOWN, U WORKED TO HARD! IT'S NOT WORTH IT! <3 CYANIDE SUN