[IntentOnHealing]

Wondering how many of you have memory loss related to your bipolar depressive or manic episodes.

In terms of short term memory loss...I've just recently felt well enough to start cleaning up the physical messes associated with my last mania. It lasted about nine months. As I go through things, I find memories triggered. It's sometimes devastating--especially since the things I've forgotten are things I wish I never remembered. I imagine that might be fairly common. It was a stressful and traumatic time that saw no shortage in the use of alcohol and illegal substances. These are something I don't use when well but can seem to procure and portion in mass quantities when ill.

Also, I'm encountering long term memory loss. For example, I could not remember how to use Google docs although my files indicate that, in the past, I did it all the time. It took literally months of practice to relearn that skill. and it's not that hard!

Is this common? Or should I be contacting my neurologist? Or maybe a third choice? It is common but I should still be contacting my neuro?

What's your experience? What are your thoughts?

[5150DirtDiva]

Yes! I also get brain fog, so memories are foggy too. Forgetfulness. It all kind of blends together. Sometimes I will "remember" something, but not really be sure that it is a real memory as well.

[lilypup]

I was just talking to my husband about this very thing! Lately I have been having nightmare/ flashbacks about things I did while manic 30-35 years ago.

I do always have trouble remembering movies....what the plot was, who starred in it, and sometimes even if I saw it. And I struggle to remember some names and things but they usually come to me very quickly. I am 57 and many of my friends report the same stuff. BUT I wonder if it could be the meds or possibly just the bipolar.

[Daonnachd]

The hippocampus, that little seahorse-shaped organ in the lower center of the brain, is involved with both emotions and memories. It makes sense that this disorder, which targets emotion, would also impact memory.

On the personal level, yes, I have been plagued with a poor memory, also. ...before the ECT, so ECT just dug the holes in my memory a little deeper.

I'd be interested in learning how many of us also struggle with spatial navigation. That is the third thing the hippocampus is in charge of. I suspect an academic study, if anyone did one, would show bipolar performance to be sub par.

[5150DirtDiva]

Do you mean athletics in part? I am very athletic, graceful, not so much, but I am an athlete.

Originally Posted by vertigo

The hippocampus, that little seahorse-shaped organ in the lower center of the brain, is involved with both emotions and memories. It makes sense that this disorder, which targets emotion, would also impact memory.

On the personal level, yes, I have been plagued with a poor memory, also. ...before the ECT, so ECT just dug the holes in my memory a little deeper.

I'd be interested in learning how many of us also struggle with spatial navigation. That is the third thing the hippocampus is in charge of. I suspect an academic study, if anyone did one, would show bipolar performance to be sub par.

[HarryKovert]

I suffer with memory loss whilst depressed but not when manic.

I am currently depressed so forget quite a lot though I think it will improve once stability returns.

[Daonnachd]

Originally Posted by 5150DirtDiva

Do you mean athletics in part? I am very athletic, graceful, not so much, but I am an athlete.

Actually, I'm pretty sure "spatial navigation" refers more to driving around in a city, finding one's way around inside a large building with lots of corridors and stairs (I think of a hospital.), possibly even things like getting to the correct ride in an amusement park. I'm sure we could come up with lots of other examples of where we can get lost. (Costco, Home Depot, Waterstones).

[Cocosurviving]

When I first started getting symptoms of bp1. Memory loss was one it got worse when I started meds. This started when I was 36 and I'm now 41 next month.

[rwwff]

I'm still ok on spacial modelling of the world around me, as well as described elements.

My memory is completely trashed. Interestingly enough, I feel the short term part at least has *improved* on depakote; I can honestly work my way through the previous day or week and remember some of it. Its cracking my spouse up quizzing me though... so maybe the improvement has a different price.

[Unrigged64072835]

I've been having memory problems for quite a while. Some of it may be due to meds, and some of it to the illness, and another part to age. I notice I forget to do things, and leave things I normally take. It would probably help to have exercise and a good food plan, but I'm not sure if it will cure everything.

[CherryGlazer]

yes! I was actually recently just thinking about this. It seems my meds have surprisingly helped alot with this. I don't experience memory turbulence when I'm stable. But when I do experience symptoms - honestly i think the memory issues are the collateral damage. Brain fog, not being being able to focus, think straight, think linearly - its not surprising that spills over into memory.

Man, it used to be really bad. I would get lost on my way to places I knew, I would lose things all the time, forget conversations, and really similar to you, I'd get this sense that i was losing the ability to do things/skills I've developed over ages. This even affected my artwork! Like the stuff I made during those time periods was just really mediocre and not like me. So i get the feel, and yes, i think it's part of it.

[BipolaRNurse]

I swear, sometimes I wonder if I'm getting dementia. I can forget a chapter of a book before I get to the end of it. I'm way too easily distracted, I have trouble remembering where I put things, and sometimes I lose track of a conversation even during it. I'm also directionally dyslexic---I once called the police because I lost my car in a parking lot!---and driving is anxiety-producing because I'll get sidetracked and not check my surroundings as often as I should. I have trouble parking too; I'm usually sideways in the stall and have to correct it so I don't look like a jerk to the person who parks next to me. So much fun...NOT.

My pdoc, on the other hand, doesn't believe I'm developing Alzheimer's or any other type of dementia; rather, it's probably a combination of repeated bipolar episodes and medications. I am on quite a few, and I've noticed that all this got worse after I started them. But what should I do---not take the meds and damage my brain even further, or take them and look like a bloomin' idiot half the time?

[Wild Coyote]

There's a difference between trying to retrieve info which was never correctly encoded into memory due to an attention deficit and trying to recover/access a lost skillset.

I've had some strange memory losses, like going through a severe episode and not being able to recall a password I'd had for 10 years! Never was able to recall it.

I have lots of very little "holes" in memory, which may be partly due to episodes and meds, yet are also most likely due to dissociation (due to mega-traumas in childhood).

At the same time, I can recall landline telephone numbers from40 years ago.

Interesting topic! Thanks for this thread!


WC

[IntentOnHealing]

Yes! This HAS been a really interesting topic. Thanks, everybody!

[Wander]

After ECT and on some meds like Topomax my memory disappeared. However after stopping topomax and after 2 month from ECT my memory returned to normal. The cocktail I am on doesn't seem to be effecting my memory thankfully but i have heard some meds can cause these problems. Can you talk to your pdoc about this and then go to a neurologist? I am sorry it is effecting you so much. It is certainly not normal so I think it is best to get a professional opinion.

[Faltering]

My short-term memory is compromised during my worst manic/mixed episodes. I forget what I'm doing half the time and sometimes succumb to a zombie-like state. My long-term memory has typically held up well.

[dshantel]

I know a of my past episodes are foggy like when I try to think of them out if my husband asks me something that's related to a past episode it's really fuzzy. Almost like it didn't happen to me. Kind of like trying to remember​ a movie, if that makes sense. Also i forget a lot of things I tell my husband, according to him, I don't remember. Lol

[jacky8807]

After repeated severe episodes my short term memory became shot. I have read cognitive disturbance from episodes is a pretty common thing in bipolar. I know its not meds because I'm not on them half the time haha.

As far as the spatial problems...wow that's really interesting. I have had those my whole life though. Like famously known for not being able to find my way out of a paper bag. The corridor thing really rang true. We only have like literally 4 where I work but 5 months later working here I still get lost.

[BipolaRNurse]

Originally Posted by jacky8807

After repeated severe episodes my short term memory became shot. I have read cognitive disturbance from episodes is a pretty common thing in bipolar. I know its not meds because I'm not on them half the time haha.

As far as the spatial problems...wow that's really interesting. I have had those my whole life though. Like famously known for not being able to find my way out of a paper bag. The corridor thing really rang true. We only have like literally 4 where I work but 5 months later working here I still get lost.

I know what you mean about getting lost. I went to the same OB-GYN doctor for seven years, and I always, ALWAYS got turned around in there when I went to the bathroom to produce my pee sample. I mean, I couldn't find my exam room no matter how many times I performed this operation. It was embarrassing because the nurses always had to steer me back in the right direction.

I really miss my memory.

I used to be the human phone book, the human tv guide, the human map,

now i'm... well, none of those things.

I can't remember anything, unless it's written down and i have sticky notes all over my house reminding me of little words that will, hopefully, lead me to what i'm meant to remember

[IntentOnHealing]

Fharraige, it never occurred to me that lack of exercise could play into this. I used to walk two or three miles almost every day, swim, and squats, pushups, etc. Now I am JUST starting to get back to yoga more regularly but even a 30-minute walk exhausts me. this is the longest, slowest healing I've ever gone through.

Rwwff, what is "spacial modelling." I tried to look it up, then had to look up words in the definition, I hope your improvement continues and that your spouse is kind.

Cocosurvivng, is your memory loss constant? Or does it come and go with episodes? I'm discovering by reviewing these responses that, at least anecdotally, we with bipolar have a lot of memory issues as a group.

Vertigo, I think you're right about spacial navigation. And I also wonder who is "directionally challeged" as my sister calls me. Is that a bipolar thing? I would love to tell her--and my geographic genius of a husband--that, this too, is a reflection of BD. I cannot figure out how to get anywhere, indoors or out, unless I have been there many times. Even then, it can be really hit or miss, especially now.

You also brought up ECT with relation to memory. I have read that it swiss-cheeses recipients' brains. Is that permanent? I have never been able to receive ECT (no insurance) though I wonder often if it might not help me out of this incredibly long slump.

Thank you for bringing up the hippocamus. I am a bit of a research nut, but unfortunately cannot remember much of what I study these days. Your conclusion makes total sense, though, and is succinct enough for me to ponder if I write it on my hand. I might start a thread about this very thing. Do you know what his happening in the frontal lobe and the amygdalia when we are manic? I can't remember....



5150dirtdiva, I hear you on the brainfog and blending. I have trouble telling real memories from dreams I have. I have these dreams about what I did or need to do. I think it's my head's way of trying to remind me of stuff. Subconsciously, my head knows how actually very scared I have been about this issue.

What kind of an athlete are you? That kind of stuff has always take a LOT of extra training for me if I'm to do anything at all. I see this in my son and feel very glad he goes to a school with a special program for gifted and talented students. Sports are not of much interest to kids who argue about the properties of water and think it's fun, so he fits right in. Do you think athleticism is learned or genetic?

HarryKovert, I am in a depression right now, and my memory is shockingly poor. I can't even remember 2 numbers at a time of the 6-digit code Google texts me to get into my email. But as I heal, I am finding out from my husband things I did or said when manic that I have no recollection of whatsoever. This strikes me as odd since my memories of mania used to be so vivid.

Lilypup, THANK you for mentioning you have been having flashbacks. I too have them. I just wrote about this in fact: "And the flashbacks--oh god--the merciless flashbacks, from 10, 15, 30 years past..." Are yours at traumatic as mine? I find this whole dang thing to be traumatizing. It's no wonder I am so panicky and sad.

My problem with movies (and plays, etc.) is that I can't figure out what's going on for a very long time into them and sometimes not at all. I need someone to connect the dots for me. This used to be true of some things. Now it's true of almost all. I want my brain back!

shattered sanity, you sound as sad as I've been about losing your memory. I know what you mean about being the human phone book, etc. I was too. the human calendar as well. And I TOTALLY get the whole post it note thing. I try to make reminders for myself and then forget what they are even supposed to remind me of. Hugs.

jacky8807, Tell us more about what you've read about cognitive disturbance. I don't even know what all that includes, but it sounds really interesting.

Bipolar RNurse, you are my twin. Same scenario. Every time I went in I'd always hear Led Zeppelin playing in my head: "Yes, there are two paths you go by, but in the long run, there's still time to change the road you're on."

Your pdoc says things like my (old) pdoc used to say about my memory. that our meds protect it, it's not alzeimers, etc. But that was before it got SO severe, and also before my uncle was diagnosed with (gulp) early onset alzheimers. He was 56. Man, that's young. I'm right around that age.I know I'm stupid to put off going to the neuro....

dshantel, I totally get what you're saying about things being like they didn't happen to you. My husband has recently informed me that I should probably apologize to people for various things, and when he's described what he means, sometimes these events come back with that very dreamlike quality you're describing.

Faltering, what is this zombie-like state? Do you want to tell more? I'm curious what it's like and when it comes on.

Wander, thank you for advising me to talk to my docs. I honestly FORGOT to bring this up to pdoc on Wednesday, even though, yes, or course, it was on my list. Neurologist has a slew of tests he is excited--yes, excited--to run on my melon. He's very passionate about his work and explains things so beautifully. I'm just...well, scared.

I used to take Topamax. my husband called it DOPEamax, it made me so forgetful. I couldn't remember from one corner to the next if I was supposed to left or right. I once forgot what you're supposed to do at a yield sign. That's when I called pdoc!

Care to share what ECT was like?

CherryGlazer, it's affected my artwork too. That, I think, is one of the scariest and saddest parts. But yours is only affected in the actual episodes themselves?

[Travelinglady]

I have memory loss, thought to be partly due to my meds.

[Daonnachd]

Originally Posted by IntentOnHealing

Vertigo, I think you're right about spacial navigation. And I also wonder who is "directionally challeged" as my sister calls me. Is that a bipolar thing? I would love to tell her--and my geographic genius of a husband--that, this too, is a reflection of BD. I cannot figure out how to get anywhere, indoors or out, unless I have been there many times. Even then, it can be really hit or miss, especially now.

The article I read suggested both major depressive disorder and bipolar are impacted this way.

You also brought up ECT with relation to memory. I have read that it swiss-cheeses recipients' brains. Is that permanent? I have never been able to receive ECT (no insurance) though I wonder often if it might not help me out of this incredibly long slump.

I'm still undergoing maintenance ECT, so I don't know if the memory actually gets better, but that's what the professionals say.

Thank you for bringing up the hippocamus. I am a bit of a research nut, but unfortunately cannot remember much of what I study these days. Your conclusion makes total sense, though, and is succinct enough for me to ponder if I write it on my hand. I might start a thread about this very thing. Do you know what his happening in the frontal lobe and the amygdalia when we are manic? I can't remember....

As I understand it, the neurons become hyperactive, firing more rapidly than in the brain of a normie. This is why the most effective ECT is bilateral, putting the electrodes at each temple and shooting electricity through the frontal lobe.

[CherryGlazer]

Originally Posted by IntentOnHealing

Fharraige, it never occurred to me that lack of exercise could play into this. I used to walk two or three miles almost every day, swim, and squats, pushups, etc. Now I am JUST starting to get back to yoga more regularly but even a 30-minute walk exhausts me. this is the longest, slowest healing I've ever gone through.

Rwwff, what is "spacial modelling." I tried to look it up, then had to look up words in the definition, I hope your improvement continues and that your spouse is kind.

Cocosurvivng, is your memory loss constant? Or does it come and go with episodes? I'm discovering by reviewing these responses that, at least anecdotally, we with bipolar have a lot of memory issues as a group.

Vertigo, I think you're right about spacial navigation. And I also wonder who is "directionally challeged" as my sister calls me. Is that a bipolar thing? I would love to tell her--and my geographic genius of a husband--that, this too, is a reflection of BD. I cannot figure out how to get anywhere, indoors or out, unless I have been there many times. Even then, it can be really hit or miss, especially now.

You also brought up ECT with relation to memory. I have read that it swiss-cheeses recipients' brains. Is that permanent? I have never been able to receive ECT (no insurance) though I wonder often if it might not help me out of this incredibly long slump.

Thank you for bringing up the hippocamus. I am a bit of a research nut, but unfortunately cannot remember much of what I study these days. Your conclusion makes total sense, though, and is succinct enough for me to ponder if I write it on my hand. I might start a thread about this very thing. Do you know what his happening in the frontal lobe and the amygdalia when we are manic? I can't remember....



5150dirtdiva, I hear you on the brainfog and blending. I have trouble telling real memories from dreams I have. I have these dreams about what I did or need to do. I think it's my head's way of trying to remind me of stuff. Subconsciously, my head knows how actually very scared I have been about this issue.

What kind of an athlete are you? That kind of stuff has always take a LOT of extra training for me if I'm to do anything at all. I see this in my son and feel very glad he goes to a school with a special program for gifted and talented students. Sports are not of much interest to kids who argue about the properties of water and think it's fun, so he fits right in. Do you think athleticism is learned or genetic?

HarryKovert, I am in a depression right now, and my memory is shockingly poor. I can't even remember 2 numbers at a time of the 6-digit code Google texts me to get into my email. But as I heal, I am finding out from my husband things I did or said when manic that I have no recollection of whatsoever. This strikes me as odd since my memories of mania used to be so vivid.

Lilypup, THANK you for mentioning you have been having flashbacks. I too have them. I just wrote about this in fact: "And the flashbacks--oh god--the merciless flashbacks, from 10, 15, 30 years past..." Are yours at traumatic as mine? I find this whole dang thing to be traumatizing. It's no wonder I am so panicky and sad.

My problem with movies (and plays, etc.) is that I can't figure out what's going on for a very long time into them and sometimes not at all. I need someone to connect the dots for me. This used to be true of some things. Now it's true of almost all. I want my brain back!

shattered sanity, you sound as sad as I've been about losing your memory. I know what you mean about being the human phone book, etc. I was too. the human calendar as well. And I TOTALLY get the whole post it note thing. I try to make reminders for myself and then forget what they are even supposed to remind me of. Hugs.

jacky8807, Tell us more about what you've read about cognitive disturbance. I don't even know what all that includes, but it sounds really interesting.

Bipolar RNurse, you are my twin. Same scenario. Every time I went in I'd always hear Led Zeppelin playing in my head: "Yes, there are two paths you go by, but in the long run, there's still time to change the road you're on."

Your pdoc says things like my (old) pdoc used to say about my memory. that our meds protect it, it's not alzeimers, etc. But that was before it got SO severe, and also before my uncle was diagnosed with (gulp) early onset alzheimers. He was 56. Man, that's young. I'm right around that age.I know I'm stupid to put off going to the neuro....

dshantel, I totally get what you're saying about things being like they didn't happen to you. My husband has recently informed me that I should probably apologize to people for various things, and when he's described what he means, sometimes these events come back with that very dreamlike quality you're describing.

Faltering, what is this zombie-like state? Do you want to tell more? I'm curious what it's like and when it comes on.

Wander, thank you for advising me to talk to my docs. I honestly FORGOT to bring this up to pdoc on Wednesday, even though, yes, or course, it was on my list. Neurologist has a slew of tests he is excited--yes, excited--to run on my melon. He's very passionate about his work and explains things so beautifully. I'm just...well, scared.

I used to take Topamax. my husband called it DOPEamax, it made me so forgetful. I couldn't remember from one corner to the next if I was supposed to left or right. I once forgot what you're supposed to do at a yield sign. That's when I called pdoc!

Care to share what ECT was like?

CherryGlazer, it's affected my artwork too. That, I think, is one of the scariest and saddest parts. But yours is only affected in the actual episodes themselves?

For the most part it depended on the severity of my symptoms. But in another way I feel like living with it for so long has had some effect on my overall functioning. I came across the portfolio I made back when it got me into art school. It dawned on me that I haven't created anything on that level since (and I was only 18!)

[19J82]

Massive memory issues for me. I hadn't really noticed it until last year, before I was diagnosed. I realised I couldn't really remember my honeymoon. I knew I'd been on it, where I'd been and when, but it wasn't really a memory. I describe it as like thinking forward to the Xmas coming, you know who's going to be there, where you'll be and what you'll be doing, but it isn't a memory.
Since then though it's gotten dangerously worse. I walked into the kitchen a couple of days ago and there was a nice hot meal on the side. I was the only person in the house, so I must have made it, but I have no recollection whatsoever of it.
Unfortunately I got myself into some legal trouble in a manic episode last year, and whilst I admitted to everything that was put to me, I had to say I have no recollection of it. I'm really struggling to get the authorities to believe me that there are memory issues; one social worker even suggested I'd groomed health professionals to get them to give me a diagnosis of Bipolar! I pointed out to her that I'd been to the docs 4 years ago and sought help for what I believed was Bipolar, only to be turned away.