I cannot tolerate incompetence. I blame the "people at the top" for the incompetence of the low-level employees. Many companies do not train their people. In the 1950s and 1960s, we got paid on-the-job training. Now, the colleges have tricked people into believing that they will learn a trade, and competently handle a new job. This is definitely not true. It's never been true for teachers. I trained as a teacher, and cried every night. I'm told that most beginning teachers cry every night for their first THREE YEARS on the job. I quit - I could not handle public school teaching, which is probably one of the most difficult and stressful occupations anyone could have. The kids are great, but I did not have the opportunity to give them a decent education. Too many interruptions, too much paperwork, and class size getting bigger every year. Some school districts I taught in even had incompetent textbooks! The math book I was assigned to teach from was ridiculous. The principal also required me to teach my 8th graders eighth grade spelling words, even though many of the students did not even spell at 5th grade level.

A therapist told me that therapists go to work after college, and don't know a whole lot about how to do counseling.

Every day now, I wake up happy and pleasant. Then, I encounter something that enrages me. Today, it was that my phone quit. Suffice it to say that the battery type was wrong. Never mind that it'd been working fine for a year. The company told me that it would only use NIMH batteries. I went to a hardware store later in the day. I bought what they told me were NIMH. Dumb me -- I trusted that they knew what t hey were doing. Not! I did not read the package. The package says nowhere on it that they are NIMH. So I called the store and said they were likely not NIMH -- did they know if it said that somewhere on the package? She said, "I just googled it and they are." Google? They are the authorities????? no. I have contacted Energizer. It'll take several days to get response. I think I've found a source at a battery company. I have to make special trip there, and meanwhile my phone still does not work.

I can't tolerate this incompetence and predatory companies. What's going on?? This country is falling apart, because the filthy rich people at the top are preying on everyone else -- their underlings AND their customers. These are usually companies we can't do without -- the phone company, etc. One company overcharged me by $169.50 yesterday. I had to block my credit card and get a new card in a week to 10 days. On and on and on and on. They tried to call the phone number that was presently kaput. I had left them my cell number, but they paid no attention to the rest of m message.

[Sunflower123]

flowerbells I thought I was hooking you up with a new friend! I'm seeing kind of bleary right now so I couldn't see the poster but read the post. I thought it was a guy and then I thought I bet he and flowerbells would get along well!! Smh. I'm sorry these things keep happening to you. I hope you get your phone battery straightened out soon.

Hi Jennifer. The message I was writing got zapped. Usually I copy the message while I'm writing. This time, I did not. Anyway, thanks for your good wishes and desire to help. I have a great boyfriend of 5 years and counting. Thanks for the thought, though. It's not just me or just people with bipolar who get enraged by these companies. Everyone I know does! But my b/f says that when he gets angry, he gets over it in about an hour. For me, it ruins my whole day. I think I need yet another med change. I don't see the pdoc till June 8.

[Nammu]

Bipolar people as a rule don't fly into the rages you have that's an anger problem, not bipolar.

[Sunflower123]

Good luck on that pdoc visit and with that med change. I understand your dilemma. I can get upset and it takes me a while to settle down too. Has even been known to ruin my day. Best wishes.

Originally Posted by Nammu

Bipolar people as a rule don't fly into the rages you have that's an anger problem, not bipolar.

Not so sure about that. Check out the comments by a lot of people here, who have almost identical rages and behavior I have -- all of us in this thread are here on this forum.

https://forums.psychcentral.com/bipo...ff-relief.html

Could you please let us know where to find find information that rage is not a part of bipolar disorder? I'd like to see where you found this opinion, but in any case, I suspect it's a subject with conflicted professional and personal opinions and experiences.

But rage could definitely be symptomatic of both anger issues and bipolar disorder.

Originally Posted by Jennifer 1967

Good luck on that pdoc visit and with that med change. I understand your dilemma. I can get upset and it takes me a while to settle down too. Has even been known to ruin my day. Best wishes.

Thanks, Jennifer. I've been rage-free for years at a time, with meds that worked for me. One of the meds that was great was tegretol. I was on it for maybe 6 years, but I think it may have given me osteoporosis, so I got off it. Things have been hard since I got off it a number of years ago.

Originally Posted by Nammu

Bipolar people as a rule don't fly into the rages you have that's an anger problem, not bipolar.

Here's a therapist's article about bipolar rage:

https://www.mentalhelp.net/articles/...der-and-anger/

Title of article: The Link Between Bipolar Disorder and Anger

There is a lot of information here at this link.

by Buck Black, LCSW

<snip> A person's beliefs, use of alcohol and other drugs, or a combination of past emotional hurts may be at the root of anger. However, some people have anger that is based in imbalances in brain chemistry, instead of emotions or drugs introduced into the body.

....

<snip> A significant portion of people with bipolar disorder also have moderate to high levels of anger.

[Sunflower123]

To be honest, I don't get angry very often and I'm usually over that in between 15 min -1 hour. I do get impatient a lot though. What can tear me up for long periods of time is getting upset or hurt. I'm working on that. I hope your pdoc gives you a med that helps you. It can't feel good to be so angry. It doesn't to me. Best wishes.

[rwwff]

Sympathy about the rage, I did this often enough through most of my life, it was exhausting and occasionally very embarrassing!

Originally Posted by flowerbells

But rage could definitely be symptomatic of both anger issues and bipolar disorder.

I think I'd describe it more along the lines that bipolar alters the anger issue, making its startup so much sharper, and when it ends, so much more exhausting. At least that's how I experienced it. With testosterone deleted though, that whole feedback cycle seems to be severely muted. (progesterone may do a similar trick too though...)

As to business incompetence, it can get pretty bad when you expect a sales person to know and understand what they are selling; but most don't. They know how to operate the register, and maybe the cc machine. If lucky, they'll know where most things are; but knowing whether something is a specific spec, and even WHY it needs to be that way? Not likely.

On NIMH.. they have a lower voltage and higher endurance at that voltage than an alkaline. If a circuit is optimized for NIMH voltage, it either can't work with an alkaline, or it'll drain it in a very short time because it pulls too many (mili)amps through the device at the higher voltage.

Customer Service reps on the phone or employees working the floor of a retail store are directly in the line of fire when it comes to customer complaints. You have to be cognizant of the fact that someone else far angrier than you bit their head off 15 minutes prior to you coming in.

I'm just as guilty of going postal on companies when I'm not satisfied with their level of service. My fights on the phone with Ford Motor Company and Verizon Wireless are the stuff legends are made of. I'm sure my calls have been turned into training scenarios for when to deal with a psycho customer.

Having worked customer service, I hate people like myself. If I am in control of my temper and took the time to take a few deep breaths before I call to a company and complain, I can be quite civil and manage to get what I need done. Otherwise, I fly off the handle and not even a freight train colliding with me head on could stop me. Granted, I have found success with my rage. It's been some time since I've used it strategically to get what I want out of a company but that is probably for the best. It isn't a healthy behavior.

If you work, take your hourly salary as what it costs per hour to talk to a company. Think about what you are trying to resolve with said company. In the end, is it worth lodging the complaint and wasting an hour's worth of your salary to resolve? Or, will you get more in return? I won't call anywhere about a mistake less than $25. As soon as you hit $25.01, expect a call from me. If you have to drive anywhere to resolve the problem, consider how much MPG your car gets and the price of fuel. Is it worth your salary + traveling expenses? Probably not.

If we are talking about a cordless landline phone and not a cell phone, wouldn't it perhaps be less expensive to buy a new phone and move on? If it's a cell phone, I wholeheartedly understand. If that's the case, I used to be in the industry for a number of years and have advocated on people's behalf a number of times. If you are willing, I would be more than happy to hear you out about your situation and see if there is anything I could do to help you and advise next steps.

[cashart10]

My rage makes me paranoid. Will the wrong person get a hold of my conversation and think I'm an idiot? Someone I know? I've dwelled on this for hours sometimes, often calling back and asking to speak to the person I'd yelled at only to apologize. It doesn't happen often but it makes me very sick to my stomach when it does happen. I have a lot of trouble forgiving myself and letting things go.

Great and insightful post, neodk. I will post my comment insidei yours, 'n "quotes" I will also try to underline them.

Originally Posted by neodk

Customer Service reps on the phone or employees working the floor of a retail store are directly in the line of fire when it comes to customer complaints. "Oh, I sure do know that." You have to be cognizant of the fact that someone else far angrier than you bit their head off 15 minutes prior to you coming in. "I used to work in customer service, too. I was real good about calming down Callers From Hell, because I know what it's like to be one. Of course I didn't tell them that!"

I'm just as guilty of going postal on companies when I'm not satisfied with their level of service. My fights on the phone with Ford Motor Company and Verizon Wireless are the stuff legends are made of. I've actually gotten a law passed about some of this. True!" I'm sure my calls have been turned into training scenarios for when to deal with a psycho customer.

Having worked customer service, I hate people like myself. If I am in control of my temper and took the time to take a few deep breaths before I call to a company and complain, I can be quite civil and manage to get what I need done. Otherwise, I fly off the handle and not even a freight train colliding with me head on could stop me. Granted, I have found success with my rage. "Hey. When I was in Europe decades ago, when phone service was hard to make to the United States, I had an experience of being rude. The operators there speak probably 5 languages, and so are very important. I tried this tactic that works in the USA, and the operator hung up on me." It's been some time since I've used it strategically to get what I want out of a company but that is probably for the best. It isn't a healthy behavior.

If you work, take your hourly salary as what it costs per hour to talk to a company. Think about what you are trying to resolve with said company. In the end, is it worth lodging the complaint and wasting an hour's worth of your salary to resolve? Or, will you get more in return? I won't call anywhere about a mistake less than $25. As soon as you hit $25.01, expect a call from me. If you have to drive anywhere to resolve the problem, consider how much MPG your car gets and the price of fuel. Is it worth your salary + traveling expenses? Probably not. "Oh, yes -- I definitely TRY to remember to let go of something if it is not worth my time and effort. "

If we are talking about a cordless landline phone and not a cell phone, wouldn't it perhaps be less expensive to buy a new phone and move on? "These are very expensive hand sets and the only ones for people who have mild hearing problems." If it's a cell phone, I wholeheartedly understand. If that's the case, I used to be in the industry for a number of years and have advocated on people's behalf a number of times. If you are willing, I would be more than happy to hear you out about your situation and see if there is anything I could do to help you and advise next steps. "Thanks so much -- I changed companies, and so far so good."

Originally Posted by rwwff

Sympathy about the rage, I did this often enough through most of my life, it was exhausting and occasionally very embarrassing!


I think I'd describe it more along the lines that bipolar alters the anger issue, making its startup so much sharper, and when it ends, so much more exhausting. At least that's how I experienced it. With testosterone deleted though, that whole feedback cycle seems to be severely muted. (progesterone may do a similar trick too though...)

As to business incompetence, it can get pretty bad when you expect a sales person to know and understand what they are selling; but most don't. They know how to operate the register, and maybe the cc machine. If lucky, they'll know where most things are; but knowing whether something is a specific spec, and even WHY it needs to be that way? Not likely.

On NIMH.. they have a lower voltage and higher endurance at that voltage than an alkaline. If a circuit is optimized for NIMH voltage, it either can't work with an alkaline, or it'll drain it in a very short time because it pulls too many (mili)amps through the device at the higher voltage.

Thanks for the good info on the NIMH batteries. As for sales people, I have found "excellent" sales people who sell me something that doesn't work right. They know how to sell!

Originally Posted by Jennifer 1967

To be honest, I don't get angry very often and I'm usually over that in between 15 min -1 hour. I do get impatient a lot though. What can tear me up for long periods of time is getting upset or hurt. I'm working on that. I hope your pdoc gives you a med that helps you. It can't feel good to be so angry. It doesn't to me. Best wishes.

Thanks for the compassion, Jennifer. It sure doesn't feel good, you are so right. I have thought it's like some sort of seizure -- although people who have seizure disorders are not conscious when they have one, I, with bipolar, am definitely conscious, but the rage comes on so suddenly and so emotionally violently that I can't control the beginning, then it escalates.

[luvyrself]

Originally Posted by flowerbells

I cannot tolerate incompetence. I blame the "people at the top" for the incompetence of the low-level employees. Many companies do not train their people. In the 1950s and 1960s, we got paid on-the-job training. Now, the colleges have tricked people into believing that they will learn a trade, and competently handle a new job. This is definitely not true. It's never been true for teachers. I trained as a teacher, and cried every night. I'm told that most beginning teachers cry every night for their first THREE YEARS on the job. I quit - I could not handle public school teaching, which is probably one of the most difficult and stressful occupations anyone could have. The kids are great, but I did not have the opportunity to give them a decent education. Too many interruptions, too much paperwork, and class size getting bigger every year. Some school districts I taught in even had incompetent textbooks! The math book I was assigned to teach from was ridiculous. The principal also required me to teach my 8th graders eighth grade spelling words, even though many of the students did not even spell at 5th grade level.

A therapist told me that therapists go to work after college, and don't know a whole lot about how to do counseling.

Every day now, I wake up happy and pleasant. Then, I encounter something that enrages me. Today, it was that my phone quit. Suffice it to say that the battery type was wrong. Never mind that it'd been working fine for a year. The company told me that it would only use NIMH batteries. I went to a hardware store later in the day. I bought what they told me were NIMH. Dumb me -- I trusted that they knew what t hey were doing. Not! I did not read the package. The package says nowhere on it that they are NIMH. So I called the store and said they were likely not NIMH -- did they know if it said that somewhere on the package? She said, "I just googled it and they are." Google? They are the authorities????? no. I have contacted Energizer. It'll take several days to get response. I think I've found a source at a battery company. I have to make special trip there, and meanwhile my phone still does not work.

I can't tolerate this incompetence and predatory companies. What's going on?? This country is falling apart, because the filthy rich people at the top are preying on everyone else -- their underlings AND their customers. These are usually companies we can't do without -- the phone company, etc. One company overcharged me by $169.50 yesterday. I had to block my credit card and get a new card in a week to 10 days. On and on and on and on. They tried to call the phone number that was presently kaput. I had left them my cell number, but they paid no attention to the rest of m message.

--response
Yesterday, they came with the new frig that cost me about $1000. I was really mad because the 2 delivery men and my husband were crowding around in the tiniest kitchen on earth while I was trying to empty the old frig. I told my husband I was about to blow and they gave me some space. Then they had me look at the new one and there was a very obvious ding on the front and one on the side. OK now, that is truly ridiculous. So now we are waiting for them to call us about another delivery. I agree that customer service is in the toilet.
This morning I had my husband call about getting my dental benefits straightened out. Wow, again everything was all messed up. Whew. I think a lot of this started when everyone was shorthanded from layoffs during the recession, but what's their excuse now.
I have been doing really well on Latuda, but I totally understand why these people push your buttons! People get angry regardless. It's more challenging for us, but this is irritating for all of us. Give yourself a treat today, Flowerbells!

[Nammu]

Bipolar rage is usually connected to a mood state but you say you are just fine until something outside of you pisses you off to the point that you are screaming, yelling, throwing stuff and even pounding your things with a hammer. It's seems that it takes very little to make to go from fine to screaming and that does not suggest bipolar rage but anger management problems. You said you went to one anger management place years ago and it was awful. Perhaps things have changed since then and you could find a place that could help you learn better coping skills. But if the smashing, and screaming work for you then you don't need to . But all your posts here didn't sound like bipolar, they sound like anger management.

[Wild Coyote]

I have great compassion for you, as feeling so enraged so often must feel horrible.

In all honesty, I feel attributing these rages to bipolar illness is further stigmatizing bipolar illness.

I hear people asking if others are bipolar because they fly into rages. The answer is no. That idea is erroneous.

I know several people living with bipolar illness and they do not fly into sudden and repeated rages. It's not a part of their experience.

I agree with Nammu and BioChE, these sudden and repeated rages are much more likely an anger management issue.

Many people fly into rages and they do not live with bipolar illness.

I feel strongly you are doing the entire bipolar community, world-wide, a disservice by attributing your explosive anger to bipolar illness.

That said, I am sorry you suffer these rages. It has to feel horrible to be in the midst of these explosions, and so often. I hope you can find help for this ongoing problem.

(((((( flowerbells ))))))


WC